Pearls of Wisdom for a Future Liveaboard?

[EvanneKegley]

Originally Posted by CarlF

I would strongly recommend buying a small sailboat now. Something between 20 and 25ft. It should be big enough for all three of you to spend a weekend in"camping" mode. It will cost less than $10,000 and you'll be able to sell it in a few years for close to the same price - maybe more if you fix it up.

Because it's only a 2-3 year boat, you don't have to research the "perfect" boat. Almost anything will do.

The experience for all three of you from owning, fixing, and sailing this boat will answer far more questions than you'll ever get from studying books or the Internet.

Here's a nice Cal 25 on the West Coast
1979 CAL 25 SLOOP Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

That's a great idea, thank you

[PortClydeMe]

Originally Posted by CarlF

I would strongly recommend buying a small sailboat now. Something between 20 and 25ft. It should be big enough for all three of you to spend a weekend in"camping" mode. It will cost less than $10,000 and you'll be able to sell it in a few years for close to the same price - maybe more if you fix it up.

Because it's only a 2-3 year boat, you don't have to research the "perfect" boat. Almost anything will do.

The OP responded "That's a great idea."

How on Earth can a 20-25 foot boat be a great idea?

CarlF: I don't recall any mention of a "2-3 year boat". Did you read her posts? They want to live on a boat, not go camping on weekends. Moreover, they want to hit "Alaska", "Chile", "Hawaii", and "Japan" after two years of sailing. Those are not little "jaunts", even for folks that have been sailing their whole life ... like ME.

I have no idea of the OPs current living situation, yet moving from anything other than a studio apartment into a 25- to 35-foot marina boat is going to take some MAJOR getting used to, especially with a child in tow (age unknown). In fact, even a 42-footer will soon feel cramped and quickly claustrophobic compared to standard life ashore (if that's a normal 1-2 bedroom apartment or a house).

Nothing against the standard "pat-on-the-back" "go-for-it" replies often seen in this forum, yet sometimes a realistic viewpoint can be truly helpful. Most first-time live-aboards are gazing through rose-colored glasses, which is all fine and good until reality kicks in. Sometimes it amazes me that few people here ever say "Hey, good dream, but have you thought about this...."; i.e., the harsh reality aspects that newbie dreamers often fail to consider. It's not all surf, sand, and teaching junior to "hula".

To the OP, and not that it's any of my business, but have you ever spent time below decks on 20-25 foot sailboat? Are you both just looking to try and save money by living in a marina now that the child has arrived? Are you both working now, and now that the child is here it will soon become a 1-earner clan ($100K per year suddenly dropping to maybe $60K per year)? Just trying to figure out what your real plans are, and what prompted those plans.

I write these words to hopefully help you think critically, not to upset your mind.

Oh well, have fun sailing. It's a lot of water between California and Japan (where I currently live).

[CarlF]

Geez PortClyde - read the posts again.

I'm suggesting the 20-25ft boat while they are saving the $50k for the boat they plan to buy in two years. This isn't a live aboard but just a weekender to get some experience under their belts in coastal sailing and boat ownership.

And in the post they didn't say they were going anywhere in 2 years other than a nearby marina. The distant ports were "ultimately" (and I agree Patagonia is even a stretch for "ultimately")

While I now own a 55ft ketch, my first boat was a 23ft Seasprite. It didn't have standing headroom but I probably learned more about boats and cruising aboard her than any other. I still smile everytime I think of her.

[Jman]

Lets calm down a bit and look at the OP question.

1. 2 years to learn how to sail (no mention of going anywhere other than sailing school during that time)
2. During the two year period save money to buy a boat that could be considered a live aboard. If they can save 50k during that time, they have a shot a pretty decent cruiser to start getting ready for number 3.
3. Quote "ultimately" do the Pacific rim. In that boat? In another boat? After the baby graduates college? Not clear.

They want to get into sailing - I think camping in small boat that does not break the budget is a great way to learn how to sail and how to get along in tight quarters and more importantly learn what boat ownership is about.

If they have jobs that allow for 3 month sojourns with junior in tow - then awesome for them. Go to sailing school and get a boat that is closer to the 50k target in the 12-24 month time period.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[PortClydeMe]

Originally Posted by CarlF

Geez PortClyde - calm down.

Haha. Damn it, Carl. Caffeine and nicotine. Two drugs I love to death and just can't quit.

