Single Women Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look

[kmacdonald]

I find Zee's comments very entertaining-----but a bit sad. It's her perception of the world and they were formed by her life experiences. It's unfortunate that they are what they are.
Considering the source of the wild accusations, I am left searching for answers as to there origin.

[zeehag]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

I find Zee's comments very entertaining-----but a bit sad. It's her perception of the world and they were formed by her life experiences. It's unfortunate that they are what they are.
Considering the source of the wild accusations, I am left searching for answers as to there origin.

what i write about is mainly OBSERVATIONAL from over 30 years in nursing critical areas and emergency and police work. as i stated i am trained in sexual assault response. had some fun and unusual hobbies requiring the finer art of observation and reporting back of what occurred with 100 percent accuracy. what do ye think nurse notes are supposed to be.
my life experiences will NEVER be known to you or other online persona. you donot know who i am, what i have done or from where i come unless i spell it out for you, as i donot reveal myself online.
safety measure taught all nurses working in east san jose knife and gun club, aka alexian brothers hospital, east san jose, californicatia.
very few of my in person friends know me, as well. i must have, as does boaty, a feeling for friendship with someone. one is very lucky if one has as many true friends as fingers on one hand.
i am very aware of my surroundings so i am able to best survive, and survival is comfort and optimal freedom.
all, always, never, none. nonexistent entities. donot exist. same as normal. also does not exist.

if ye gotta be someone, be in right place at right time... hahaha story of my life, so far. some planned most spontaneous. it continues same way. donot feel sorry for me, feel pity for yourself.
my life rocks.
has since i was born.
projection of yourself doesnot allow you to learn about anyone else. is major tool of the distancing game.
never studied psych? philosophy? how can anyone entertain the idea of self improvement or even relating with another without learning something about that facet of life and living.
how can anyone say they know self without knowing how to squelch a psych game. how does one assess people and conditions in emergency situations. must be able to sift thru flypoop and find the pepper. is 100 percent observation. unemotional and unbiased observation.
only then can an individual know another.
life rocks. itis sifting the truth from fiction that is entertainment.

[kmacdonald]

Thanks for making that crystal clear Zee.

[zeehag]

ps i donot accuse . i speak reality., if shoe fits, is yours, keep it to yourself, as i speak and write observations of actual behavior without games nor emotion in my words. i see the games in yours. try to learn to be observant not subjective.
subjective is opinion based not reality based and thereby warps ones sense of what is actually occurring. for every one reality there are 11 falsehoods invented by subjectifying the object of the observed situation.
i feel sad for you as you project onto me your insecurities and affects. not real. be objective, not subjective. bet ye cannot repeat a sentence spoken to you without making changes before repeating to the next one.
this is part of a testing tool. remember i find the pepper.
and never forget that subjectivity is opinion not fact based.

[BillsWife1]

Originally Posted by zeehag

i choose to remain away from most others. my choice.
am done with cretins and balderdash. cannot tolerate hypocrites liars cheats and scam artists. met many in my different modes of gypsying in my life. i donot need the crap spewed by others to junk up my lifestyle.


personally, i meet as many folks as possible, however, the truism is real.... the men out cruising solo are
married
players--married or not
child molesters
stalkers
other criminals.

Unfortunately ZeeHag when you contradict yourself, you lose credibility. Do you "remain away" or "meet as many folks"?

As to credibility, I can not find any empirical research or statistics on your claim that states there is a high rate of child molesters living aboard or cruising. I find this to be an incredibly alarming and offensive statement. Could you please provide the factual basis of this claim. I am very curious to explore this topic as I move on to my boat. It will be most helpful in evaluating where I choose to stay.

[jlcnuke]

I think if a man had spoken of female cruisers in the way some have spoken of male cruisers (i.e. first projecting they were all the least desirable types of their gender then mentioning off-handedly that some were probably alright people too) that there wouldn't be a woman that wasn't offended. Replace "men" with "women" and swap out for other negative gender stereotypes as necessary in the following and it 'could' be someone's personal perceptions, but it would still be rather shitty to try and say it was representative of their gender and definitely would offend most of the people of that gender (and a good number of those from the opposite gender I'd bet).

the men out cruising solo are
married
players--married or not
child molesters
stalkers
other criminals.

for instance:

the women out cruising solo are
married
sluts--married or not
sexual predators
stalkers
other criminals...oh, and some are okay....

