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26-10-2017, 08:55
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#886
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cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2017
Boat: Retired from CF
Posts: 13,317
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Many people get entertainment and stimulation from what others see as unnecessary conflict.
A rewarding sex life for everyone concerned helps keep emotions in harmony.
In an enlightened relationship that doesn't need to be limited to those at the center of the long-term partnership.
I think monogamy is completely unrealistic for most healthy humans. Unfortunately most people have been brainwashed so that the myriad solutions to these problems are beyond the pale, taboo from even abstract discussion.
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26-10-2017, 09:14
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#887
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Huntington NY
Boat: Tartan 3000
Posts: 357
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by brownoarsman
Stu's point is that the average $106k could be 9 families making zero and one family making $1,060,000, or ten families making $106k each. Same average, very different median and modal statistics, and very different results depending on how many doors you knock on.
Similarly, while every female doctor you meet may be making the same as every male doctor, this doesn't take into account the large number of female nurses, who themselves may have chosen to be doctors (and so earn more) if it were not for the commitments of motherhood, societal expectations, etc.
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...... the large number of female nurses, who themselves may have chosen to be doctors .... but didn't
Nothing similar there at all
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26-10-2017, 09:30
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#888
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Huntington NY
Boat: Tartan 3000
Posts: 357
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier
"Anyone other than a white male makes less in the same job" quote.
There's a big absolute statement!
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In my own experience working at Dupont Chemical Plant @1980s women engineers were paid more than male engineers. The single black engineer was paid more still.
Whenever I read about women making less it is never for the exact same job. Women have more opportunities now than ever before.
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26-10-2017, 09:55
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#889
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: forest city
Boat: no boat any more
Posts: 2,510
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
"Women have more opportunities now than ever before."
....says it all...."before" they were the chattels of men...& this "before" was only 50. 60 years ago in the "humanistic" worldsphere, & is "present" in a large proportion of the world today ("islamic" world...)
__________________
...not all who wander are lost!
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26-10-2017, 12:27
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#890
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by john61ct
Many people get entertainment and stimulation from what others see as unnecessary conflict.
A rewarding sex life for everyone concerned helps keep emotions in harmony.
In an enlightened relationship that doesn't need to be limited to those at the center of the long-term partnership.
I think monogamy is completely unrealistic for most healthy humans. Unfortunately most people have been brainwashed so that the myriad solutions to these problems are beyond the pale, taboo from even abstract discussion.
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More than a little presumptuous to say that your way is "enlightened," and traditional monogamy is the result of being "brainwashed," no? Nothing wrong in my mind with however consenting adults want to arrange things, but for a lot of people sex = emotional intimacy and monogamy is an essential part of preserving that.
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26-10-2017, 12:29
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#891
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by double u
"Women have more opportunities now than ever before."
....says it all...."before" they were the chattels of men...& this "before" was only 50. 60 years ago in the "humanistic" worldsphere, & is "present" in a large proportion of the world today ("islamic" world...)
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In other words, progress has been made (at least in the western world).
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26-10-2017, 12:31
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#892
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,607
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
It's easy when it's right. It's not just hard when it's wrong, it's impossible.
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Probably obvious to most, but I'm a slow learner. I'm going to remember that!
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26-10-2017, 13:53
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#893
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Huntington NY
Boat: Tartan 3000
Posts: 357
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by john61ct
In an enlightened relationship that doesn't need to be limited to those at the center of the long-term partnership.
I think monogamy is completely unrealistic for most healthy humans. Unfortunately most people have been brainwashed so that the myriad solutions to these problems are beyond the pale, taboo from even abstract discussion.
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I agree with much of what you said. Would be surprised if it was adopted by a major political party though.
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26-10-2017, 20:09
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#894
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
First hit on Google
"It might be a treasured value in many human cultures, but*monogamy*is rare in the animal kingdom at large. Of the roughly 5,000 species of*mammals, only 3 to 5 percent are known to form lifelong pair bonds. This select group includes beavers, otters, wolves, some bats and foxes and a few hoofed animals.Nov 20, 2006
And from what I've read monogamous for the 3-5% doesn't actually mean the animals are sexully faithful to their mates, just that they stay with them!
