Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 10-01-2018, 16:44   #1606
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Alaska
Boat: 1989 Catalina 36
Posts: 236
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exile View Post
Hmmmm . . . it sounds to me like it's your own "privilege" and that of your relatively affluent, professional Asian women friends which may be giving rise to your assumptions & skewing your conclusions.



As Cyan pointed out, perhaps greasy for you but probably not the actual couple in question. Is there actual coercion, abuse, misogyny, etc. going on in a large proportion of these relationships or is it more about your personal disapproval? And again, aren't these relationships actually more honest in terms of what each partner can expect than some of the abusive & oppressive relationships being complained about in this thread amongst western couples? And why do you apparently approve of a relationship that you acknowledge is better for a privileged Asian woman, but would deny to a poor Asian woman with far fewer choices?

Your approach kinda reminds me of people in my city who have the affluence to shop only at Whole Foods, but are the same ones who protest the loudest against the Walmart at the other end of town.
Different ends of the spectrum. You seem to think because a country is beautiful, it cannot be another. Or that if one Western man is behaving badly, all Western men are behaving badly. That is as sigificant a fallacy as thinking all Asian men are domineering, or all Muslims are terrorists. In general, Western cultures provide women a great deal freedom in recent years. Not perfect equality, obviously. It would be difficult to get to perfect equality. One does not undo millenia in fifty years. But enough to be better off as a woman than we've ever been. [Yes, I am female].

You have to know, and deliberately pretend not to, that as a result,
most Western men, regardless of political affiliation, are conditioned to see women as approximately equal. The demographic I dislike is not representative of the majority, though it is still a distressingly large minority.

When a heterosexual woman who has obtained an education showing her that equality is hers whether or not the legal system says so, then gets in relationships, is she going to be happy with someone who doesn't see her as an equal? Generally no. Depending on her country of origin, she may find her Western education makes her more compatible with other people with Western educations. Does this mean she'd date the kind of sexual tourists who go to Malaysia? Umm. No. Different wants and needs.

As to coercion...poverty and repression is the ultimate cocktail of osmotic coercion. What, exactly, in this hypothetical scenario of free will you keep discussing for the poor woman in a poor country, are this hypothetic woman's other choices? Functionally, she has none. Her best option in life is to sell herself.

I do not object to her choices. I object to the men who practice sexual tourism to take advantage of aforesaid osmotic pressure. They let economic and social pressures and her own desperation or ambition work so as to grant themselves lily white hands.

I object to the disparity in wealth.

I also object to the notion that women's legal equality somehow threatens the value of a culture that heretofore repressed it. You could have (and perhaps would have?) applied that thinking to the cultures of dozens of western countries a hundred years ago. Repression is not a value I support, and a culture is not a stagnant pond.

Look, you'll think what you'll think. I am free to think it's bullsh%t. I just wanted to make sure a female with adequate inside knowledge of the practices involving mail order brides, access to details from the trenches of the sex trade, a decent background in international politics and history, and a decent travel record came on here and posted some of her thinking.

Will what I've said persuade you? I don't care. I just care my voice (or the voice of someone like me) is also represented on what is, mindbogglingly, one of the most popular threads on Cruisers Forum.

I am no more representative of my gender than any one reader is of theirs. But I am not dissimilar. In my motivations, desires, and needs, I bear as much resemblance to the woman in Bangkok looking for a husband to pull her out of poverty as to the network news producer in Hong Kong. I hope the woman in poverty succeeds. I hope she is happy. I hope her kids get everything she never had. I also hope we continue to work to build a world within the next few generations in which she can achieve all that without having to play the part of the grateful stray.

And now, my husband and I are sewing boat cushions.
__________________
…being able to swim in the deep sea; and having a home that's a shell…

turtletraveling.com
Meanderthal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 17:16   #1607
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Alaska
Boat: 1989 Catalina 36
Posts: 236
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyan View Post
Objective. That is the certainly the key. You did a great job in voicing the concerns of the patronizing Western society. I'm calling that subjective.