If they spend $10K on a 20-footer, that just puts that $50K water home further down the financial path. But hey, they're taking in $100K a year now, so maybe not. Why am I typing? haha

[chris mac]

To the Op. Me and my wife have a similar plan except are waiting till the kids move out to buy our live aboard. In the meantime we have bought a 26 foot to learn and play on like Carlf suggested. It's a great way to learn. Being that we already own it we try to get out as often as possible vs having to justify more money to rent, charter, or buy lessons each time. We will obviously lose money when it's time to sell and go bigger but we'll worth the investment.
It's working well for us but everyone is different.
Regardless of whether you start small or big in boat size, start small in practise. Go out in light winds, nice days, with help if possible and build your skills and confidence together.
Sailing, like most hobbies is done because it's fun. keep it fun and feed the dream:-)

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by chris mac

To the Op. Me and my wife have a similar plan except are waiting till the kids move out to buy our live aboard. In the meantime we have bought a 26 foot to learn and play on like Carlf suggested. It's a great way to learn. Being that we already own it we try to get out as often as possible vs having to justify more money to rent, charter, or buy lessons each time. We will obviously lose money when it's time to sell and go bigger but we'll worth the investment.
It's working well for us but everyone is different.
Regardless of whether you start small or big in boat size, start small in practise. Go out in light winds, nice days, with help if possible and build your skills and confidence together.
Sailing, like most hobbies is done because it's fun. keep it fun and feed the dream:-)

What a very nice post!

Fwiw, I second it! You have so much less to lose if you start small. You'll learn a lot. And all that knowledge will inform your choice for you world traveling boat.

Enjoy it all; there are many steps.

PCM has a valid point about the finances: it is best you have a good handle on them. However, there is a CF thread about cruising on $500 per month. Mostly, the big bucks guys don't bother to go there, but there is a world of knowledge about "how to do it" there.


Ann

[David_Old_Jersey]

OPs plans are doable, but most things with boats are. The question is whether likely or prudent. IMO the plans are ambitious given the starting point.

No single way to get the knowledge and experience needed to undertake such voyages, very much depends on the starting skills, ability to learn and finances of each person. The more a person learns the better they will be to decide own learning approach. IMO combining book and formal teaching with own boat is the best way. In what order and exactly what of each a decision that only the person concerned can decide.

No simple, easy, quick or cheap way to learn..... IMO the buying a cheap small starter boat is a good way to start. Just don't over spend on buying or equipping / refitting. Could be a very cheap (in boat terms!) of finding out that being cold, wet and occasionally scared is not quite as fun as it sounds. Lol.

But don't try, don't do.



Sent from my NEXUS 5 whilst sitting in my armchair tied to the dock.

[HappyMdRSailor]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Hey... I was being PC..
for a change..

Originally Posted by FSMike

PC? Phil? Are you okay?

He caught quite a few of us off guard...

Originally Posted by CarlF

I would strongly recommend buying a small sailboat now. Something between 20 and 25ft. It should be big enough for all three of you to spend a weekend in"camping" mode. It will cost less than $10,000 and you'll be able to sell it in a few years for close to the same price - maybe more if you fix it up.

Because it's only a 2-3 year boat, you don't have to research the "perfect" boat. Almost anything will do.

The experience for all three of you from owning, fixing, and sailing this boat will answer far more questions than you'll ever get from studying books or the Internet.

Here's a nice Cal 25 on the West Coast
1979 CAL 25 SLOOP Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

+1 Carl...

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

What a very nice post!

Fwiw, I second it! You have so much less to lose if you start small. You'll learn a lot. And all that knowledge will inform your choice for you world traveling boat.

Enjoy it all; there are many steps.

PCM has a valid point about the finances: it is best you have a good handle on them. However, there is a CF thread about cruising on $500 per month. Mostly, the big bucks guys don't bother to go there, but there is a world of knowledge about "how to do it" there.


Ann

I second the nice post Ann...

Happy Pearls...
1. Find out if you like it...
2. Baby steps...
3. Make sure you BOTH still like it...

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by EvanneKegley

The 50k is just for the boat. After that we would probably live at a marina and continue working and learning to sail, taking long [~3 months] trips once a year or every couple of years. Our annual income is around 100k. Based on that article I think this is actually do-able, thank you.

Last year a friend bought a Prout SnowGoose in North Cyprus for within your budget (<$50K) after checking the boats integrity. He now sails with a basic boat only, but did add a lot of used solar panels. He does not have radar or a heap of other gear and he and his 12 year old daughter live pretty well on his $1k per month budget.
So much depends on your requirements AND location.

[EvanneKegley]

Originally Posted by chris mac

keep it fun and feed the dream:-)

Nice, thank you!

[EvanneKegley]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

OPs plans are doable, but most things with boats are. The question is whether likely or prudent. IMO the plans are ambitious given the starting point.

No single way to get the knowledge and experience needed to undertake such voyages, very much depends on the starting skills, ability to learn and finances of each person. The more a person learns the better they will be to decide own learning approach. IMO combining book and formal teaching with own boat is the best way. In what order and exactly what of each a decision that only the person concerned can decide.

