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Old 22-06-2020, 14:27   #46
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Ouch. This one came out a bit looooongish, eh?


;-)
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Old 22-06-2020, 15:09   #47
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Go do it today
Yesterday would have been better
Tomorrow might be too late
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Old 22-06-2020, 15:11   #48
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Boat prices definitely dropped during the 2007-2010 recession.

Don't kid yourself.

Websites existed back then and you can still search for data from that recession.

This was written about boat prices during the great recession. This is vintage 2008.

Realities of the Boat Sales Business in the Recession


There is a lot more data out there if you do some searching for what happened during that recession. This "recession" or whatever it is, is HUGE compared to 2007-10. There is no comparison.

Unemployment peaked in the great recession at just above 10 percent.

The current unemployment rate is 13.3% officially but thought to be under reported. Los Angeles says that they are at over 16 percent. Michigan is near 20%.
https://www.bls.gov/web/laus/lauhsthl.htm

If we don't pull out of this recession or whatever it is this year, we may be here for a while.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom and Maje View Post
I would never put off buying the boat. Don't count on boat prices going down. They didn't drop in the last recession. Not everyone is out of a job. Is it possible to rent your house/apartment? What do you do for work? Is it something you can freelance? Are you interested in another profession where you can work remotely? I was a lawyer, and decided to become an author shortly before we bought out boat.

Maintenance is an ongoing project on a boat. Things you could defer on a house, can't be put off on a boat. If you learn how to do things yourself, maintenance will be much less expensive.

Maje
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Old 22-06-2020, 16:20   #49
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

None of us ever knows the future.

Life, for most people has always been difficult, even for the richer ones. Example: a primitive society, who gets the witch doctor? the once who has a chicken to spare. Never been easy, nor "fair", nor has anyone promised someone a rose garden for life.

***********

These are hard times, and people are sore afraid. Imho, it is okay if you want to talk about in social media, especially if you are otherwise isolated. However, when you do, you will pull varying attitudes and opinions, and some will not be toward your liking.

Owning even a liveaboard that is going nowhere is not without expense, nor problems. Boats sink. Deferred maintenance can bring serious problems. And boats are depreciating assets. As someone without boat experience, it's going to cost you more, because you have not yet learned "workarounds."

My advice: start small, if you're single. A liveaboard sailboat at 27 feet is doable for one person. Buy a "brand name" boat, so it can be re-sold if you turn out to not like it. Same idea if you prefer a motor vessel. Sailing and cruising are not for everyone, and I don't think the USA will be open to cheap living aboard, stinking, messy boats with whole families living aboard like some places in the world. Of course, I could be wrong, but not just yet. It is that societies change pretty slowly, the values carry on past when they were useful. See if you like living aboard. Maybe you will, but maybe you'll find it too cramped--boats are lots smaller than houses--or otherwise not to your liking. Maybe you'll love it. All life's decisions. Some work well, others, not.

Good luck with it. You are not alone. For the past few weeks there have been a number of posts very like yours, and only one of them was from someone with much sailing experience. It is normal to feel scared in out of control times.

Ann
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Old 22-06-2020, 16:24   #50
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Snap out of it!
There are literally millions and millions of America in worse shape, and billions in the world.
You got 2 choices: join the whinny multitudes and blame someone or something else; OR, snap out of the self pity and get going. You won’t find any whining liveaboards. There is always a great place to sail to, there will always be sometime fix on your boat, the weather will always change and often for the worse, and you will be surrounded by people who just deal with what we’re delt and keep going.
Life’s short.
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Old 22-06-2020, 17:45   #51
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

If you . the OP, believeS, live is over, there is no future, you are approaching dooms day, and you may be leading the pack over the cliff to extinction.

Well, if you tell yourself that, guess what, that is exactly what is going to happen to you. You are done, school is out, your season has been cancelled. And guess who you will be associating with, positive, upbeat, and happy people NOPE NOT A CHANCE,
You will be in a dull world of the doldrums and negativism. And you are only in your 50's. There is a whole life sitting in front of you.

But, if you stay positive, be persistent, and stay within your means, and get experience in seamanship, navigation, and chose the proper boat for you and a cruising ground that will work for you, do what it takes to follow your passion ............

YOU CAN ATTAIN IT. THERE ARE WAYS, EVEN DIFFERENT PATHS WAITING FOR YOU.

You have a lot more to progress and realize those dreams that many of us every had.
Yet, we did not listen to the YOU WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO DO THAT, NOT A CHANCE,
people.

And I speak from real experience. No silver spoon, and no encouragement for my passions, that began when i was very young. My dreams were to fly airplanes, skipper boats world wide, and live a life of all kinds of adventure. At no time did I ever believe that I could not attain any goals that I set.

Now, at 80, I am fit, positive, and have lived to concurrent careers. How, I just flat went for it. As to flying, I served this country, and used the GI Bill to earn my private, commercial, instrument, multi engine and flight instructor ratings. Had nearly 35 years as a flight instructor, charter pilot, corporate pilot, and Instructor Pilot , flying fighters.

