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Old 25-02-2020, 03:56   #16
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Originally Posted by Muaddib1116 View Post
I don't mean to hijack this thread, but what do full time/world cruisers do for insurance? Are a lot of people sailing around uninsured?
You get coverage for the area you will be in for the season, not the world. A fairly high percentage of cruisers have full hull coverage, then there is another large group that have liability only and some that go naked.

There are a lot of expensive cruising boats out there, I'd say most of them are covered. Something about a $500,000 loss versus a $30,000 loss that makes them jump through the hoops to find coverage.
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Old 06-03-2020, 16:39   #17
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Originally Posted by billknny View Post
1% is dreaming.

Expect to pay 2.5% up to 5% of agreed hull value for good coverage for a boat that is cruising--outside of hurricane zones.

There are a lot of crap policies out there; some cheap, some as expensive as good ones.

Inside hurricane zones? Good luck getting anybody to write a policy these days!
In hurricane zone ConceptRisk wrote me on a for the third year. However it is not cheap... 2.5% on agreed hull value, paid crew, in survey three survey schedule 7% deductible, 2x on deductible on named storms. Vessel must remain north of the tropic of cancer July 1 thru Nov 1. Boats is almost 30 years old now.... Aluminum hull.... it will start getting tough to find underwriters.

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Old 06-03-2020, 17:32   #18
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Re: Insurance Costs...

who sells liabilty only?......seams like a myth to me
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Old 06-03-2020, 18:31   #19
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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who sells liabilty only?......seams like a myth to me
Not a myth, but seems very hard to access. I ran an insurance survey a couple of years ago. About 15% of respondents reported having liability-only. A smaller poll ran on here last year, and the number was even higher. So it is a possibility.

But I agree, it is hard to find. The problem, as confirmed by well known boat insurance broker in another thread here, is that brokers don't like to write these policies. The reason is simple: it's not very profitable for them.

I completely understand. As was stated by this blessedly candid broker, it can take as much time and effort research and write one of these liability-only policies, as it does a full comprehensive policy. But since the broker is getting paid a commission based on the total policy amount, the income is peanuts.

So it's not the underwriters, it's the brokers. The underwriters probably don't care. They price their products based on risk. And they know the risk is low, which is why liability is so cheap. But it seems too many brokers are barriers to this product.
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Old 07-03-2020, 07:47   #20
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post
Not a myth, but seems very hard to access. I ran an insurance survey a couple of years ago. About 15% of respondents reported having liability-only. A smaller poll ran on here last year, and the number was even higher. So it is a possibility.

But I agree, it is hard to find. The problem, as confirmed by well known boat insurance broker in another thread here, is that brokers don't like to write these policies. The reason is simple: it's not very profitable for them.

I completely understand. As was stated by this blessedly candid broker, it can take as much time and effort research and write one of these liability-only policies, as it does a full comprehensive policy. But since the broker is getting paid a commission based on the total policy amount, the income is peanuts.

So it's not the underwriters, it's the brokers. The underwriters probably don't care. They price their products based on risk. And they know the risk is low, which is why liability is so cheap. But it seems too many brokers are barriers to this product.
Mike do you know of any places in Canada that do liability-only? I have been looking for a bit and I can't find any, I'm in Vancouver.
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Old 07-03-2020, 08:14   #21
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Mike do you know of any places in Canada that do liability-only? I have been looking for a bit and I can't find any, I'm in Vancouver.
Unfortunately no. I've never gone looking myself -- at least not yet. I've always been able to get comprehensive coverage at a very reasonable rate. In fact, I just switched brokers/underwriters last season, and my cost dropped by 1/3rd.

I see you're location is Vancouver. The broker I switched to is Fairway Insurance. They are based in Atlantic Canada, but I believe they've recently opened an office in Richmond, BC. So they may be serving that market now.

I've had no claims with them (have never had a claim with anyone), but so far I've been impressed with their level of service. And like I say, I saved a few hundred bucks to boot!


