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Old 08-08-2017, 19:14   #76
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

If I had a million in my pocket I'd:

1 pay somebody to sell all the crap I don't have time to sell

2. Buy a $80k Cigarette boat and run it wide open all the time everywhere till I burned through another $80k in fuel or it blew up whichever comes first

3. Buy a Cape Dory Typhoon and daysail every day for a season. The next season I'd sell it and buy a 20' catamaran and pay for the hospital bills resulting

4. Pay real archies to study and excavate Nan Madol and they'd better have some good answers


5. Maybe retire and cruise Solomon Islands. You all can keep vavau and maqueses.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:15   #77
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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1 mil will gross on a 4% return which I believe is average planning 40K a yr, 3 mil 120K.
You have to have $10,000 a month to live by yourself, assuming you have no debt?
Amen. Too many assume that you take the $ in the bank and divide it by how many days you will live. I'd like to think that I'll never quit putting our money to work for us.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:16   #78
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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I don't get the 10% of the cost of the boat per year in maintenance, that is just nonsensical.
Buy an old wore out boat for 30 K, it will only cost 3 K per year to keep up, but a new 300K boat will cost 30 K a year in upkeep?
I don't see more 3 or 4 K a year on average for a well fitted out average cruising boat.
Will someone show me a breakdown of 30 K a year in maintenance?
Not nonsensical at all, 10 years down the road you need more on certain year for refitting, new electronics, sails, equipment, overhauling engine, painting.
Some stuff you can save by doing it yourself, but I find it accurate for 10% per year when you average out and included the labor cost.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:21   #79
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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I've often thought the same thing. I chalked it up to folks that have the cash to hire absolutely everything done instead of keeping up with maintenance their selves? For example, I saw that the couple on the cat "Happy Together" had the boat delivered to San Fran. Seems to me they paid $25k for someone else to take care of the fun part, but that's just my 2 cents.
Your opinions are valid also, just that I would prefer to have a more generous estimation for stuff that need to be afloat.
Then different people have different opinions on the amount they need to walk away too.
Price of boats, materials, and labor cost doubled for the last 10 years and I expect this trend will accelerate.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:27   #80
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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Originally Posted by Tetepare View Post
If I had a million in my pocket I'd:

1 pay somebody to sell all the crap I don't have time to sell

2. Buy a $80k Cigarette boat and run it wide open all the time everywhere till I burned through another $80k in fuel or it blew up whichever comes first

3. Buy a Cape Dory Typhoon and daysail every day for a season. The next season I'd sell it and buy a 20' catamaran and pay for the hospital bills resulting

4. Pay real archies to study and excavate Nan Madol and they'd better have some good answers


5. Maybe retire and cruise Solomon Islands. You all can keep vavau and maqueses.
Vroom Vroom. I'll buy the beer.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:39   #81
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If you had a million dollars.....

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Originally Posted by Wckoek View Post
Not nonsensical at all, 10 years down the road you need more on certain year for refitting, new electronics, sails, equipment, overhauling engine, painting.

Some stuff you can save by doing it yourself, but I find it accurate for 10% per year when you average out and included the labor cost.


So every ten years you buy a new boat?
I have never seen anything that cost that much to operate that was not a special purpose vehicle as in racing etc.
No house, no airplane, no car, nothing

The average cruising boat seem to be about a 100K to 150K boat, on average.
Average cost to cruise from what I have been able to determine is about 3K to 4K on average.
I don't see average cruiser spending 10K to 15K per year on maintenance.
If you look at the few that have broken it down, I don't think you see that.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:40   #82
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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Vroom Vroom. I'll buy the beer.
Careful with that one. I made that deal on Maj, I buy the beer they buy food. My god did I lose out.
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Old 08-08-2017, 19:56   #83
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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So every ten years you buy a new boat?
I have never seen anything that cost that much to operate that was not a special purpose vehicle as in racing etc.
No house, no airplane, no car, nothing

The average cruising boat seem to be about a 100K to 150K boat, on average.
Average cost to cruise from what I have been able to determine is about 3K to 4K on average.
I don't see average cruiser spending 10K to 15K per year on maintenance.
If you look at the few that have broken it down, I don't think you see that.
Cost doubled every 10 years, a 40 footer would be 100k to 150k 10 years ago, but doubled on the market today, I don't mean the same boat or model of the boat but equivalent, 100k to 150k would be equivalent to 30 foot or 10 meter range, about the cost of 60k to 80k boat 10 years ago.
A friend just replaced his teak deck on his Oceanis for 35k, of course you can do it cheaper. You can replace your sails once every 15 years, paint once in 5 years, haul out once in 3 years, but sooner or later the big bills are going to come out.
Many of the average cruisers are average if not in bad condition.
You don't run that many hours on a plane do you? We consider 200 hours per year to be high figures for a private pilot, over that the maintenance and inspection cost can cost more than a boat of equal value.
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Old 08-08-2017, 20:04   #84
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

