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Old 23-06-2019, 14:28   #61
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

Most marinas in the SF Bay charge for liveaboard. My first marine charged $250 a month. It's now $350 a month. I consider $150 a month to be fairly reasonable.

Of course for the last 9+years, I've not paid liveaboard fees, even though I had a slip for 8 of those years. Location, location, location.

BTW Sailorboy, welcome to the cheap sailor lifestyle....
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:29   #62
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
So, SB1, I guess that the answer to your plea isn't yet clear to you, so I'll try...

They add the surcharge to increase profitability. They do not need to explain their rationale to you. If you find it excessive, do what most long term cruisers do: don't patronize marinas. This plan not only saves the live aboard fee, it saves the larger basic fee for being there. That is a big help in balancing the budget that seems to occupy your thoughts so much.

So the problem isn't a marina problem, it is a Sailor Boy problem.

Most of us can see that...

Jim
so you think the problem is me

is this the be nice mod response?
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:31   #63
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

Several of my business clients run marinas. You would be shocked at the fees and costs associated with permits, submerged land leases, building permit design plans, insurance premiums, 24/365 on call fuel spill contractors, auditors, fire inspections, parking lot maintenance, shower / bathroom/laundry room cleaning and maintenance, electrical inspections, property taxes, water & sewer fees, solid waste collection costs,,,,,,,,seems like it never stops. And then I watch some of the long term tenants buy their beer, ice, soda up the street to save $0.25 or sneak in their own fuel in five gallon containers. If you want to be an activist, start your own marina and make a fortune!
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:31   #64
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

you know

all I did was ask the question to see if people had a logical answer to the reason

No one has expect for "because", and if that doesn't work it must be me needing attack because I asked
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:38   #65
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailorboy1 View Post
you know

all I did was ask the question to see if people had a logical answer to the reason

No one has expect for "because", and if that doesn't work it must be me needing attack because I asked

You got the logical answer.................because they can.
Why can they? ....................................because people pay it.
Logical solution to avoid paying....... don't use marinas.
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:44   #66
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by sailorboy1 View Post
you know

all I did was ask the question to see if people had a logical answer to the reason

No one has expect for "because", and if that doesn't work it must be me needing attack because I asked
SB, I donít know why you insist on taking umbrage when people give you the right answer. And I donít see anyone attacking you over the question.

Apparently itís not the response you wanted, but as someone wrote: "Don't ask if you can't handle it.Ē You should really listen to that guy .
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:44   #67
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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you know

all I did was ask the question to see if people had a logical answer to the reason

No one has expect for "because", and if that doesn't work it must be me needing attack because I asked
When a whole bunch of people all give you the same answer, many of who run businesses and literally make their living off their ability to master pricing, that is the logical answer. You don't seem to like it, but that doesn't make those telling you the truth somehow mean, petty, jealous, or unable to answer the question, all accusations you seem to have felt the need to throw out. No one is attacking you for your question, but as you can see everyone is getting a bit peeved by your attacks against those who simply provided you the correct answer to your question and your intransigence in insisting that the world conform to your personal cost plus pricing rubric. Sometimes when you're the only one who has a problem with everyone else.....you may be the problem!
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Old 23-06-2019, 14:47   #68
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

yes the correct answer is

Because

glad everyone can accept that (darn now I have to subscribe again)
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Old 23-06-2019, 15:29   #69
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

@ $5 a day I think the charge is reasonable. You're using facilities 30 days. Weekenders 8 days. Trash, electric, water, cleaning crew, maintenance crew, grounds crew, etc. Also you're taking a slip that otherwise can't be rented to a transient at a higher price. Perhaps YOU don't wash your boat once a week, but perhaps other liveaboards do, or have done. Perhaps other liveaboards enjoy a 45 minute shower each day. They aren't basing their pricing on YOUR stated frugal behavior. They are basing their pricing on a "cover my ass" expense based on worst case scenario.