"Culturally submissive" is a phrase that YOU happened to use. That sums up your misunderstanding in so many ways. I won't go into how wrong and insulting that is. For a very good reason, you are projecting the grease that you know (Filipina mail order bride situation) into my discussion of happy couples that I find: ex-pats and their local women. YES. Yes, I am assuming a well-intentioned guy. You know, a benevolent single male cruiser.

Seemingly in your view, the horrible sex trafficking problem in the region is the reason no single Western man should even go near the area. Sure, bad guys should stay away. (Some locals would like the Russians to stay away, but that's another story) I suppose you worry that ALL guys are weak and the "bad girls", as my Thai wife would call them, are going to corrupt them. Fair enough.

Please understand that you bring lot of Western patronizing with your views. So did Hillary Clinton, when she went on her fight against Human Trafficking as US Secretary of State with all the good will of Nancy Reagan in the Just Say No campaign. Lord, we all want the trafficking to stop, right? Well, more understanding of the whole problem is a good start. The unintended consequences of corruption fueled by well-meaning American foreign aid is wide spread.

Years ago, I was living with my Filipina GF's family for quite some time on the coast in a tiny village in Samar. They were self-sufficient, happy, and peso-less. They didn't NEED money- plenty of fish, local fruit, fresh water, cinderblock huts.(trading extra fish for rice) There was no misogyny to be seen, as the women seemed to be in charge and the men were happy to hang together on their fishing trips. Laughter was constant, and the smiles of the children and the jungle karaoke filled the atmosphere.

I saw the results of trafficking. The real stuff. There were girls who were tricked into lucrative "housekeeper" jobs in the mid-East, passports then taken, and forced into prostitution. Horrible stuff. Like you, I hope it can be stopped.

I saw the results of Western ignorance as well. My GF's cousin came home to the village for the holidays, from a job in the big city. Jenevic was 23 and very proud of her ability to bring a big bag of rice home. She had nicer clothes than her cousins, and was respected and adored. A hero's welcome. After the big welcome home feast, my GF asked me for something she had never asked before. Money. her cousin, Jenevic, needed money to "fix a toothache". $600 later, she received an entire NEW tooth and what would have been about $6000 work in the US.

Jenevic came home for the holidays without a tooth . Let me back up. At 23, she was a bar girl, earning money for sex. I never gave any condemnation, I just listened. She proudly bounced between bars to better her situation, working only when she wanted, leaving behind mommies (mamasans) who were too controlling. She seemed proud and in charge of her own body. Maybe face-saving good spin? Sure. Still, she was proud until the day she lost her tooth.

It was near the holidays, and she said this was the danger time. The police needed money for Christmas shopping. One day she was hearded out of her bar and into a jeepney by guys with AK47s and badges. She was handed papers to sign, confessing that she was 17 years old. Genevic refused and was hit by the butt of a big gun. She finally signed the phony document after losing a tooth, and all of her money.

There were feel-good headlines in the Manila Times that month about the Rescued Victims of Trafficking. Underaged. Rescued. Yay America. We done good. We can take the Phils off the Tier 2 list now.
I felt a bit greasy that Christmas. I hoped that my patronizing tax money actually helped some of those other Pinays who were stuck in the Emirates without a passport. Dunno.

Like you, I do try to be objective. I also have years of colorful travels and first hand observations that could cause you to question your own assumptions if your objectivity is honest. Your use of terms like "mail order bride" suggest that this process may only beginning.

My initial assertions stand. There are beautiful reasons for a single Western male cruiser to experience the culture of SE Asia. Because you have heard of some dark things to avoid is no reason to stamp this opinion with your own prejudices. See?
I read the whole thing, and I'm still confused. Where did I say Western men shouldn't go to Asia?

I said Western men who go specifically to trade their relative affluence for sexual favors are greasy. And that the lack of access to educational and viable economic alternatives for women in the area that makes this practice possible is repugnant.

