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Old 18-08-2017, 10:43   #16
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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Originally Posted by lancelot9898 View Post
For those of you living in locations where there is a personal property tax on boats, is there any exemption from that tax for having your boat as your home?
That probably depends on your municipality. Be specific someone in your area may know.
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Old 18-08-2017, 10:53   #17
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

soo, lets say I reside in NJ and own a boat that is registered in NJ. Am I subject to Florida (or other east coast jurisdiction) sales or use taxes if I either:

1) travel to Florida on the boat and stay longer than some defined length of time (e.g. 90 or 180 days) or can that be extended indefinitely or otherwise via some type of permit?

OR

2) legally change my place of residence from NJ to Florida?

The point is, I've paid sales tax in NJ on the boat. Am I required to pay Florida some significant chunk of change or just some small(er) annual registration or other fee? (the boat has a 6 digit value)?
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Old 18-08-2017, 10:53   #18
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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Originally Posted by lancelot9898 View Post
For those of you living in locations where there is a personal property tax on boats, is there any exemption from that tax for having your boat as your home?
Beaufort County, Beaufort, S.C. offer's 4 percent tax of the value of your boat If you reside 180 days or longer. You can also qualify for homestead exemption.
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Old 18-08-2017, 10:57   #19
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

Even if you register in RI or another state, if the boat spends most of it's time in Florida, Florida will want their tax.

I'm assuming you don't have a tax attorney on staff (or you wouldn't be asking us), so I'm guessing the boat isn't worth enough to start taking exotic extremes to avoid the tax.
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Old 18-08-2017, 11:27   #20
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

There appears to be broad confusion among personal property, sales and use taxes. In Florida sales tax is charged if you buy in Florida. Use tax is charged at the same rate if you bought elsewhere, did not pay sales tax there and have moved the boat to Florida. If the boat is kept in state you have to register it which is how they will check the sales/use tax status. These are one time taxes. The Personal Property tax is strictly a business tax and is annual based on accessed value. Unless you are self employed or an independent contractor it does not apply to you. If you are, then the tax does apply and the state could care less if you live aboard or not.
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Old 18-08-2017, 11:35   #21
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

Peter J. Tecklenburg
Charleston County Auditor
P. O. Box 614, Charleston, SC 29402-0614
Phone: 843-958-4200 Fax: 843-958-4222
http://auditor.charlestoncounty.org .


6% ASSESSMENT RATIO FORM FOR WATERCRAFT


DATE August 18, 2017 TAX YEAR I CERTIFY THAT MY WATERCRAFT, US COAST GUARD




Name of Vessel
DOCUMENTATION NUMBER OR S.C. REGISTRATION NUMBER CONTAINS A COOKING AREA WITH AN ONBOARD POWER SOURCE, A TOILET WITH EXTERIOR EVACUATION, AND A SLEEPING QUARTER AND THUS IS QUALIFIED FOR A 6% ASSESSMENT WITH CHARLESTON COUNTY IN THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA.

PER S.C. CODE THE APPLICANT MUST BE AN INDIVIDUAL, A SOLE PROPRIETORSHIP, PARTNERSHIP, OR AN "S" CORPORATION, INCLUDING A LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY TAXED AS A SOLE PROPRIETORSHIP, PARTNERSHIP, OR "S" CORPORATION.








Owner's Signature


Address

Phone Number Watercraft Location







101 Meeting Street, Room 105 P.O. Box 614 Charleston, SC 29402-0614 (843)958-4200 FAX(843)958-4222

This is from Charleston, South Carolina. The 6% rate is also the rate applied to a second home on the land. Personal Property tax rates on boats not meeting the criteria are taxed 10.5%. I didn't include the other part of this but, if your boat is your primary residency the rate is reduced to 4%, which is the same as the rate on a traditional home on the land. Bottom line check with your local government. Years ago I lived full-time on a 40ft Motor Yacht, my CPA wrote off my loan interest, insurance, property taxes and dock fees because it was my primary just like a house. Good Luck
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Old 18-08-2017, 11:37   #22
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

In Florida Personal Property Tax is a business tax. That includes the self employed and contractors. Also if you own a corporation and titled the boat as business property the tax applies. You pay based on assessed value similar to residential real estate. Live aboard status does not matter.
Use tax only applies to those Florida boat owners who did not pay sales tax when they purchased (I do not know about offshore but would not expect the officials to be sympathetic). So if you paid where you bought you are home free. The rule is no double taxation so if you buy in a no tax state, tough!
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Old 18-08-2017, 14:10   #23
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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2) legally change my place of residence from NJ to Florida?
If you live in Jersey but keep the boat in Florida full-time or if you change residence to Florida and keep the boat there Florida will look for a Use Tax.

Again I will say Florida does try to be somewhat fair and here is how. Most of Florida is 6% sales tax but a few counties have voted in a penny and thus are 7%. The use tax is the difference between your Florida, county rate, sales tax and any taxes you paid in NJ. For instance, if you paid 5% in NJ and moved to a 6% county in Florida your use tax would be 1% of vessel value.

