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Old 14-08-2019, 18:25   #1
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Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

As you hear. Living aboard your boat has been prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria/Spain).



I was not aware of this until a friend who lives onboard his boat there called me up.


Below I am recalling his news:



He says a new manager came last year and she is making many "changes" (he used a different word that is not legit here). Basically the area is being developed for nightclubs and bars, etc. Spain is badly looking for money as they stopped being a receiver of EU help only last year.



He is very angry and he says he remembers when the marina was built, it was with 'his' (EU) money. Now he and his wife (both retired now, well off people) are made feel unwelcome every time they walk into the office building. His choices are either to spend winters in his home Stockholm (brrrrr) or move on to a more friendly place. They have elected Tunisia, for the time being.

I wonder if now other Spanish ports will follow suit, or is Las Palmas unique in this respect?


BTW: All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others. I went to the harbour and asked a friendly marina hand there how they are going to treat the ARC sailors now. He said: no problem, they can live aboard. (sic!) A shocker


I am considering taking my boat from there and placing it in a different place too. As I do not live aboard, I am not, technically, touched by this. But then again, why feed politicians/managers who treat sailors like this?




Doh.
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Old 15-08-2019, 00:00   #2
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

So what does that actually mean? Book in for a few nights and you have to go find a hotel? Sounds crazy.
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Old 15-08-2019, 08:11   #3
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

According to opinions of Spanish boaters here:



This basically means that the harbour police may pop up at any boat now asking the people onboard to leave the boat and (?) book into a hotel ashore. There are half a dozen new hotels nearby. Some say the new law and the new hotels are strangely correlated.



The law, in good Spanish tradition, says living aboard is prohibited BUT does not provide any definition of what living aboard is and is not. Thus a gray area is created with decisions being arbitrary made by the manager of the marina.



This also means that true live aboard users of the marina - people who do not sail but rather live in their boats - are no longer allowed to do so. This affects a large group of Spanish people and a smaller community of EU expats. I think it will be fewer than one hundred souls altogether.



As the woman who manages the marina now seems to hate boaters and love night life (there used to be 1 bar in the marina, now there are 6, and a 'visitor's center' has been converted into a night club too) I wonder why does she not order the basin filled with white sand and covered in even more pubs, clubs and discos. Why have boats in marinas while money is elsewhere?


Except that this marina was supposed to be owned by the Spanish state and as such exempt from lucrative use ... (sic!)


Something is rotten in the state of Spain, or at least in its part being run by the new marina manager.


I was just called and told the new regulation has already been published online.



Cheers,
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Old 16-08-2019, 02:24   #4
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

I guess they don’t want permanent living in boats, or the possibility to deny such. The rule seems very wage when it comes to visiting boats.

https://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2019/08/...2019-12065.pdf

La utilización de las embarcaciones como vivienda habitual o vivienda para uso distinto de vivienda habitual, incluyendo la utilización de las embarcaciones para su explotación con fines de alquiler vacacional, ya sea entre particulares o a través de las plataformas electrónicas o empresas de cualquier tipo dedicadas a este tipo de actividad.
– Prestar servicios o realizar actividades comerciales sin el correspondiente Título expedido por la APLP.
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Old 16-08-2019, 03:25   #5
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

Clearly, if you live aboard they don't want your business. And clearly they don't need your business. You living aboard is costing them more profits.
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Old 16-08-2019, 03:56   #6
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pirate Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

Lets see how profitable a half empty marina is 10mths of the year before and after the ARC.
Time for positive action by boaters, move to friendlier isles.
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Old 16-08-2019, 04:46   #7
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

I was surprised to see the prohibitions on discharge of gray water, as well as showering, clothes washing, and pumping bilges. Are these new as well?


"11.1 Conforme al art. 62.1 TRLPEMM se prohíben los vertidos o emisiones contaminantes, ya sean sólidos, líquidos o gaseosos, en el dominio público portuario, procedentes de buques o de medios flotantes de cualquier tipo. En este sentido, todos los residuos generados por las embarcaciones, ya sean aguas grises, negras, residuos domésticos, aceites, basuras y utillajes inservibles, no podrán ser vertidos al mar, ni depositados en zonas no permitidas para ello, siendo responsabilidad del propietario de la embarcación darles un tratamiento adecuado."


"Artículo 19.Además de las específicas relacionadas con anterioridad, con carácter general queda absolutamente prohibido en la DEM:
– ...
- En los pantalanes está prohibido ducharse, lavar ropa y, en general, cualquier actividad que implique el vertido a las aguas portuarias de detergentes o residuos jabonosos.
– Achicar sentinas y fecales fuera de la instalación destinada a estos servicios"
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Old 16-08-2019, 07:07   #8
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

Yes. It is about getting rid of live aboards.