I'm not sure why I have to describe once again that life and everything within it, is a world of greys. On the most innocuous end, and the most likely we are to encounter, mail order brides. Essentially the most benign-- and potentially beneficial for the woman--sexual transaction. And yet, I have access to that world, and familiarity with the statistics. They are battered, raped, and abused far more than the general population of their host country.

At the other end, the worst of the worst of sex trafficking. The one my friend sees daily. He loves Thailand. He hates the enslavement and rape of women and children for profit. Your 'bouncy' friend is an anecdote, but as an anecdote, irrelevant.

Yeah, I'm Western. I am happy with the level of economic and social opportunity I am afforded relative to other areas of the world. Your implication that my argument that women should have access to economic and social equality so that if they make the sexual transaction it is of their own free will, is somehow a Westerner trampling on the delicate flowers of foreign culture is...astonishing.

The real implication is you want to pay walmart prices for a woman, who if free to trade her favors on an open and fair market, would be quite far out of your reach.
__________________
…being able to swim in the deep sea; and having a home that's a shell…

turtletraveling.com
Meanderthal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 17:28   #1608
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,535
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meanderthal View Post

And now, my husband and I are sewing boat cushions.
Very nice, heartfelt speech Meanderthal, but do you really think reducing the discussion down to the lowest denominator of Sexual tourists and a poor girl adds any value to understanding the dynamics of human feelings and relationships?

Is a poor uneducated Asian girl incapable of genuinely loving a nice foreign guy whose relative wealth and sophistication far exceeds her?

Conversely, can the foreign guy look past the cultural and economic differences and see a person with whom he wishes to commit to a deep and monogamous relationship with?

How many on here started out very poor in an industrial society and can remember going to bed, cold and hungry?

Do you think that perhaps that empathy for those less fortunate, may have some bearing on finding a kindred spirit who does not feel entitled,
.......just lucky to be alive!
Pelagic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:12   #1609
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Paradise
Boat: Various
Posts: 2,430
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.



Wifey B: A lot of truth in that one thought, "Looking for Love in All the Wrong Places." In fact, I think people work too hard looking for a mate. They focus so on that one concept they miss the world and many good people passing them by. My hubby and I were neither looking for a mate the night we met. In fact, we both were convinced we'd never find one. We have friends who met completely by chance. Plus there's so much to enjoy with friends if you make them without them being your future mate. People go on a date thinking marriage instead of just going to enjoy the meal or movie or whatever. We put pressure and expectations instead of just letting it come to us.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:13   #1610
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Alaska
Boat: 1989 Catalina 36
Posts: 236
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Pelagic,

I've a great deal of respect for you, based on what I've seen of you on Cruisers Forum. I do not confuse that respect with assuming you have equal viewpoints as my own. Or that you wanted to wade through the several posts I've made on this thread.

In the first post yesterday, I acknowledged that unequal alliances can be stable, even involve love.

I just don't think they are truly as frequent as the men commenting seem to believe. Nor do I believe such fairy tale endings happen as frequently as respondents to my post seem to think, in the demographic of men who specifically 'shop' in asia for helpmeets.

We have both encountered positive and negative anecdotes of such helpmeet arrangements, but my dislike of the fundamentals of the arrangement are because I believe such decisions should be made free of coercion, and I believe even the best of the men who go with this mindset know the women are NOT free of coercion--the men themselves just don't have to apply it. They can let social and economic forces work.


Moreover, I am aware of the other end of the spectrum, which is the abuses practiced by a significant minority of men in the same demographic: those who 'shop' in disadvantaged countries.

When I have expanded comment on the worst abuses (which, whether you like the comparison or not, are drawn from the same demographic I have described) of the sex trade, and the social and economic inequalities facing the women of such regions, it has been in response to blatant whitewashing. Several respondents (all of them, I think) have implied or openly stated, even, that because they have met one of the stable configurations, that no bad ones happen, and skipped lightly aka completely over the abuse statistics for mail order brides in the US (for example). One response implied because Thailand is beautiful and fun, it must not have a sex trafficking problem. Several suggested the Western man an educated and prosperous Hong Kong news producer would marry is from the same demographic as a Western man who comes to asia specifically for a certain type of woman. As if all Western men are the same. And the universal response seems to be i 'just don't understand.'