Also, with sailing, I attained my U.S.C.G. Lic. 100 tons, 500 tons near coastal. And have sailed Australia, Tahiti, Tonga Mexico, the Bahamas, British Virgin Islands, French West Indies, Windward and Grenadines, Ireland an Greece.

Life has been , and is great, and have shared much of that with my special lady of 36 years, who is also a sailor, and a pilot, and much more.

Point being, if I would have listened to my folks, and become Mr. Businessman, constrained to a cubicle, I would not have lived the amazing and rewarding life that I have. When the blockaids of life roared up, I did not let them beat me down. Not for a second.

So, this is not to slap my own back, but to share with the OP, that even a kid from Oakland, who had an allowance of 25 cents a week, providing he completed all of his chores, wound up living a super fantastic , and positive life of true adventures.

As others have stated, if you want to go cruising, get off your " Life is doomed mantra and GO FOR IT. "

We want you to succeed and attain those dreams of cruising.
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Old 23-06-2020, 03:28   #52
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

We are of similar age. My wife passed away in April. For me, it’s why not now?

Not rich, but think i can make it work.

The estate sale is in 3 days. House goes on market week after july 4.
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Old 23-06-2020, 05:21   #53
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papasail View Post
I have kept liveaboard sailing like a carrot in front of me for years (10). Now with CoVid in front of us, the world is on fire. So are my dreams, I think?

Like so many, I just got a severance for October 1, 2020. Shortly, I'll be out of a job, in a HELLA job market/ Great Depression 2.0. I'm 58. I think I just retired, and didn't know it.

I've got easy money for the sailboat, and YES!... I'll be sensible and not buy too much boat. I like a Bristol 35 to 41. (Liveaboard). That takes me anywhere.

((BUT...)) I have very little coming in, short of whatever I can piece together (like everyone else!), plus some savings, until (4 years) I can get Social Security. *Ahem... if that lives through what's coming economically...

MY LIFE HAS BEEN SO HARD!!! I'm burnt to the core... and I mean that (personally), not so much professionally. I need (something) good in my life.
Like... >anything<. I worked hard, I sucked it up, was patient, did all the right things in a terribly harsh environment, but have almost no sense of belonging.
I get what work is. I know how to do that. ... and how to fix ANYTHING... I am extraordinarily resourceful. A true survivor type.

October... to buy, or wait for what comes next? By next May, the housing market will be in full collapse, and I imagine sailboat prices will be at rock-bottom.
Very tired of just surviving.. for what I've been through, I need to thrive a little bit. I have to figure out what to do for about 6 months (after October), while I wait for the coming collapse.

Again, October - east coast hard weather window, if not hurricane season/ that timing sucks. West coast maybe? PNW? All the Bristols are on the (east) coast...
and THAT sucks.
With every country being shut down, is sailing just broken like everything else?
*All done* not worth doing anymore? Any cool places to sail along the U.S.?
My goal has always been that beautiful clear blue water you see on every Calendar,,,, and now more than ever, a sense of belonging/ community...
I've read many good things about sailors/ sailing/ marina communities.

A bit of a rant... can you blame me?

How is the liveaboard life panning-out effective 06/12/2020?
Are folks feeling trapped in their boats?

If the world is on fire, and Great Depression 2.0 is just around the corner....
at 58, why not do it anyway? WTF? I don't want to "survive" a Great Depression, just to die without ever having lived.

Thanks for being patient with the broken hearted. Your opinions are valued, and thanks in advance. Sorry for ranting.
Bill

From Shakespeare


"Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good, we oft might win, by fearing to attempt..."
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Old 23-06-2020, 08:01   #54
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Come on in, the liveaboard water is great! Some variables are missing from your post-

- Where to you WANT to live? You can liveaboard anywhere. Some like the warmth of Mexico, some, like us, prefer the PNW, these are very different lifestyles and you can choose what you want.

- How do you WANT to live? You can liveaboard in a marina safely tied up at a dock, or you can save the bucks and live on the hook. Both have their challenges. It can be challenging to find a liveaboard spot in a marina and it can be challenging to live at anchor.

- Do you have boating experience? It is hard, but possible, without any experience, to buy a boat and become an instant liveaboard. Living on a boat is very, very different from living on land.

The boating and liveaboard community is very supportive, so don't hesitate to reach out, as you did here, for support and anything and everything.
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Old 23-06-2020, 09:02   #55
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MicHughV View Post
I don't get the point of this thread.

If you want to buy a boat to go sailing, just do it, there is no need to ask another's opinion. There are as many opinions here as is sand on the beach.

Coming here to waffle about your life, etc, is just chatter.

You won't learn anything here. You will only learn by your own experience, not the experience of others, so pull out the check book and let life take you where it wants.