As mentioned before by another poster I, nor most others I imagine, are tax attorneys. Consult the local jurisdiction tax authorities of where you want to keep the vessel. If you really want to max out your 'tax evasion' consult with a tax attorney in that area and you will be guided in the best method for your situation.

Then you pay the attorney so as I said a post or two ago, you're gonna pay, one way or the other! But to be clear, I am with you. I don't mind paying what I need to pay but I don't want to pay a nickel more!
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Old 18-08-2017, 14:47   #24
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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Under what is called "strict construction" in the laws, the tax statutes are interpreted strictly. So, you BOUGHT a boat? You can put it on a trailer or flatbed and move it around? Yeah, it is personal property and that's the end of the argument.

It is also nowhere defined as "real estate" or "real property", so again, the law says you don't get any real property breaks for it.

And the IRS, school board, and elections department will all tell you that you can live under a bridge, in or out of a tent or cardoard box, and they'll honor that as your HOME and home address. But that tent and box are still personal property, not real estate.

You've almost certainly got the entire body of common law and statutory law in all of the US against you.

BUT.

This is not to discourage you. Honest.

The ONLY RESPONSE THAT MATTERS is what YOUR LOCAL TAX DEPARTMENT SAYS. Don't waste your time in a sailing forum. Write an appeal to your tax department and when they deny it (because #1, they follow the laws as written and #2, they want the oney) you can appeal it in your state courts. You've got a total of four or five local and state authorities who really can issue a binding legal statement that your boat is a "home" and therefore somehow not personal property.

I thinks your chances are about as good as a snowball in hell because you don't seem to grasp what "property" the laws recognize, but hey, go for it. Stranger cases have been won. You might remind them that a house can also be put on a truck and moved around too...but that's a two-edged sword.

BUT NOT ONLINE. No one here can help you, and the rules in every other jurisdiction DO NOT BIND ON YOURS. Yeah, that's the law.

These are the studied opinions a citizen deemed to be a learned gentlemen and scholar, not legal advice or practice. Them who deemed me, coulda been wrong.
Amen hellosailer...... That's well put if I do say so myself
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Old 18-08-2017, 15:38   #25
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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Originally Posted by kapnkarl View Post
soo, lets say I reside in NJ and own a boat that is registered in NJ. Am I subject to Florida (or other east coast jurisdiction) sales or use taxes if I either:

1) travel to Florida on the boat and stay longer than some defined length of time (e.g. 90 or 180 days) or can that be extended indefinitely or otherwise via some type of permit?

OR

2) legally change my place of residence from NJ to Florida?

The point is, I've paid sales tax in NJ on the boat. Am I required to pay Florida some significant chunk of change or just some small(er) annual registration or other fee? (the boat has a 6 digit value)?
Amazed at the misinformation you're being given. I suggest going to the FL website. However, here is the basic.

1) depends partly on how long you've owned the boat and if NJ Sales Tax was paid. If you've met the requirements, all FL will require you to do is register the boat, no taxes.

2) If you move to FL, depends on how long you've owned the boat and if NJ Sales tax was paid. If you've met the requirements, all FL will require you to do is title and register the boat, no taxes.

In both cases, the key time period is having owned the boat in NJ at least six months.
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Old 18-08-2017, 16:10   #26
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

We purchased a used boat in NC and weren't charged a sales tax. We kept the boat in NC for a year then entered Florida. When we registered the boat in Florida there was no sales or use tax due as we didn't purchase the boat in Florida and didn't enter Florida within the first 6 months of ownership. This only holds true if your not a Florida resident. The way we were treated agrees with the wording posted in the Florida boat registration website.
http://floridarevenue.com/Forms_libr...t/gt800005.pdf
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Old 18-08-2017, 19:40   #27
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

Ah, I stand corrected. I am a Florida resident so I guess the rules are a little different for me? I need to read up a little more.
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Old 18-08-2017, 20:39   #28
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

If you have no other home and you live on the boat full time, you CAN claim a Homestead exemption on a boat. The IRS classifies a boat as a home or second home.

I myself have a homestead exemption in California which reduces my personal property tax about 25 percent. Same applies to RV's. Some states may vary. For legal description, I put in a description of the boat. I did get a call from the county tax folks, but they did allow it.
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Old 18-08-2017, 20:50   #29
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

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If you have no other home and you live on the boat full time, you CAN claim a Homestead exemption on a boat. The IRS classifies a boat as a home or second home.

I myself have a homestead exemption in California which reduces my personal property tax about 25 percent. Same applies to RV's. Some states may vary. For legal description, I put in a description of the boat. I did get a call from the county tax folks, but they did allow it.
In Florida there is no property tax on a boat, so obviously no homestead exemption needed.
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Old 18-08-2017, 20:59   #30
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Re: Personal Property Tax for Liveaboards

Sounds like someone is Cali had an accidental moment of rationality, or realized how many residents lived in trailer parks and would be vote for whoever gave them a homestead exemption.

In most states, the homestead exemptions are against your REAL ESTATE taxes, and if there is personal property tax...TFB. But then again, I think the states that levy personal property taxes are in the vast minority. I'm told that even CT dropped it ages ago.
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