Liveaboard Fees - again

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Montanan

...Surely you know that proper forum decorum dictates that one should never discuss marina fees and poly ticks in the same thread.

My apologies. I didn’t mean to offend the forum gods, er, I mean mods .

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

so you think the problem is me

Well, now that you mention it, yes. Nearly all the responses have made it clear that it is within the marina's rights to charge whatever they want for living aboard, or slip rentals or cokes from the galley. You have the right to choose to not pay their rate and go somewhere else. You seem to be unwilling to accept this premise, so yes, the problem is you.



is this the be nice mod response?

This is not a moderation response, SB. I am a member of this forum just like you and have personal posting privileges just like you. I also have volunteered to spend large blocks of time helping to keep the forum on track; some members appreciate the moderation, some don't, and that's ok.

If "being nice" means agreeing with you, then no, it wasn't nice. With other definitions of nice, it passes muster IMO.

Jim

[john61ct]

++1+ amen to that

present company excepted, we see too many members dishing out all kinds of not-nice comments,

but try to provide objectively true information

counter to their incorrect misperceptions, or

whatever their personal axe-to-grind might be,

and suddenly they act like butt-hurt whining snowflakes!

present company excepted, again not referencing anyone specific

[weavis]

Well. That was a rush.

There are many things I get charged for that cannot be justified. Do I think it's fair? No, I don't!

I guess the bottom line is the question, "Do you want to be here or not?"

That was what I got when I queried a price increase last month...

One day I will rule the world and have lots of money and will ban everyone who ever ticked me off from every Marina in the universe.

It's the dreams that keep me going.

[sepeteus]

My boat lives in a marina with 100-120 other boats. The whole marina has recently been sold and new manager is pulling his hair out spending AUD40k/3 months on electricity. I can assure you that $40k is not in public lighting or boats just getting their batteries trickle charged. There are 10-15 liveaboards and they run their HWS’es, AC’s, TVs every day/night. I can just see the difference when I spend few days onboard my self.... how the 16a power supply is not enough to run my boat. There is one liveaboard who runs two 16a leads from two different socket outlets to keep all appliances running. If you argue that you don’t use any more water/power than notliveaboards.....you are kidding yourself ��

[john61ct]

Yes, crazy not to have metered electric, at a healthy profit margin per kWh.

I can see that for regular store-and-go customers, but

why would any sane businessman allow that for liveaboards?

Should definitely be strong incentives in place to encourage energy conservation these days, get people to be as self-sufficient as possible.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by sepeteus

My boat lives in a marina with 100-120 other boats. The whole marina has recently been sold and new manager is pulling his hair out spending AUD40k/3 months on electricity. I can assure you that $40k is not in public lighting or boats just getting their batteries trickle charged. There are 10-15 liveaboards and they run their HWS’es, AC’s, TVs every day/night. I can just see the difference when I spend few days onboard my self.... how the 16a power supply is not enough to run my boat. There is one liveaboard who runs two 16a leads from two different socket outlets to keep all appliances running. If you argue that you don’t use any more water/power than notliveaboards.....you are kidding yourself ������

Why is the electric not metered and charged for? In Spain, apartment rentals, boat moorings etc get the elec bill on top of the agreed rental rate. Even here in Thailand, the apartment I rent for a month, I get the electric bill separately. (Water too). Utilities are always extra.

[pkdailey4]

Hmmm... We have meters @ our dock box and our power bill is separate from the slip fee and liveaboard fee. Three different bills that average $1000 a month in total. My biggest gripe, the restrooms have single ply toilet paper. LoL

[Rorzech]

You should think of it as , you are getting a $150.00 discount on the first months rent ,instead of having to cough up first and last months rent! How can you beat a deal like that in the real world ?

[Gadagirl]

Think relatively. @$600 per month thats $20 per day! $650 not even $22 per day. You might find a cheap house with a mortgage that low, but you'd spend much more on top of that in utilities and maintenance. Do you want to live on land? You can't even find a flee bag hotel for that price! From what's been reported here you can't find an RV park for $20 per day. Hell I can't even drive on my freeway for less than that a day! Never mind having the luxury of someone else cleaning my bathroom for me. You can't rent a car that cheap per day.

If i were in your shoes, and really desired to stay an extra month? I'd suck it up and have 3-5 less meals out this month. That's relative to the price they are asking. We've all seen your budget. Sure you'd not llike to cut back on your life style and tourism but it is what it is. And yes! I am a bit jealous! I want to be in your shoes cruising! But I'd make a decision to limit other expenses, or move on, it seems to be such a 1st world complaint that it barely sparks sympathy.