There will be ups and downs, moments of glory and moments of fear, it's called life !
*
Here, here! I have to agree with that. One thing that was missed in all this.
How long did it take everybody to get the boat "just right" ?
I ask becuase the wife and I split the land life 20 years ago (at 49).
All the things we found that needed changing or in some cases repaired or replaced took quite a while. The boat isn't anything like when purchased. Remember though, it's just two people. No need for that nifty settee, it's now a nice sized bunk. Table folds out from galley sink works fine. Canvas Bimini? Nope! aluminium, and it holds the solar and antenaes too. I could go on but the point is, expect a lot of changes to take place. Expect to spend a fair amount too.
p.s. if you are 'good with you're hands', you'll be surprised at how many at the marina aren't. So ... get to work!
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Old 23-06-2020, 15:03   #56
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonali99 View Post
*
One thing that was missed in all this.
How long did it take everybody to get the boat "just right" ?
is that possible? I believe that is just when you hit the "enough" point
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Old 23-06-2020, 15:28   #57
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
How long did it take everybody to get the boat "just right" ?
Tonali 99, it depends on where you start counting from. Jim's 3rd boat was the one we sailed to HI to see if we liked ocean passages, but he'd been enjoying other boats for years! The boat we bought to go cruising in, well, we left in it, sailed one year, ran out of money (and returned and worked for another year, during which time the only modification to the boat was the addition of refrigeration.) So that's why someone needs to get sailing. Not everyone enjoys it. Levels of requirements for modern conveniences vary, too. So simpler boats are often not chosen. People choose to create their independence--or not--at a level they can handle financially, and mechanically.

The boat doesn't have to be perfect to leave, either. We met some guys from AK our first time out, had left with the interior of their Ingrid not fully fit out yet, brought their timber with them, and worked on the boat at anchor in Mexico. Eventually decided to return to AK rather than heading out into the Pacific, but they got out there and did it.

Expect life to throw you curves, and adapt.

So, the how long question is sort of like how long is a piece of string because there are so many variables. If you start from "the boat that will be the world cruiser," then, for us it was 6 yrs. between purchase and leaving the US the 2nd time. But it was 4 yrs. to leave the first time, during which time, Jim finished putting his daughter through university, and was not yet ready to leave, himself.


Ann
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Old 23-06-2020, 15:52   #58
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonali99 View Post


(...)



How long did it take everybody to get the boat "just right" ?


(...)



About 4 weeks.


We did the following:
- splashed the boat (she was on dry) (1 day),

- masted & rigged the boat (the mast was in the shed for winter) (1 day),
- recomissioned the donkey from winter lay-up (half-day),

- applied the antifouling (2 days, 4 coats),
- replaced the forestay (1 day)
- spliced two new halyards (2 hours),

- added solar panels (not a real must, but I insisted), (2 days)

- varnished external wood (12 coats) (4 days),
- then we basked and waited 2 weeks for our new yoyo to arrive from France (only because I ordered a red one).



I think that realistically 2 to 3 weeks is a bare minimum as unplanned for needs and challenges tend to pop up unexpectedly, and these may take more time than the planned ones.


I think also that only very rich people and teams of preparateurs can get any bigger boat 100% right. All other sailors are limited by budgets, time and workload constraints.


We were not, as our boat is not big.



To get a good boat just right is the easy part. And so much fun!



b.
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Old 23-06-2020, 17:02   #59
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
Tonali 99, it depends on where you start counting from. Jim's 3rd boat was the one we sailed to HI to see if we liked ocean passages, but he'd been enjoying other boats for years! The boat we bought to go cruising in, well, we left in it, sailed one year, ran out of money (and returned and worked for another year, during which time the only modification to the boat was the addition of refrigeration.) So that's why someone needs to get sailing. Not everyone enjoys it. Levels of requirements for modern conveniences vary, too. So simpler boats are often not chosen. People choose to create their independence--or not--at a level they can handle financially, and mechanically.

The boat doesn't have to be perfect to leave, either. We met some guys from AK our first time out, had left with the interior of their Ingrid not fully fit out yet, brought their timber with them, and worked on the boat at anchor in Mexico. Eventually decided to return to AK rather than heading out into the Pacific, but they got out there and did it.

Expect life to throw you curves, and adapt.

So, the how long question is sort of like how long is a piece of string because there are so many variables. If you start from "the boat that will be the world cruiser," then, for us it was 6 yrs. between purchase and leaving the US the 2nd time. But it was 4 yrs. to leave the first time, during which time, Jim finished putting his daughter through university, and was not yet ready to leave, himself.


Ann
I like the ..when you get to enough.." answer too.
*
The point I was trying to get to is when you are completely happy with what you have. Doing the interior after a passage is pretty determined I gotta say. I think most people here are blue water cruisers. Not sure of that definition but if you have to cross an ocean, I haven't. Blame spousal unit not wanting to go the N. Atlantic thing to St. Petersburg on delivery. Does Marsh Harbor to Samana count?
My short answer is about 3 or 4 years to settle in. Tried and true can be pricey. What looks cool and sounds good often isn't. Batteries and solar and inverter have to be matched for use. I ran everything for 4 days till I fired up the motor just to see. Worked fine but then too it was fall. A/C would push that to use the gen-set as would heat. Did think of the little fireplace my friend had in that St. Pete boat, but no. One of those 'cool' things' I didn't need.
One thing I do need is a derick like thing to get the dink on deck now. Whisker pole perhaps?
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Old 23-06-2020, 17:12   #60
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Re: Liveaboard Nowhere?

...if you worry....you'll die...
...if you don't worry.....you will still die...

so why worry ???
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