Ricockulous!

All transactions, including those of love, are best on an open and fair market. When the market is corrupted, none of us know the characteristics of the contract any more, or the extent of the corruption. Does the man have traits we don't see, which should concern us? Is she free to leave?

This suspicion will always linger, any place coercion is involved.
__________________
…being able to swim in the deep sea; and having a home that's a shell…

turtletraveling.com
Meanderthal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:30   #1611
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,535
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
We put pressure and expectations instead of just letting it come to us.
Amen...... I have heard so many people reflect that it was only after they gave up and stopped looking that they happened to meet their future partner.
Pelagic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:31   #1612
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,038
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meanderthal View Post
I read the whole thing, and I'm still confused. Where did I say Western men shouldn't go to Asia?

I said Western men who go specifically to trade their relative affluence for sexual favors are greasy. And that the lack of access to educational and viable economic alternatives for women in the area that makes this practice possible is repugnant.

I'm not sure why I have to describe once again that life and everything within it, is a world of greys. On the most innocuous end, and the most likely we are to encounter, mail order brides. Essentially the most benign-- and potentially beneficial for the woman--sexual transaction. And yet, I have access to that world, and familiarity with the statistics. They are battered, raped, and abused far more than the general population of their host country.

At the other end, the worst of the worst of sex trafficking. The one my friend sees daily. He loves Thailand. He hates the enslavement and rape of women and children for profit. Your 'bouncy' friend is an anecdote, but as an anecdote, irrelevant.

Yeah, I'm Western. I am happy with the level of economic and social opportunity I am afforded relative to other areas of the world. Your implication that my argument that women should have access to economic and social equality so that if they make the sexual transaction it is of their own free will, is somehow a Westerner trampling on the delicate flowers of foreign culture is...astonishing.

The real implication is you want to pay walmart prices for a woman, who if free to trade her favors on an open and fair market, would be quite far out of your reach.
Well, no.

You glossed over my first-hand anecdotes as irrelevant and you consider your second hand rape stories as the STATE of things in Thailand. You completely missed the part where your "misogyny" was entirely missing in the Filipino society in which I LIVED for almost a year.

I really have no problem with your colorful prejudices or your mistaken views about my "implications". Frankly, your mistakes are quite common. You keep repeating tangential cliches but with clever adjectives. I do like your writing style, but I think it means the debate was over a while back.

I'll give a shot at summarizing your view:
Since Asian women are poor and uneducated, Western men are taking advantage of them in all interactions from mail order brides to prostitution. These are all shades of grey, and you really don't like grey.

You may also frown upon the book I'm helping a family friend edit. (English was not her first language). It will be raw and funny, but perhaps a bit disturbing to people like you. She grew up in Thailand but worked for years as a sushi chef in the US. She began keeping a journal of observations after so many funny moments involving "white women" sitting right in front of her. Her perspective is very similar to yours in that it is quite passionate. She feels passionately bad for American women. Her first hand accounts of the way modern Western women disrespect their men and each other are illustrated by these real-life short stories. I cautioned that sushi bar guests are not the perfect slice of society from which to draw conclusions, but her funny stories stand on their own. "Self-absorbed, judgemental, entitled backstabbing divas who belittle their husbands as sport" is sort of a theme. She believes that modern professional woman in the US have collectively sold their soul in some bid for equality, and they just won't admit to their misery.

I'm not sure the book should ever be published, no matter how funny, because a lot of it is just plain mean IMO. The working title? White Women Are Crazy, Confessions of a Female Sushi Chef.