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26-10-2017, 20:11
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#895
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: San Francisco Bay area
Boat: Condor Trimaran 30 foot
Posts: 1,501
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Wifey B, enjoy reading your remarks because u r a woman in a good relationship. You mentioned that statistics don't lie. Ah, I would agree with u wholeheartedly normally. But what if the statistics r skewed for the publishing source to embellish their agenda... whatever that goal might be... political... financial... demographics... etc
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26-10-2017, 20:13
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#896
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by double u
"Women have more opportunities now than ever before."
....says it all...."before" they were the chattels of men...& this "before" was only 50. 60 years ago in the "humanistic" worldsphere, & is "present" in a large proportion of the world today ("islamic" world...)
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Didn't know we were talking about the past, and I don't think anyone here would argue with you regarding parts of the Islamic world BUT we aren't talking about that either.
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26-10-2017, 20:53
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#897
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Casco Bay, ME and the Philippines
Boat: '90 Jeanneau Voyage 12.5
Posts: 59
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier
First hit on Google
"It might be a treasured value in many human cultures, but*monogamy*is rare in the animal kingdom at large. Of the roughly 5,000 species of*mammals, only 3 to 5 percent are known to form lifelong pair bonds. This select group includes beavers, otters, wolves, some bats and foxes and a few hoofed animals.Nov 20, 2006
And from what I've read monogamous for the 3-5% doesn't actually mean the animals are sexully faithful to their mates, just that they stay with them!
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True, but it's also called "naturalistic fallacy" in terms of logic and reasoning when positing one vs another. In keeping with that, I don't think any other species pays much attention to sexual consent, age of consent, the ethicacy of killing, etc, etc... For better or worse, human behavior in tightly coupled with society and it's evolution.
Perhaps it's best to just leave it as we each are empowered to make our own decisions and live with the consequences of such.
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26-10-2017, 20:59
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#898
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandrunner
True, but it's also called "naturalistic fallacy" in terms of logic and reasoning when positing one vs another. In keeping with that, I don't think any other species pays much attention to sexual consent, age of consent, the ethicity of killing, etc, etc... For better or worse, human behavior in tightly coupled with society and it's evolution.
Perhaps it's best to just leave it as we each are empowered to make our own decisions and live with the consequences of such.
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Good point.
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26-10-2017, 23:29
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#899
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Australia
Boat: Catalina 470
Posts: 4,578
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandrunner
True, but it's also called "naturalistic fallacy" in terms of logic and reasoning when positing one vs another. In keeping with that, I don't think any other species pays much attention to sexual consent, age of consent, the ethicacy of killing, etc, etc... For better or worse, human behavior in tightly coupled with society and it's evolution.
Perhaps it's best to just leave it as we each are empowered to make our own decisions and live with the consequences of such.
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The more I think, regarding "naturalistic fallacy" the deeper down the rabbit hole I go. Monogamy should be practiced based on morality and ethics although its not natural in most of the animal kingdom yet homosexuality is ok because it's quite natural? Not sure I worded that right?
No judgement here, just opening a can of worms, and probably way to far outside the perimeters of this discussion.
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26-10-2017, 23:50
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#900
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CF Adviser
Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 10,280
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Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier
The more I think, regarding "naturalistic fallacy" the deeper down the rabbit hole I go. Monogamy should be practiced based on morality and ethics although its not natural in most of the animal kingdom yet homosexuality is ok because it's quite natural? Not sure I worded that right?
No judgement here, just opening a can of worms, and probably way to far outside the perimeters of this discussion.
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I think this is a fun can of worms Dale
maybe we should re-spell it
"naturalistic phallusy".
For the record, there are many examples of male on male in the animal kingdom, so all rainbows are part of the monogamy discussion
I for one think that ethics has nothing to do with Monogamy.
It is all about expectations.
If two people agree to Monogamy and one lies or cheats, the ethics part is in the lying.
However if they for whatever reason, freely agree to have sex with others, then that is their business.
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