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Old 22-06-2019, 04:48   #241
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

I do not think the rules are fixed, being flexible isn't such a bad thing.

I've used debt to leverage myself and produce income but I choose to be debt free currently, as the financial environment changes so do I.

Debt can work for you or work against you, knowing the difference is crucial. Most have debt working against them, your liability is someone else's asset.
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Old 22-06-2019, 05:40   #242
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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I understand that borrowing money to buy depreciating toys is losing money faster than paying cash for that same toy.
Simple maths.

If they are still working, perhaps they can have some tax advantage to losing money, but they are still only getting a % of their loss back and......they are still working and I'd rather not.

Borrowing money to buy something that actually generates income over and above the cost of the repayments is something else again, but that's not what you are talking about.
It’s a waste of time trying to explain to most people.
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Old 22-06-2019, 05:51   #243
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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Mate, how long since you rented a house in Oz?

$25K is only around $500/wk, and the only places you can get a house for that sort of money is WELL away from the main capital cities and conurbations.

I left western Sydney 10 years ago when my rent went from $250/wk to 300/wk. For a two bedroom house.

A house in the same street rented recently for $700/wk..!! And that's undesirable outer wester Sydney! Inner city you're talking same amount for a 1 bed apartment.

A mate of mine on the mid-north coast is struggling to find a house under $500/wk that is not located next to a sewage works or an abbattoir, or in a theft-prone area.

He found one, but it wasn't that easy....

And he's earning less than the 'average' wage of around AU$70K
I understand and agree. I live of rental income ,I have two rentals and up to recently a third, therefore I have a fairly good grasp of the rental situation.

I don't know how middle class families in Australia get by. Storm clouds are building. I follow Australian economics very closely, this includes housing and the banking sector,its a bazzaar alternate universe we live in.
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:15   #244
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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“ You cannot legally own property in India, if you are a foreigner.”

Who would want to??
Have you been to India?
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:18   #245
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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Wealth is a state of mind, not a bank account..

There are many with little who consider themselves wealthy, and many with millions and its never enough.

Greed is what makes the difference.


Thank you for that. Time and choice are your greatest assets.
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:27   #246
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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Thank you for that. Time and choice are your greatest assets.
Time, health and choice absolutely BUT money does matter, few say "I'd like less money".

Money can give you time, help solve health issues and definitely helps in the choice department. It also buys you a nice boat.
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:38   #247
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

Quite a few parts of the USA are cheap and beautiful. The only thing that is really expensive is labor.

We have our sailboat on the coast of Washington state, moored for $330 a month and we also pay $525 a month for a 1 bedroom apartment in the mountains of north eastern Washington, where we ski, ride snowmobiles, hike, bike and fish. When we get tired of the mountains, we drive over to the coast and go out on the sailboat (well, actually most of the time it is go over and install some part or other as sailboats are very needy creatures).

Had we been a little tighter budget, we could have just stuck with our small Montgomery 17 sailboat (which we still have, I love that boat) and expenses would be much lower since it can be kept on a trailer.

Healthcare is practically free. Like $43 a month for a married couple with a $23,000 MAGI for a silver plan with $600 a year max out of pocket. Checkups free, drugs are like a dollar.

Gasoline is cheaper than most other parts of the world. Food is cheap in the grocery store and is not taxed.

$525 apartment (all utilities included except electricity)
$100 health insurance (assumes you hit max out of pocket each year)
$500 groceries
$50 electricity

Total monthly expenses $1175 or $14,100 a year for a married couple with a MAGI of $23,000 (who would pay zero federal tax btw since the deductions are $24,000 not even counting zero tax on cap gains and dividends)

So with your $20,000 budget you would still have $5900 a year left over for non essentials like car, eating out, cell phones or any of the other million things we crowd our life with.

And this part of the country is not ugly:
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:57   #248
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

Nice one KTP. I mentioned earlier that my partner and I are managing to live a good life here in Canada, and we live on an annual income of around $24,000 CND (~$18,000 USD). We do this through a combination of living and cruising on our sailboat for about 1/2 the year, and then visiting family/friends and house sitting for the other half. We live well. We travel, and get to experience different parts of this vast country of Canada.

We have a modest nest egg to deal with exceptional expenses. So this allows us to “retire” on less than $200Km and still feel rich.
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Old 22-06-2019, 06:59   #249
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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You should try driving in India
When ever I go by car in India I hire a car and driver. It can be slow going but they manage and you can relax.
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Old 22-06-2019, 07:40   #250
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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I'm amazed at the powers-that-be ability to kick the can down the road but at some point fundamentals have to come into play. When they do, it will be painful.

I carry a small amount of unsecured debt. If the financial-world-ends I'll default. **** the banks. They have no issue having someone else picking up the tab, why should i.
Agreed that we are borrowing too heavily from the future to pay for today, especially in terms of resources, pollution and real-estate. Regarding currency... if your country runs on a fiat currency, there is some opportunity to intelligently (is that a word? should be) leverage the future. Key word is intelligent.

There will be no ****ing the banks, unfortunately. They will always prevail, as long as there is rule of law.