Now, I'm 99% positive that someone out there may think such things, but I'm also 99% positive that the overwhelming majority of single people (sailing or not) of either gender don't fit into the negative labels that such drivel appears to try and put them into. It's sad that anyone thinks such descriptions are accurate over such a wide array of different people.

[weavis]

TO get the thread where is should be.

A question for the women. Which type of vessel do you prefer.?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2axBIjijd8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5c1J7QnoeNc

[zeehag]

Originally Posted by BillsWife1

Unfortunately ZeeHag when you contradict yourself, you lose credibility. Do you "remain away" or "meet as many folks"?

As to credibility, I can not find any empirical research or statistics on your claim that states there is a high rate of child molesters living aboard or cruising. I find this to be an incredibly alarming and offensive statement. Could you please provide the factual basis of this claim. I am very curious to explore this topic as I move on to my boat. It will be most helpful in evaluating where I choose to stay.

meeting EVERYBODY on planet being IMPOSSiBLE, there is actually no contradiction in my words. te read em .. all of em. donot leave One out.

[zengirl]

Originally Posted by weavis

Have you thought about changing locations or seeing a therapist? I take strong exception to your blanket statement regarding solo male sailors, so much so that you actually have made me angry with your blatant lies regarding me and other solo sailors.

I am not a player.
I am not a child molester
I am not a stalker.
I am not a criminal.

I expect an apology forthwith.

She isn't accusing...just stating facts. Read the second line from the end.
I also think because you are not a women, you don't come up against the players or stalkers. The sailing community is no different than other groups, there is good and bad in all.

[zeehag]

Originally Posted by zengirl

She isn't accusing...just stating facts. Read the second line from the end.
I also think because you are not a women, you don't come up against the players or stalkers. The sailing community is no different than other groups, there is good and bad in all.

exactly.
many donot bother to read .. they see a few words and presume, project and bully. is a game. their bad. not mine.

[kmacdonald]

Originally Posted by zeehag

exactly.
many donot bother to read .. they see a few words and presume, project and bully. is a game. their bad. not mine.

Must be the land dwellers.
How's happy hour going?

[BrightSEALAB]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

I find Zee's comments very entertaining-----but a bit sad. It's her perception of the world and they were formed by her life experiences. It's unfortunate that they are what they are.
Considering the source of the wild accusations, I am left searching for answers as to there origin.

As a 43 yr old very white, happily married (for 19 yrs now) male father of 2, I'm pretty much with Zee on this one.

When I see a solo woman excelling at something in a traditionally male dominated environment I am in awe of that achievement and personally thankful for the example she presents to my children (one son, one daughter). An example that will hopefully shape their generation and work to make it the norm and not a novelty.

Awe, because we tolerate a culture in which solo women are afraid to do the most basic things like walk home; and then we rationalize why we do not see more of them out on their own in the marinas and on the open waters. This is not opinion. This is objective fact. I can count the number of times I have been afraid of actually being assaulted without dipping into double digit numbers; My wife, ex girlfriends, female relatives can rattle off as many occasions within the last few months or so. Whatever the origin of Zee's animus may be, I would wager it is a far more common set of experience than you think.

But, whatever... I'm not about to white-knight this issue just to defend one person's post. This is a great topic and an investigation of the traits common to solo female sailors hooked me from the beginning. Instead we get a post about why they are sometimes reclusive and then 3 pages of offended rebuttals.

Let's look at this controversial opinion being debated now.
Solo guys you meet sailing are either:

1. married
2. players--married or not
3. child molesters
4. stalkers
5. other criminals.
   or
6. really good folks

and "one cannot ASSume the male cruiser is a decent person"

I think this is an accurate assessment. I know I fit at least one of those categories, and I haven't been called decent in decades.

As soon as we accept that the fears women express are real and rational, we might begin to take ownership of the culture that allows it. And then the question of why there aren't more solo women on boats in the marina will become a lot less controversial.