More importantly, how are the cushions going?
Did you use Sunbrella?
I want to do this soon too.
Did you use grey?
(no, really, I'm considering grey)
cyan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:38   #1613
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Huntington NY
Boat: Tartan 3000
Posts: 350
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by double u View Post
...interestingly it is always the OTHER guy/girl that is at fault...
why does nobody blame him/herself for their poor choice of companion/spouse???
maybe a little introspection would help?
particularly people harping about their multiple "bad experiences", disappointments should question their choice of partners! we here in the "west" c h o o s e our partners...
maybe youall complaining about the "golddiggers" have put the emphasis too much on flashy looks???
...but what do I know after 40 happy years (& still going!) & 6-digit nm with the same woman...
Respectfully, I would say that adds up to very little experience with golddigging women or women generally.
Larry Florida is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 19:39   #1614
Registered User
 
Exile's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Land of Disenchantment
Boat: Bristol 47.7
Posts: 5,170
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meanderthal View Post
Different ends of the spectrum. You seem to think because a country is beautiful, it cannot be another. Or that if one Western man is behaving badly, all Western men are behaving badly. That is as sigificant a fallacy as thinking all Asian men are domineering, or all Muslims are terrorists. In general, Western cultures provide women a great deal freedom in recent years. Not perfect equality, obviously. It would be difficult to get to perfect equality. One does not undo millenia in fifty years. But enough to be better off as a woman than we've ever been. [Yes, I am female].

Maybe you're confusing me with someone else, but I'm not one who favors stereotypes. My comments were only in response to your stated observations from your educated Asian friends who prefer to marry Western men because they believe such men tend to be less misogynistic & domineering than their Asian counterparts. I personally don't know if that's generally true or not, but apparently your female friends who come from that culture believe it to be so. As you may recall, my comment was that this made a lot of sense to me, assuming that their assessment of the men in question was correct of course.

You have to know, and deliberately pretend not to, that as a result,
most Western men, regardless of political affiliation, are conditioned to see women as approximately equal. The demographic I dislike is not representative of the majority, though it is still a distressingly large minority.

I'd go further than that and simply say that most Western men do in fact see women as equals, and believe in the equality of the sexes. I don't think any "conditioning" is required (nor do I understand what that means). Why do you say I'm "deliberately pretending" not to believe this? This is also supported by polling data, but what's curious is that there is a huge gulf between those that believe in gender equality as opposed to those who support or identify as feminists, and that gap bridges politics & gender. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...n_3094917.html

When a heterosexual woman who has obtained an education showing her that equality is hers whether or not the legal system says so, then gets in relationships, is she going to be happy with someone who doesn't see her as an equal? Generally no. Depending on her country of origin, she may find her Western education makes her more compatible with other people with Western educations. Does this mean she'd date the kind of sexual tourists who go to Malaysia? Umm. No. Different wants and needs.

Agreed. But then most would not want to be with someone who didn't treat them as an equal, whether educated or not. The problem here is that not everyone shares your particular definition of equality. But what does the issue of finding a compatible long-term relationship partner have to do with men traveling to Asian countries purely for sex?? Nobody is arguing with you about the horrors of the sex trade.

As to coercion...poverty and repression is the ultimate cocktail of osmotic coercion. What, exactly, in this hypothetical scenario of free will you keep discussing for the poor woman in a poor country, are this hypothetic woman's other choices? Functionally, she has none. Her best option in life is to sell herself.

"Osmotic coercion?" Uh-Oh . . . I'm going to have to ask John61 for help with this one. Why do you equate an Asian woman -- poor, affluent, educated or not -- hooking up with a Western guy for "living & cruising onboard" (i.e. long-term, marriage, etc.) with "selling herself." And are you not aware that such comments are likely insulting to several, presumably respectable guys participating in this thread who have Asian wives?

I do not object to her choices.

Of course you do, but apparently it's OK for more educated & affluent Asian women, just not the poor ones.

I object to the men who practice sexual tourism to take advantage of aforesaid osmotic pressure.

Congrats, but I suspect most everyone else on this thread does too.

They let economic and social pressures and her own desperation or ambition work so as to grant themselves lily white hands.

I sorta doubt that men who engage in the sex trade believe in their own "innocence," or more to the point could care less.

I object to the disparity in wealth.

