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Old 10-02-2017, 18:26   #526
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

Just for reference and to add some data to this discussion, I've dropped my hook in Richardson Bay maybe 30 times in the last few years. Never had a problem with the hook getting fouled on anything. Also have never hit anything submerged out there in all those times getting in and out of wherever I was dropping the hook at the time.

I've anchored out there for weeks at a time (maybe a total of 2-3 months) in a few years going to a 9-5 job on shore with the dinghy. Set a motion detecting alarm every time that would trip if someone stepper aboard. Never once had it already tripped coming home.

Not saying that absence of evidence is indisputable evidence of absence. Also not saying that I wouldn't love the bay to be cleaned up. Just want to provide some data in juxtaposition to some of the other alarmist views on Richardsons Bay's usability.
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Old 10-02-2017, 20:34   #527
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

If you anchor where I believe you typically do (near the entrance of the bay where the deeper draft, actual cruisers do) I think you're still fine. It's further in where most of the boats have gone down in the past two months. Today I could see two sunk - one powerboat with just the bow sticking out, and a sailboat with just the rig poking out. There was a diver attempting to refloat the power boat.

As for break ins and thefts, I have not heard of problems in the anchorage - they are happening in the marinas. The east side of Schoonmaker has been hit the hardest (not hard to figure out why). SYH has also had numerous problems and so has Bridgeway Marine (where we were robbed a couple years ago). If you doubt what I say, just check. The police and city have stats on waterfront crime rates and are happy to provide it.
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Old 11-02-2017, 03:01   #528
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

Perhaps if the marina's are experiencing theft problems they could rethink their disdain for people living on their boats and learn from other marina and harbor policies? One example of a different approach to people choosing to live on their boats is the policy adopted by the Port of Friday Harbor Marina which defines living aboard as 15 of 30 days in a given month and expressly allows 10% liveaboards and a few more in the winter... (but a cruiser would have no problem staying on their boat for two weeks there and then sailing on, or as many cruisers may appreciate a week on their boat and a couple weeks at home before another week on their boat before sailing on...)

"The Port of Friday Harbor extends to a limited number of boaters permission to liveaboard their cruising vessels in the marina for the purpose of providing additional safety and security for people and property at the marina. Liveaboards provide a human presence in the marina at all times which makes the marina more like a neighborhood. Liveaboards have the responsibility to report hazards, suspicious incidents and dangers to Port staff."
(as quoted from https://www.portfridayharbor.org/wp-...ard-Policy.pdf)

As a side note, I just recently learned that the people that manage Clipper Cover on Treasure Island reduced the duration of their "long-term" anchoring permit from 21 days to 10 days. I can honestly say after a singlehanded sail non-stop from Ketchikan Alaska to the Bay Area the last thing I wanted to do on arrival was be told I had to pull anchor in a week and a half just because some non-sailor that is probably getting kickbacks from development interests says so... If Sausalito was given more authority to impose additional rules on Richardson Bay anchoring I suspect that a 10 day or so anchoring maximum would be imposed there as well, so 10 days at Clipper Cove, 10 days at Richardson Bay and then where? (note TIDA won't give another anchoring permit for Clipper Cove for 21 days after the last one expired.. Even if a sailor has a documented health emergency that puts them in the hospital...
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Old 11-02-2017, 03:48   #529
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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Perhaps if the marina's are experiencing theft problems they could rethink their disdain for people living on their boats and learn from other marina and harbor policies? One example of a different approach to people choosing to live on their boats is the policy adopted by the Port of Friday Harbor Marina which defines living aboard as 15 of 30 days in a given month and expressly allows 10% liveaboards and a few more in the winter... (but a cruiser would have no problem staying on their boat for two weeks there and then sailing on, or as many cruisers may appreciate a week on their boat and a couple weeks at home before another week on their boat before sailing on...)

"The Port of Friday Harbor extends to a limited number of boaters permission to liveaboard their cruising vessels in the marina for the purpose of providing additional safety and security for people and property at the marina. Liveaboards provide a human presence in the marina at all times which makes the marina more like a neighborhood. Liveaboards have the responsibility to report hazards, suspicious incidents and dangers to Port staff."
(as quoted from https://www.portfridayharbor.org/wp-...ard-Policy.pdf)

As a side note, I just recently learned that the people that manage Clipper Cover on Treasure Island reduced the duration of their "long-term" anchoring permit from 21 days to 10 days. I can honestly say after a singlehanded sail non-stop from Ketchikan Alaska to the Bay Area the last thing I wanted to do on arrival was be told I had to pull anchor in a week and a half just because some non-sailor that is probably getting kickbacks from development interests says so... If Sausalito was given more authority to impose additional rules on Richardson Bay anchoring I suspect that a 10 day or so anchoring maximum would be imposed there as well, so 10 days at Clipper Cove, 10 days at Richardson Bay and then where? (note TIDA won't give another anchoring permit for Clipper Cove for 21 days after the last one expired.. Even if a sailor has a documented health emergency that puts them in the hospital...
That's not the problem at Richardson Bay. Too many bums on boats is the issue.
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Old 11-02-2017, 10:03   #530
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

Many of the break-ins are happening to liveaboards in marinas (myself included) - there was a rash of thefts over the holidays. These guys are watching and know when you are away.