@$5 a day to have a clean bathroom/ shower that I'm not responsible to clean myself? I don't have to unplug a clogged toilet? Don't have to scrub shower walls? Really? Even rental property in that price range doesn't offer me that luxury! Consider it a bargain, enjoy it! The prices are worse elsewhere as has been stated here.

I'm thinking that you are getting burned out on the sailboat cruising. You've been looking to RV'ing. Your getting concerned about your budget. Nothing wrong with any of that . Maybe cruise on down to Mexico and see if that helps your budget. IDK
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Old 23-06-2019, 15:44   #70
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by sailorboy1 View Post
There now has been pages of responses: yet no one has a reason why I can stay in my current slip living on the boat for $X, but next month it's $X+$150. If I leave (and I am) the marina now has $X to make up (in the off season)
Again, the why is not your business, we live in a society with an unfortunately high value on private property rights, commercial freedom sometimes seems to be the civil liberty prioritised highest of all.

Unless you have a contract they are violating, you have no recourse, you are "free" to take it or leave it.

Why do you have this idea of fairness in the world? That's a childhood fantasy that should be well dispelled by high school. . .
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Old 23-06-2019, 15:49   #71
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Then the marina should charge more if it is full
What is this "should"?

Buy a marina, then you get to decide your own shoulds.

Have you asked? nice and politely? They might just tell you!

Insurance is now run by algorithms, if marinas with lots of blue hulls turn out to have higher risks, they can start charging more for blue hulls, or ban them altogether. . .

Even if it is perfectly logical, they owe you no explanation. If that decision reduces their profits short term, maybe there's a long term play at stake.
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Old 23-06-2019, 15:50   #72
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post
the BEST thing you can do is move out, and tell them why you are leaving. This will send the market signal that theyíve price the service wrong.
Unless they're happy to see him gone. . .
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Old 23-06-2019, 16:05   #73
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Unless they're happy to see him gone. . .
Could be. In which case it will affirm their pricing choice.

Either way, as you and I (and most posters) agree, it’s basic market capitalism at work here. The notion that there is a “right price”, or indeed a fair price, is anathema to a market economy. There is only profit maximization.

If Americans don’t like it, they can change. I hear you’ve got a bunch of socialists running for office now .
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Old 23-06-2019, 16:06   #74
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by sailorboy1 View Post
you know

all I did was ask the question to see if people had a logical answer to the reason

No one has expect for "because", and if that doesn't work it must be me needing attack because I asked
And you received logical answers but to which you seem to take dispute which is fine to debate responses.

Well there are some reasonable economic incentive reasons to charge you a liveaboard status fee:

They have charged you for the privilege of keeping your boat on their property.

They also perceive that they can also charge you for the privilege of you keeping yourself on their property. They apparently don't perceive a good economic reason to not also charge you for the honor of your personal presence. The logic being that if you don't pay them to board yourself on their property, you will need to pay someone else to provide board for yourself and they feel that it is their due to receive such compensation.

Perhaps the question could be rephrased as: Is there a reason to not charge you for your presence on their property?
or in the alternative one could ask: Is there a reason to not not charge you?

Or maybe we are over analyzing this issue, perhaps it is just a personal thing.
Maybe they simply dislike you, because they can dislike you for any reason.

But don't take that personally.

Oops, we are back to a BECAUSE meme moment.
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Old 23-06-2019, 16:28   #75
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Re: Liveaboard Fees - again

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post
Could be. In which case it will affirm their pricing choice.

Either way, as you and I (and most posters) agree, it’s basic market capitalism at work here. The notion that there is a “right price”, or indeed a fair price, is anathema to a market economy. There is only profit maximization.

If Americans don’t like it, they can change. I hear you’ve got a bunch of socialists running for office now .
Well now there you go Mike bringing poly ticks into the thread. [many + blood sucking parasites]

But since you have broached that subject, speaking of politicians their pricing structure seems to also keep unduly escalating.

We can all likely agree that there being two basic kinds of politicians that one can purchase:

- First there is the good politician, and then there is the not so good politician.

The difference being that a good politician stays bought.

Surely you know that proper forum decorum dictates that one should never discuss marina fees and poly ticks in the same thread.
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