So do something about it, donate whatever money you have proportionately to those who have less. After all, that's what many respectable Western men who marry poor Asian women are doing. And as is the custom in many cases, these men are also willingly supporting their wives' families. Now tell us again where the osmotic repression & cultural power imbalances are in these types of marriages? Does it exist? Of course it does. But maybe it's more a function of a particular guy's own character than a systemic problem. My information is only anecdotal, but then so is yours.

I also object to the notion that women's legal equality somehow threatens the value of a culture that heretofore repressed it. You could have (and perhaps would have?) applied that thinking to the cultures of dozens of western countries a hundred years ago. Repression is not a value I support, and a culture is not a stagnant pond.

Most around here would agree with this too, at least in the abstract. But you're sounding awfully presumptuous in that you have the correct prescription for other cultures & peoples. Objectivity requires more knowledge & insight than it sounds like you've garnered thus far. For starters it would be helpful if you didn't suggest that someone who challenges your opinions supports the "repression" of gender equality.

Look, you'll think what you'll think. I am free to think it's bullsh%t. I just wanted to make sure a female with adequate inside knowledge of the practices involving mail order brides, access to details from the trenches of the sex trade, a decent background in international politics and history, and a decent travel record came on here and posted some of her thinking.

Except nobody was talking about "mail order brides" or using the sex trade in Asian countries to find suitable partners. And you may want to try & actually understand what I think before calling it "bullsh%t". Not an effective way of making friends & influencing people . . . .

Will what I've said persuade you? I don't care. I just care my voice (or the voice of someone like me) is also represented on what is, mindbogglingly, one of the most popular threads on Cruisers Forum.

So you'd rather just shout rather than discuss?? I'm not clear on what you're trying to persuade me or anyone else about. I've never dated or married an Asian woman, am not "shopping" for one, and have no interest in any nefarious sex trade in my country or abroad. But I have heard from a number of Western men, incl. several on CF, who sing the praises of their Asian wives. It's nice to hear and I'm happy for them, and hope their wives are equally content.

I am no more representative of my gender than any one reader is of theirs. But I am not dissimilar. In my motivations, desires, and needs, I bear as much resemblance to the woman in Bangkok looking for a husband to pull her out of poverty as to the network news producer in Hong Kong. I hope the woman in poverty succeeds. I hope she is happy. I hope her kids get everything she never had. I also hope we continue to work to build a world within the next few generations in which she can achieve all that without having to play the part of the grateful stray.

Which one of the many types of women being discussed plays that part?

And now, my husband and I are sewing boat cushions.
Ah-Ha! Now I know what you meant about "perfect equality!"
Exile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 20:09   #1615
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,535
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meanderthal View Post

Several respondents (all of them, I think) have implied or openly stated, even, that because they have met one of the stable configurations, that no bad ones happen, and skipped lightly aka completely over the abuse statistics for mail order brides in the US (for example).

......This suspicion will always linger, any place coercion is involved.
Hi Meanderthal,
I actually agree with your observations and assessment of the moral dangers of becoming involved with Asian women who are more vulnerable to coercion..

I do not agree that those of us who have successfully found an Asian partner, ....that we are not aware of the horrible male predators who victimize those same woman and ignore it.

If you live in Asia, you see all kinds of horrible crimes against human dignity and rights. Its frequency does not dull the pain and shame with which I view the worst of humanity (both Male and Female enablers)

But, if you happen to be a good person, all you can do is to create a safe and secure bubble around you and your loved one and be proactive in empowering them to become stronger and more self assured.

I guess, not unlike the early days of interracial couples in the mid 1900‘s there was all kinds of well meaning advice but that was from people who really did not feel the love, share the fears, become amazed by their partners depth of love and resilience and committed to them despite all the slewd criticism of that time.

Yes, you can focus on the Slime, but their lonely ending is already preordained.

All i ask is that you temper your suspicion with a commitment to be more objective with those who have found an Asian partner and appear to treat them with the same love and respect you would expect from your own husband.
Pelagic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 22:02   #1616
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Huntington NY
Boat: Tartan 3000
Posts: 350
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
Hi Meanderthal,
I actually agree with your observations and assessment of the moral dangers of becoming involved with Asian women who are more vulnerable to coercion..