No simple, easy, quick or cheap way to learn..... IMO the buying a cheap small starter boat is a good way to start. Just don't over spend on buying or equipping / refitting. Could be a very cheap (in boat terms!) of finding out that being cold, wet and occasionally scared is not quite as fun as it sounds. Lol.

But don't try, don't do.



Sent from my NEXUS 5 whilst sitting in my armchair tied to the dock.

ha! thank you! Starting with a small boat sounds like the pragmatic way to go.

[EvanneKegley]

Originally Posted by PortClydeMe

The OP responded "That's a great idea."

How on Earth can a 20-25 foot boat be a great idea?

CarlF: I don't recall any mention of a "2-3 year boat". Did you read her posts? They want to live on a boat, not go camping on weekends. Moreover, they want to hit "Alaska", "Chile", "Hawaii", and "Japan" after two years of sailing. Those are not little "jaunts", even for folks that have been sailing their whole life ... like ME.

I have no idea of the OPs current living situation, yet moving from anything other than a studio apartment into a 25- to 35-foot marina boat is going to take some MAJOR getting used to, especially with a child in tow (age unknown). In fact, even a 42-footer will soon feel cramped and quickly claustrophobic compared to standard life ashore (if that's a normal 1-2 bedroom apartment or a house).

Nothing against the standard "pat-on-the-back" "go-for-it" replies often seen in this forum, yet sometimes a realistic viewpoint can be truly helpful. Most first-time live-aboards are gazing through rose-colored glasses, which is all fine and good until reality kicks in. Sometimes it amazes me that few people here ever say "Hey, good dream, but have you thought about this...."; i.e., the harsh reality aspects that newbie dreamers often fail to consider. It's not all surf, sand, and teaching junior to "hula".

To the OP, and not that it's any of my business, but have you ever spent time below decks on 20-25 foot sailboat? Are you both just looking to try and save money by living in a marina now that the child has arrived? Are you both working now, and now that the child is here it will soon become a 1-earner clan ($100K per year suddenly dropping to maybe $60K per year)? Just trying to figure out what your real plans are, and what prompted those plans.

I write these words to hopefully help you think critically, not to upset your mind.

Oh well, have fun sailing. It's a lot of water between California and Japan (where I currently live).

I can give you a little more info. Right now, my husband works and I'm in school. He's a welder/shipfitter, primarily builds/repairs large steel vessels (oil takers, ferries, etc), although right now he's working an aluminium gig up in Bristol Bay building a cannery. Honestly he knows a lot more about boats, cruising, diesel mechanics, etc, than I do. He's the pragmatic, critical thinker-- I'm the hippie with rosey glasses

I'm a vet tech specializing in wildlife-- so our income is not likely to grow much even when I start working. Work will always keep us close to the water, which is totally how we prefer it. I guess thats really what prompted our plans.

Our son is three years old. Our current living situation is a rented house in the burbs.

[stevebein]

Just a few words and a question. Have you done any sailing on any size boat and how did it go?

I have owned boats in the 40-50' range and there are some amazing deals on less that aesthetic boats. There are some amazing deals on outstanding older and proven boats. Most of my cruising was done on 1970's boats which were 20 years old then and still are great, though not modern vessels. Families live aboard different sized boats with equal success. The most fun I had in beginning sailing was on a sabot. The most fun I had while learning was on a sabot while living on a 45' sloop. The idea of a smaller learning boat sounds very good. The concept of selling after a few years is also doable without losing much but the usual overhead. The final decision is yours. All the best, you have had differing opinions on this thread. Sift through them and chose which apply to you. Read a lot of books decide which apply to you and gain knowledge and experience.
Good luck

[EvanneKegley]

Originally Posted by stevebein

Just a few words and a question. Have you done any sailing on any size boat and how did it go?

I have owned boats in the 40-50' range and there are some amazing deals on less that aesthetic boats. There are some amazing deals on outstanding older and proven boats. Most of my cruising was done on 1970's boats which were 20 years old then and still are great, though not modern vessels. Families live aboard different sized boats with equal success. The most fun I had in beginning sailing was on a sabot. The most fun I had while learning was on a sabot while living on a 45' sloop. The idea of a smaller learning boat sounds very good. The concept of selling after a few years is also doable without losing much but the usual overhead. The final decision is yours. All the best, you have had differing opinions on this thread. Sift through them and chose which apply to you. Read a lot of books decide which apply to you and gain knowledge and experience.
Good luck

Thanks! We have been out day-sailing a handful of times as guests, never on our own. And it was really fun, a couple of stressful moments. But overall, awesome.