I'll also attach the liability-only summary report I got from that survey I conducted. It's getting pretty old, but there are a few brokers and underwriters mentioned. Maybe it will help...
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Liability-only.pdf (47.3 KB, 25 views)
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Old 11-03-2020, 14:42   #22
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Re: Insurance Costs...

Thanks for the conversation. Iíve got a related question that Iím having a hard time answering. Does homeowners or automobile claims impact your ability to obtain boat insurance/ increase rates?
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Old 11-03-2020, 15:32   #23
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Re: Insurance Costs...

FWIW, here is what we paid in the last 4 years (no claims at any time):

2016 - 0.9% agreed value, all oceans, two-crew minimum, "outside the box(es)" for storm season.

2017 - same carrier, same terms, increased to 1.4%

2018 - same carrier, required a defined voyage plan (coverage only when complying with plan), wanted three crew (got that waived), 2.3%.

2019 - while still cruising and living on the boat we are now in the US, so were able to get a coastal plan (with coverage for Hawaii - continent by specific rider) that covers US/Canada at about 0.9%.

2020 - same coastal plan, no change in premium.

From our experience and all the people we know sailing the "voyaging" plans that provide cover away from home ports and coasts have seen major premium increases in the last 5 years. The OP's 1-1.5% used to be the norm, but I don't think it is any longer for passagemakers.
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Old 11-03-2020, 18:59   #24
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Re: Insurance Costs...

Great data Dsanduril. Mine is only coastal Atlantic Canada and Great Lakes. Here I've seen a tiny but consistent decrease in my premiums year after year. When I switched broker/underwriters I actually saw about a 25% decrease.

My understanding from reading the many comments here is that many people are seeing their premiums increasing, even in the coastal coverage areas. This seems to be mostly in the eastern USA, but others have reported similar raises in the Med and the UK.
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Old 12-03-2020, 16:44   #25
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Re: Insurance Costs...

We have been underway 13 years .. only 2 insurance companies.. spent 6 years in the Med and just crossed over.. my insurance was due just before I crossed and went up by 50%. When I asked why they said the Carrib .. and that includes sailing all the Black Sea and Israel and Egypt. But still ok but I must be out of the hurricane zone . The rates is reasonable and I am with IMIS
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Old 14-03-2020, 19:27   #26
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Re: Insurance Costs...

We pay .4%. For full hull value. Full disclosure, this is only for north of Virginia, but we aren't full time cruisers yet, and we are staying up in the Chesapeake area to get comfortable with our boat. Will take off in about a year.... At the time we asked what it would cost for the Caribbean with us staying outside of the hurricane zone during the season, and was quoted 2%. I thought that was very reasonable. We currantly have a slip, so when we leave for the Caribbean, we won't have slip costs... so, we break even....
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Old 14-03-2020, 20:29   #27
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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We pay .4%. For full hull value. Full disclosure, this is only for north of Virginia, but we aren't full time cruisers yet, and we are staying up in the Chesapeake area to get comfortable with our boat. Will take off in about a year.... At the time we asked what it would cost for the Caribbean with us staying outside of the hurricane zone during the season, and was quoted 2%. I thought that was very reasonable. We currantly have a slip, so when we leave for the Caribbean, we won't have slip costs... so, we break even....
Old quotes for offshore insurance are not useful. Many underwriters have stopped covering, or gotten very picky on who and where they cover. They have all raised prices along with some reducing coverage. In a number of areas it isn't how much they charge, but more can you get coverage at all.
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Old 14-03-2020, 21:05   #28
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Old quotes for offshore insurance are not useful. Many underwriters have stopped covering, or gotten very picky on who and where they cover. They have all raised prices along with some reducing coverage. In a number of areas it isn't how much they charge, but more can you get coverage at all.
Not an old quote.. this was just from August.
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Old 14-03-2020, 21:58   #29
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Re: Insurance Costs...

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Not an old quote.. this was just from August.
I'm actively working on getting another offshore policy now as my current underwriter says they won't renew in July. So a 6 month old quote or estimate might not still be that valid.
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