I do not agree that those of us who have successfully found an Asian partner, ....that we are not aware of the horrible male predators who victimize those same woman and ignore it.
I take issue with the labels of predator and victims. In 20+ years in southeast Asia, observing hundreds of relationships maybe even thousands long term and short but for sure mostly short, I don't recall one foreigner I would describe as a predator. Very many foreigners were fools when it came to Asian women and were taken advantage of. The naive and vulnerable were primarily western men.

Around 2000 I was a student in a thai language school and would chat with a lady who had a laundry shop in Bangkok. She said western men are very smart about machines, but very stupid about Thai lady. I agree. Most relationships involving a foreigner the woman took advantage of him. As far as Thailand goes without question there are no Thai women who were a victim of any western man. None. Not a living westen man anyway. The internet is awash with info on this subject, many books have been written.
Larry Florida is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 22:18   #1617
Moderator
 
weavis's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK-Mallorca
Posts: 13,278
Send a message via Skype™ to weavis
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

I like Sushi.
__________________
- Never test how deep the water is with both feet -
10% of conflicts are due to different opinions. 90% by the tone of voice.
Raise your words, not your voice. It is rain that grows flowers, not thunder.
weavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 22:30   #1618
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,038
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by weavis View Post
I like Sushi.
Wait. What?
How do you make sushi in an air fryer?
cyan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 22:37   #1619
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,535
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Florida View Post

I take issue with the labels of predator and victims. In 20+ years in southeast Asia, observing hundreds of relationships maybe even thousands long term and short but for sure mostly short, I don't recall one foreigner I would describe as a predator. .
I suggest you may have been wearing rose colored glasses.

https://nypost.com/2017/05/09/suspec...pines-sex-den/

http://www.manilatimes.net/philippin...graphy/267148/
Pelagic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2018, 22:40   #1620
Moderator
 
weavis's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK-Mallorca
Posts: 13,278
Send a message via Skype™ to weavis
Re: Single Men Living Aboard and Cruising... an honest look.

I have always been impressed with the smarts of Filipino women. The ones I know speak multiple languages, have a wonderful pleasant outlook and work hard.
The women I know, look for qualities in a man that they can live with, and despite a low income threshold, will not enter into an arrangement purely for being looked after.
There are others that will. Similar to every country in the world.

The Filipino culture is diverse depending a lot on the religious affiliation. I note most of my friends are Protestant and have a high moral character, attend church and use the family system to safeguard their chastity. Not saying all succeed but they try..

Other races WILL and DO use the economic status of Thailand and the Philippine for their own sexual gratification, but not all men who visit go there to take advantage. I like the culture, I like the beauty of the country and I like the company of intelligent women, It is different to the West. I dont go to the bar scene, prefering local restaurants and the company of my friends and their friends. Perhaps because the group I associate with are of a committed Christian nature, the company feels better and more of a family atmosphere. Im not involved with their church orientation, but respect their stance.

Would I marry a Filipina? yes if all the boxes were checked. I wouldnt feel a transaction had been made, youth for money etc. For me its about the person, the family and the intention. I prefer a mature outlook in a woman and some life experience...

The one thing I THINK I would do, is live in the Islands if I were to commit. My close friend has a business in the UK and a condo in Cebu. three months in Cebu twice a year and 6 months in the UK. His Cebu wife has the best of both worlds.

Love is love and relationships are personal. As long as both are happy... its a win win.
__________________
- Never test how deep the water is with both feet -
10% of conflicts are due to different opinions. 90% by the tone of voice.
Raise your words, not your voice. It is rain that grows flowers, not thunder.
weavis is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cruising, living aboard, men, single

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
All about the Colregs no 3 - single handed sailing and keeping a look out Rustic Charm Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 401 23-02-2021 11:49
Make a Living, Living Aboard JanetGroene Boat Ownership & Making a Living 0 19-11-2010 12:28

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:03.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.