Once I get the "new" outboard hung on our boat, I will have spent right at 8% of what we paid for it in the first year we've owned it. That translates to 4% of the new cost. We replaced the outdoor carpet with the most expensive they had, and hired it installed. We painted new stripes, replaced the canvas, had the central air and furnace serviced, and fixed countless odds and ends. I do need to re do the gelcoat, so add another grand for the "refit". We bought a neglected boat, and have it in pretty good shape now. Not a saltwater boat, but still a boat.
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Old 08-08-2017, 20:33   #85
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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You are welcome anytime you want to come fling arrows. We have plenty of good hunting ground, and pretty well sling arrows at invasive fish(and a few gar and cats for the table) year round. I'll give you fair warning, my little girl will likely hustle you for a few bucks in some sort of an archery challenge. [ATTACH][ATTACH][ATTACH][ATTACH]Attachment 153709[/ATTACH][/ATTACH][/ATTACH][/ATTACH]
Thats awesome!!! I love to see young ones with a bow in their hands. Good on you for starting her young. I am up to the challenge and I will bring my piggy bank..
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Old 09-08-2017, 06:03   #86
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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Thats awesome!!! I love to see young ones with a bow in their hands. Good on you for starting her young. I am up to the challenge and I will bring my piggy bank..
I let her know that she has a challenger. How much longer do you have until you "finish" your refit? We'll be down in early October, and I wouldn't mind buying the beer and picking your brain a little if you have the time.
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Old 09-08-2017, 06:26   #87
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

It's silly to say the cost of maintaining a boat is 10% of the purchase cost without knowing the purchase cost. As an example a new Jeanneau 35 costing $200,000 will not cost $20,000 a year to maintain. A used Pearson 36 bought for $20,000 will cost more then $2,000 per year to maintain, possibly much more if the maintenance has been deferred. The only realistic way to approach the maintenance cost is to figure what the boat would sell for if new (ie if the Pearson 36 were new it would sell for $200,000, the same as the new Jeanneau).

So, if regular maintenance was completed on the old Pearson the cost to maintain the boat would be the same as the new Jeanneau or about 1.5~2.5% of new replacement cost or $3 to $5,000 per year. Some years little or nothing will be spent, some years multiples of the 1.5 to 2.5% will be spent. But the average over many years will be between 1.5~2.5% of the new replacement cost.

Over 16 years we have tracked our maintenance costs and they fall in line with these estimates. The work we have had done includes: new engine and generator, new sails, new instruments, new standing rigging, new hull and deck paint,.... We are averaging 1.7% (new replacement cost of the boat) annually for maintenance.
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Old 09-08-2017, 07:35   #88
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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I'll reiterate.....She's packed. I'm the "sensible" holdout. The first houseboat was her idea. The second one was her idea. I won't give her all the credit for this idea, but she gets most of it. They aren't my dreams and plans, they are our dreams and plans. We party as a family.
Funny to see you use that word. Get yourself of copy of Lew Hackler and Don Casey's book, Sensible Cruising; The Thoreau Approach.

The authors want you to go, but they want you to be sensible about it. It's not an either/or decision. You don't have to sell everything, pull the kid from school and go off into the great blue, or just stay home.

I'm going to reiterate, a million dollars is not a million dollars anymore. You're too young to walk away with a young family on it. Find a middle ground, you can do it. And read that book.
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Old 09-08-2017, 07:52   #89
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Re: If you had a million dollars.....

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I let her know that she has a challenger. How much longer do you have until you "finish" your refit? We'll be down in early October, and I wouldn't mind buying the beer and picking your brain a little if you have the time.
We are here till the first of the year. You are more than welcome aboard.Hardtop is being installed at the end of the this month, after it is on I will decided how configure solar layout. My name is Brian my email is bripepper@gmail.com
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Old 09-08-2017, 08:17   #90
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If you had a million dollars.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joli View Post
It's silly to say the cost of maintaining a boat is 10% of the purchase cost without knowing the purchase cost. As an example a new Jeanneau 35 costing $200,000 will not cost $20,000 a year to maintain. A used Pearson 36 bought for $20,000 will cost more then $2,000 per year to maintain, possibly much more if the maintenance has been deferred. The only realistic way to approach the maintenance cost is to figure what the boat would sell for if new (ie if the Pearson 36 were new it would sell for $200,000, the same as the new Jeanneau).

So, if regular maintenance was completed on the old Pearson the cost to maintain the boat would be the same as the new Jeanneau or about 1.5~2.5% of new replacement cost or $3 to $5,000 per year. Some years little or nothing will be spent, some years multiples of the 1.5 to 2.5% will be spent. But the average over many years will be between 1.5~2.5% of the new replacement cost.

Over 16 years we have tracked our maintenance costs and they fall in line with these estimates. The work we have had done includes: new engine and generator, new sails, new instruments, new standing rigging, new hull and deck paint,.... We are averaging 1.7% (new replacement cost of the boat) annually for maintenance.


This tracks close to what I would expect for starting with a refit or well kept boat, of course if everything is on it's last legs costs initially will be through the roof fixing the blown engine and the mast that fell down and Sails that blew out.


I don't know anyone that flies 200 hours a year on their own airplane.

70 hours every 6 months was minimums for a Fac 1 which is front line Army pilot, of that 70 12 could be simulator.

500 hours is a good year for a Crop Duster who has a new airplane to pay off.

200 would be a huge number of hours for a private pilot. I don't think I few that flying Professionally for the last 15 years.
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