However, the new rules do not define what makes one a live aboard. All the decisions will be discretionary by the new manager. And she is definitely anti live aboard.


What else could you expect from a politician who is building her record to spring off to another more lucrative post.


I went down to the harbour to check on our boat. Met a number of people extremely pissed off. Basically, the foreigners are unhappy and disillusioned. Being retired in Sweden, England or Germany and spending all your retirement money in Las Palmas, they did expect to be treated like guests, not like a commodity.



The Spanish live aboards have foam at their mouths. They are using many interesting phrases that I have never heard before. I always thought that people here were very educated. But now it seems it is all up to a point.



How odd that a public good (the marina here is a a public / govt owned marina) can be so easily managed to achieve private goals. I would imagine this is what was happening in Greece before they went under. But in Spain? Spain always seemed to me pretty civic society, not a bunch of shortsighted crooks!



No wonder Brits are pulling out when they look at "management" in Med countries!



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Old 16-08-2019, 07:47   #9
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgh View Post
I was surprised to see the prohibitions on discharge of gray water, as well as showering, clothes washing, and pumping bilges. Are these new as well?

No idea if they're new, but to me it makes sense they don't want people emptying their shower/dishes/bilge water into the marina itself - then again, if the marina wants these regulations to stick they'd better make sure they offer facilities (at reasonable price) where one can do their dishes/laundry/etc.



Just my 2 random cents.
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Old 16-08-2019, 08:07   #10
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

Your at their mercy if your not the owner. I suppose even local laws might prevent even an owner from living in their owned slip, maybe even on their own property.
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Old 20-08-2019, 03:47   #11
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

As far as I'm aware, technically, you aren't allowed to live on your boat 24x7 in a Spanish marina, as we had a problem applying for Spanish residency and giving a permanent address as the marina.

I believe marinas managers waver this, as they see fit, however, it's at the marina managers discretion.
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Old 20-08-2019, 05:11   #12
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

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Originally Posted by Big Joe Bob View Post
As far as I'm aware, technically, you aren't allowed to live on your boat 24x7 in a Spanish marina, as we had a problem applying for Spanish residency and giving a permanent address as the marina.

I believe marinas managers waver this, as they see fit, however, it's at the marina managers discretion.

You have seen that regulation, or is this word of mouth?


There is an old regulation too which states you cannot anchor anywhere in Spain, except where there is a marked anchorage on an official chart! It was issued by their king long time ago and never recalled.


But I have not seen that 24/7 prohibition. Possibly something related to bum vagabundos. Would be nice to see the legal act that states so.



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Old 20-08-2019, 07:32   #13
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
You have seen that regulation, or is this word of mouth?


There is an old regulation too which states you cannot anchor anywhere in Spain, except where there is a marked anchorage on an official chart! It was issued by their king long time ago and never recalled.


But I have not seen that 24/7 prohibition. Possibly something related to bum vagabundos. Would be nice to see the legal act that states so.



b.
No, haven't seen anything in writing, just passing on what we were told

Our marina manager told us when we were applying for Spanish residency last winter, he did end up putting our berth on the application document, but we had to change the wording to say address, not a permanent address.
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Old 20-08-2019, 11:36   #14
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
They have elected Tunisia, for the time being.
Don't have to run that far, I guess the law doesn't apply to privately owned marinas.
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Old 21-08-2019, 07:05   #15
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Re: Living aboard prohibited in Las Palmas (Gran Canaria)

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Originally Posted by GTom View Post
Don't have to run that far, I guess the law doesn't apply to privately owned marinas.

It applies ONLY to Las Palmas (city marina, govt owned).



The point is that my friends got very crossed. In their words they got 'mistreated'. And I think I do understand them. My boat is two docks away from theirs. Every cruiser I meet here has only bad words for the new manager. Internationals are unhappy with the no live-aboard rule, locals are boiling with the new fees and rules related to ramp use, parking lot rules, engine use, dock use ... etc. etc. etc.


Local people set up an association to protect themselves from the new management. I wish them good luck.



I can only affirm that something very odd happened when we returned from Caribbean in July 2018. The marina used to be friendly, if very basic. Now under the new manager it is very very ... odd (self censored to save admin's effort). Definitely not the place it used to be before (we wintered here 8 times, between our Caribbean adventures).


I will hate to leave, as I do love Las Palmas and I have a lot of friends here, and other than the new management and her rules in the marina, the town and its citizens are as welcoming as ever.


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