* * *

Here, at no charge for a limited time, is our formula for guaranteed financial success:
  • being white boomers
  • being born in a prosperous country, to middle-class parents
  • an aptitude that led to good-paying jobs
  • having a house in a major city for 2+ decades
  • and finally, something that was actually within our control - we chose to minimize debt and live below our means

Do the same and you too will have financial freedom!
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Old 22-06-2019, 07:56   #251
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

Markets have been rallying for a decade, if feel very unlikely it to continue this way for another. Meaning, that I don't expect very high real capital return on that nest egg.

In most countries mentioned by the article a simple house will cost more than $100k, a house where "you can feel rich" easily 200-300k, meaning that even a couple's savings (=400k nest egg) is halved. Of course, living on a boat works for a while if you are fit enough even in your late 80's... Rentals increase in price, likely more than any well invested assets.

Don't forget inflation either, it's not just your condo rental that doubles price in 10 years. Same goes for your chloting, grocery and dentist bill. Many listed countries are "developing" - development means nothing else than things are getting more expensive. Mexico is cheap ATM. Is it going to stay so for the next 20 years? Maybe, maybe not.

"Feeling rich" is also different from person to person. To most of us it means long distance travel/tourism - maybe one intercontinental per year - that's independent from how "cheap" country you live in. Consumption of overseas/quality goods - no need to explain to the sailing folk, a new engine for your boat won't be much cheaper in Mexico than Florida.

Don't want to kill the topic, but I don't see anyone with a westerner background anywhere in the world "feeling rich" AND safe spending a $200k nest egg. You might very well live on roots and berries, enjoy the challenge but that's far from "feeling rich".

It would be much more fair to call $20k/year and "feel rich". Sorry, I can't "feel rich" without my boat (wich is faaar from being a fancy $$$-one...) - she needs on average 3k/year on the hook or twice as much in a "cheap third world" marina. I need food, clothes, healthcare, some travel, consumer electronics, tools. All this could be managed in the listed countries from 20k/year (later more because of the inflation and higher health care costs) but that 200k nest egg won't provide you 20k/year for very long.
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Old 22-06-2019, 08:34   #252
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

For an unlimited length retirement I use a 3% SWR rate with the funds invested 80% stocks 20% bonds.

So $20,000 would require a $670,000 investment portfolio.

This will keep up with inflation and pops and dips in the stock market and should last forever, or at least as long as we have the current level of civilization (WWIII throws a wrench in things).

The trick is you can't spend more than the $20,000 per year (inflation adjusted each year) even in years like this one where the market is up 17% YTD. There will be years where it is down 10% to 30% too.
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Old 22-06-2019, 08:37   #253
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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Originally Posted by Lake-Effect View Post
Agreed that we are borrowing too heavily from the future to pay for today, especially in terms of resources, pollution and real-estate. Regarding currency... if your country runs on a fiat currency, there is some opportunity to intelligently (is that a word? should be) leverage the future. Key word is intelligent.

There will be no ****ing the banks, unfortunately. They will always prevail, as long as there is rule of law.

* * *

Here, at no charge for a limited time, is our formula for guaranteed financial success:
  • being white boomers
  • being born in a prosperous country, to middle-class parents
  • an aptitude that led to good-paying jobs
  • having a house in a major city for 2+ decades
  • and finally, something that was actually within our control - we chose to minimize debt and live below our means

Do the same and you too will have financial freedom!

That's a fine list.

The most important, of course, are withing your control:
working hard (to generate a positive cash flow), minimizing debt, and living below your means.

It's not just blind luck or partisan politics.
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Old 22-06-2019, 08:56   #254
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

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For an unlimited length retirement I use a 3% SWR rate with the funds invested 80% stocks 20% bonds.

So $20,000 would require a $670,000 investment portfolio.

This will keep up with inflation and pops and dips in the stock market and should last forever, or at least as long as we have the current level of civilization (WWIII throws a wrench in things).

The trick is you can't spend more than the $20,000 per year (inflation adjusted each year) even in years like this one where the market is up 17% YTD. There will be years where it is down 10% to 30% too.
Exactly. Looking at real total return data even 3% can be optimistic sometimes.

Halving the 20k figure, $10k/year still needs $335k+ (still not the 200k advertised...) worth and that will allow you a quite frugal lifestyle. Right, you might "feel rich" compared to your neighbor in Somalia but not to your former self.
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Old 22-06-2019, 09:05   #255
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Re: Places Where You Can Retire on $200,000 and Feel Rich

For me feeling rich is not so much about what type of car I drive or how many helicopters I can fit on my yacht but rather what I can do and what kind of schedule do I have to keep.

Right now I feel pretty rich because I don't have to work. By staying in a cheap 1 bedroom apartment (which is just as comfortable watching a show on a $200 50 inch TV as a 5 bedroom house, 4 of which rooms you never visit except to clean), we are able to keep our costs down. I go get a haircut on a Tuesday at 11 am and they say "So, are you taking the day off of work?" I try not to make them feel bad by saying we retired in our mid 40s and don't really have to do any work each day if we don't feel like it, so I usually say I am off contract right now.

Going to a matinee movie at 1pm on a Thursday while all of your friends are just waiting to finish up work and enjoy their 1 hour commute kind of makes you feel rich.

Holidays are annoying though. Everything is closed. Get back to work people!
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