ETA:My wife points out that some people might have a special rejection of the 'child molester' category... Maybe people put off by that are not in Florida. That's my only guess. If you spend enough time in Florida, you come to realize that any collection of reclusive single men set apart from the general flow of humanity is going to house a larger than average percentage of kiddie touchers. Camp grounds, RV parks, 'residential hotels', and ... marinas.

[BillsWife1]

Originally Posted by zeehag

weavis i am not JUST A NURSE i trained well, adding forensics nursing, specifically sexual assault response team nursing, international.
i learned a lot. what i am saying is without feeling inserted, is factual. can be found as public knowledge easily once google is advised of your desires.
i didnot insert "some", is fact, and in my comment.
the original poster asked for TRUTH so, i gave and am dissed for it??
wow.

boaty, you n small boats are mated for life. prolly because you can SAIL. and small boats are fun.

ZeeHag you really did not answer the question I posed. What I am asking you for is what "factual" research you are stating.

I did "advise Google of my desires" to obtain this information as you suggested, to no avail. Perhaps my command of the English language is insufficient and I was not clear enough for Google to understand what I was in search of.

I am relieved that you have not inserted "feeling" into these statements... that would make you sound crazy. I am still deeply concerned with the "fact" that I may inadvertently subject myself to undue danger from predators. I like to be well armed with knowledge based in fact and not feelings or opinions. So once again, please assist me in finding the research and facts of your claim.

[dwedeking2]

Make sure to close up the "Single Men" thread, we know the answer now. Single men aren't going to get a date because we're more than likely sexual criminals 'cause we live on a boat.

[JPA Cate]

Compared to the general population of our countries, it is only a very few who choose to be cruising sailors. So, if one assumes a Bell curve, we are way out at the end.

I am fairly sure there might be some personality disorders out here, BUT we met only one antisocial personality disorder out here, and it was a man. Some men are singlehanders because they prefer their own company, and others are more because women who want to sail are in short supply. The latter group, those who desire female companionship, are often somewhat lonely when you meet them. To me they seem to have been holding in everything for lack of someone to have already shared it with. Singlehanding will not suit all personalities.

The younger and more physically attractive women singlehanders generally have to plow through all the usual male prejudices, and then are pretty well accepted in their home environment. Maybe especially so in the US, where some men have expectations that women will be capable of doing what they set their minds to. We see many gender mixed racing crews, where it used to be all men.

For the woman, it is mostly about how to keep herself safe, and especially so, when she is in a foreign culture, where the rules are different. Most places do not prohibit men from taking advantage of women, nor women from doing the other. I think it is a lot harder for men to see women's side of these issues than when the shoe is on the other foot, but I am not sure why, what I think it is, is that thousands of years of patriarchal societies inform their thought.

At any rate, societies are always changing, and to the man who wrote that he hoped he'd get good stuff for his daughter from this thread, I'm sorry it didn't work out that way, and it might in another 50 years or so, but only if this awkward practice of gaining almost-equality works out. Progress is so uneven. I know the first female ever granted an American Motorcyle Association Mechanics License. This happened in the late 1980's. Progress is uneven, and seems slow.

Women (and men) both need to learn to have realistic expectations of each others' behavior, and to be really clear about what is okay for them in a relationship. And, sometimes, the decision will be to be unpartnered, because it is a lot of work, to be a good partner. This holds for all genders. Lots of reasons for this, a lot of it is do to with how they were parented, how they were raised, as does men's behaviors.

This may sound strange, but I actually think "equality" is impossible: we are too different to ever be "equal". I personally would accept "parity", equal pay for equal work. But still, there will be the scary dangers from some men towards some women for women to worry about: we are the ones who are penetrated, we are the ones who bear the children. Absent weapons, we are more likely to be the one beaten up, and we gotta figure out how to get along in the world, trying to be ourselves, instead of what someone else wants us to be, and taking responsibility for our thoughts, words, and deeds. The search takes some of us down wrong roads, but it's all part of life.

When zee writes about learning to observe, learning to see what is, not what you expect, not what might be there, but what actually is, she is so utterly correct! That is one good starting point, and it applies to looking within yourself, as well as outside, at the world. Fortunately, it is something that all genders can learn to do, with application, and trial and error.

Life is harder for a woman who is single, in some ways. I know I am protected by Jim, cared for by him. If you're alone, it's all on you, and whatever your support system may be.

Ann