[sepeteus]

Originally Posted by weavis

Why is the electric not metered and charged for? In Spain, apartment rentals, boat moorings etc get the elec bill on top of the agreed rental rate. Even here in Thailand, the apartment I rent for a month, I get the electric bill separately. (Water too). Utilities are always extra.

...... yeah........ as I wrote this manager/owner just taken over this place..... I am sure he will change all that. Myself as an electrician could install each pedestal with kw/h meters quite cheaply. He would recover that money spent in a month!

[tomdidit]

Man, there are a lot of cynics on this question both here and Sailnet. Nothing wrong with Capitalism, and certainly better than most alternatives, but saying they are gouging because they CAN is very cynical.
I would think that the answer is insurance coverage and additional costs are the true answer. Probably a insurance requirement that liveaboards are a bigger risk so after a certain time you have to cover the costs. If you asked up front a lot of people may say they are transient and not staying and then they have to deal with it later when they don't leave. I would think that you should be happy that they did not ask how long you were staying and charge you liveaboard up front. You just saved $150 and are bitching about it.
If the marina does not charge for electric by slip they have to average things out. Cost of adding individual meters is more than they can handle so they average it out. Sailorboy may be a very frugal water, electric, head, garbage, service user. If the average is higher how does a business recoup those costs unless they charge one fee for liveaboard. ACLU may be all up on them if they persecuted some air conditioning using slipholder because they think he is using more.
Someone asked how they can charge more for a slip than your LOA. I am assuming that is reference to permanent slips and not transient as most transient slips that I have used charge by boat length. Most marinas, public and private, have an assortment of slip lengths. Lets say 28, 32, 42, 60. Each of those slips has a seasonal price associated with it, and in most cases a list of names that want one of those slips. I would hope that you are not asking that if you have a 36 foot boat, and only fit in a 42' or larger slip, that you should get a discount to the 42' fee. Now, capitalism does come into play here. If it was my marina, and my list, it would be very well spelled out that your 36' boat will only fit in the 42' slip at the 42' slip fee. No discounts. If you don't think that is fair the next 30 people on the list do. Good luck. I wanted to be in a specific marina and the list was long. We have a 34' boat. Signed up for the 42' slip with 40 others and the 60' slip with 4 others. Guess which one we cleared in a year! Could have fit my 21' Sea Ray behind the sailboat. If I lived aboard there is no additional fee in this municipal marina, but it is seasonal because of weather.Happy to be here!

[svMarite]

Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3

$150 a month for showers, trash, additional water, additional electricity to run an air conditioner, toilets for two people?


What's that, $2.50 a day, each?


What's the complaint, exactly?

Sorry doesn't hold water that argument. We live aboard and shower onboarding, pay for electricity, water is nominal. I dont wash my boat everyday. We use 200gal every 3 weeks.
The power boat next to me takes 500 goals and washes his boat every weekend...
I do agree with 150/30=5 a day and that's not that bad...
Most live aboards I know shower in the clubhouse, hotwater costs, cleaning etc I get it.
We bought our slip to avoid all that. Just pay $50 HOA and tax on property. Halfed our costs.

[john61ct]

None of the "well that's capitalism get over it" commenters are IMO being cynical.

Nor are any of them using loaded words like "gouging", expressing anything is ethically wrong with raising prices, **whatever the reason** may be.

This is the way a "free" market **is supposed** to operate, and complaining about it or trying to divine the reasons for it are IMO even more useless than with "there's too much rain" or "I can't find a girlfriend".

[Mike Cunningham]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

That must be it. I went over to the office the other day to get quarters for the washing machine and the guy had to put out his cigarette to go inside to get.

In our marina, instead of causing more "drama" for the staff, the live aboards actually help out with anything from boats gone astray to over filled trash cans. Now that summer has finally arrived in New England, this weekend showed the difference between the helpful, full time live aboards and the "weekend warriors". By Sunday evening, the party crew had trashed the joint. To be fair, yes the marina population explodes exponentially on weekends and holidays, and in truth, it is only a subset of slip/mooring holders (and their guests) who are responsible for the mess, but I do not see it happening during the time frames wherein only live-aboards and some of the heavy users and fishermen are there. Your broad stroke characterization of live- aboards as some kind of burdensome drama queens is, in my experience, misplaced.