We pay a ton of money for liveaboard privileges, and whether that is right, wrong or fair is not really the issue here. I estimate that about 25-30% of boats in my marina are lived on. Bathroom facilities, parking etc are maxed out as it.

I understand your predicament, but I fail to see the connection you are making to this issue. I agree you should be able to stay on your boat for longer than 3 days a week - or obtaining a cruising permit or a transient berth (without paying exorbitant rates). Our harbormaster is flexible. I think in your case you are especially limited because you don't fit in a slip.

None of that applies to the people living permanently on illegal " moorings " in RB. They are not cruisers or transiting the area. Many of the the ones that haven't sunk or broken free haven't moved in years.

I think one should be able to come to RB and drop the hook, stay for a while, and then sail on - not drop an illegal mooring on the bottom, tie up a junk cluttered heap indefinitely until it sinks or breaks away.
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Old 11-02-2017, 10:37   #531
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

In related news- the $3.5 million spent to remove the Oakland Estuary's 40+ derelict homeless wrecks and sinkers a few years ago was money well spent.

Unfortunately, this was taken yesterday.

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Old 11-02-2017, 12:11   #532
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

I will be headed over the RB in the next few weeks to take photos. I'm wondering if the derelict boats in the photos in posts #157- #166 of this thread are still there [or sunk] and what new 'boats' might have joined the floating junk yard.
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Old 11-02-2017, 12:42   #533
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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In related news- the $3.5 million spent to remove the Oakland Estuary's 40+ derelict homeless wrecks and sinkers a few years ago was money well spent.

Unfortunately, this was taken yesterday.

At 40 boats that's $87,500.00 per boat.
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Old 11-02-2017, 12:44   #534
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
In related news- the $3.5 million spent to remove the Oakland Estuary's 40+ derelict homeless wrecks and sinkers a few years ago was money well spent.

Unfortunately, this was taken yesterday.



I had to look at that twice, it's two boats, one on top of the other
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Old 11-02-2017, 12:46   #535
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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At 40 boats that's $87,500.00 per boat.
Yep.

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Old 11-02-2017, 12:50   #536
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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Yep.


The bums were living on some pretty heavy stuff!
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Old 11-02-2017, 13:12   #537
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

I'm impressed, look at the anchor. Those bums weren't going to drag
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Old 11-02-2017, 17:05   #538
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

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I'm impressed, look at the anchor. Those bums weren't going to drag
It looks like that's their spare anchor they kept on deck for emergencies.
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Old 13-02-2017, 20:13   #539
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

[QUOTE=lelievre12;2323035]With the winter storms this last month I make at least 12 Richardson Bay anchor-out boats either sunk or washed up at Tiburon.

As I write I can see 3 yachts and 4 power boats (one at least 50 feet) wrecked on the Tiburon rocks. I can see another 2 power boats sunk in shallow water (only superstructure visible) off Gallilee and another yacht sunk (only mast visible) off SYH.

Add to that a 34 foot power boat I saw sink in shallow water last week off Spinnaker and a 45 foot centre cockpit yacht that sank to the gunwhales but was saved by a Dive boat with pumps and towed off.

That's just what I saw with my own eyes. There is probably more.

So much environmental damage and who pays the cost?

I would recommend NOT TO USE Richardson Bay as an anchorage as there is now so much DEBRIS on the bottom of the bay you will likely lose your anchor and rode snarled on one of the wrecks. Or hole your boat on one of the many wrecks just beneath the surface in the anchorage.

That's what federal management of this anchorage gets. Spoiled not just for the anchor-outs but ruined for transient boaters as well.[/QUO

The Richardson Bay Regional Agency published the February meeting packet at

http://rbra.ca.gov/Packet_2_17.pdf

Page 36 shows 26 sunk or abandoned boats just in December/January alone. That doesn't include the more recent 12 lost/sunk I mentioned above. They will most likely be included in the next packet to RBRA.

Total reported cost to the RBRA for the 26 boats was $74,147. Wow that's a lot of public money to spend in only two months. Sure would provide a lot of low cost rental housing.

What's worse is that there are reported drownings this winter. So living afloat is not only expensive, but dangerous too.

Of course none of this is surprising given that Richardson Bay is fully exposed to SE gales and develops sea states that even well equipped vessels would find challenging. The idea that somehow, seaworthiness need not apply when only 'anchoring' is absurd. When using any public waterway, USCG safety standards should apply to all vessels whether underway OR at anchor. Anything less simply puts peoples lives at risk.

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Old 13-02-2017, 20:20   #540
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Re: Richardson Bay liveaboards, heads up!

Can't understand why anyone would transit/anchor in Richardson Bay except to travel up the boat channel heading for the local marinas.

I'm thinking one of the causes for the problems there is that the bay is a designated "special anchorage," not requiring anchor lights or day shapes.
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