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Old 03-09-2019, 02:33   #16
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
...Then some say ďIíve done all I canĒ and get in the car and leave, where Iím convinced that if it gets bad that there is a lot you can do to save a boat from adding / replacing chafed lines, to adjusting loose ones etc.
Itís definitely a crap shoot, however I believe to a large extent you can control the odds.
Not to be disrespectful or critical, but I very much doubt that you've tried adjusting dock lines in 100 MPH winds, never mind 185 MPH (almost 3.5 times as powerful).
Good luck, in the coming days.
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Old 03-09-2019, 03:17   #17
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Re: Hurricane Measures

You can secure the boat with as many lines as you like but if the surge lifts the dock over it's pilings and destroys it your boat doesn't have much of a chance.

This is what happened in 2004 with Hurricane Ivan's 14' - 18" surge at 3am. Not only that but then the dock with still some boat attached took out all but one of the boats that were anchored in the hurricane hole of Bayou Grande

Plus don't forget there are usually tornadoes that accompany the hurricane as it comes in. Some building were just a pile of sticks if anything was left at all

Ivan was only a 3/4 when it hit not nearly as strong as Dorian when it hit the Bahamas and stayed there. We had 10 hours of Ivan and that was enough

I must say though that Ivan didn't play around. He came straight at us...….but lost just a bit of intensity before making landfall with maybe 30' waves hitting Pensacola beach then hours later the surge 14' - 18' surge in the early am.

No power for 2 weeks if I remember correctly plus a curfew.

Everyone had to be off the streets by 4pm or so due to all the looting of the homes of those that had left the area for safety that were ripped open by the storm. This was enforced by the National Guard and police

The picture with the man on the bridge is the far side of Bayou Grande where the boats that the dock took out ended up. There were lots of dock sections there also

I lived on Bayou Grande from 1996 - 2001 and almost moved back in August 2004 to a 1st level apartment. That apartment had 8' of water in it during Ivan. The apartment building was closed for 2 years afterword.

Folks all over that were homeless had to move into FEMA trailers in these quick setup FEMA trailer parks

Also I just remembered that a friend with a Tayana 37 had his boat hauled before the storm. It was knocked off it's stands and destroyed. He had it pulled because he had no insurance

We had maybe 8 hurricanes when I was there but there was no hurricane party by those of us that had attended them in the past with the smaller Cat 1 & 2 hurricanes.
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Old 03-09-2019, 03:58   #18
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Re: Hurricane Measures

Ivan was one of the first of the new style 100 years storms that seem to be happening yearly now. The storm forecasters seemed to be proud of Ivan the way he ran for "daylight" around the western part of Cuba and lost almost none of his intensity

I think they were saying he did an end run! He was a Cat 5 then and most of the way in. The Gulf has some really warm water this time of year

We weren't so enthusiastic about that

Also, Ivan was BIG! You can run but...…..

Katrina arrived in August 2005
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Old 03-09-2019, 04:40   #19
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Not to be disrespectful or critical, but I very much doubt that you've tried adjusting dock lines in 100 MPH winds, never mind 185 MPH (almost 3.5 times as powerful).
Good luck, in the coming days.
Actually you don't need to be anywhere near those winds speeds to still be impractical to make any dock line changes. Try it at 60kts on the beam, it ain't gonna happen.
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Old 03-09-2019, 05:50   #20
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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I probably lost my boat today and am heart broken over it. But I saw it last week and know that nothing more could have been done that would have made a difference. Bad luck.
Damn. Let's hope not, Palarran. Fingers crossed it survived.
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Old 03-09-2019, 07:18   #21
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Re: Hurricane Measures

I will never forget coming down the hill, three days after Irma, into Road Town. We had not been able to get out before. About a half mile from Village Cay, I saw Jet Stream's mast, still standing, still in about the right place. We drove up, and though she had some pretty serious damage, there she was, right side up and afloat. There were hardly any others. She is my full time home and business and I had lived aboard her for 13 (now 15) years. Boats do survive, although not that many do. Best wishes for Palarran. I hope you experience the same relief I did.
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Old 03-09-2019, 07:23   #22
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Re: Hurricane Measures

Doesn't look quite so bleak now.... for the East Coast, but I can't imagine being in the
Bahamas. Looking at past hurricane tracks, they all seem to originate off the coast of Africa south of the Cape Verde Islands and sweep right down the classic Transat Route at the beginning and curl northward into the Caribbean and northward in an arc. The safest place to be in would be around Guyana or Surinam or French Guyana........ or parts south A good time to be cruising Brazil Uruguay, and Argentina....... or about anywhere in the Southern Hemisphere, or over in Europe or the UK. All of South America..east and west coasts and Southwestern Africa seem pretty immune. One couldn't choose a better home base than somewhere in South America, or Southwestern Africa, or the American west coast from CA to AK.


These things are getting worse every year more or less it seems, which follows closely with climate change, weather you are a believer or an ostrich like the guy in the White House (apologies to the ostrich), as they really do not bury their head in the sand....an old but useful myth.

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Old 03-09-2019, 07:37   #23
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Re: Hurricane Measures

Thanks for the thoughts. I don't know how many of you have been to Grand Bahama but that island is just simply unlucky. Great people and they have struggled hard to keep the place up, but every time they start to catch a break this crap happens. I simply can't imagine how they will pick up the pieces this time.
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Old 03-09-2019, 08:49   #24
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Not to be disrespectful or critical, but I very much doubt that you've tried adjusting dock lines in 100 MPH winds, never mind 185 MPH (almost 3.5 times as powerful).
Good luck, in the coming days.


Iíve not, but Iíd stay in 100 forecasted, but not 150.
There is a point to where itís futile. That is why I have Insurence, cause I recognize not every storm is survivable.
Many have Insurence to have bumps and scrapes fixed, I donít, I carry a decently large deductible cause low deductibles arenít inexpensive, but I can handle bumps and scrapes.
Total loss Iíd rather not have to ďeatĒ.

We should be fine, Iím even having the Wife stay unless it takes a non forecasted path.

Having Hurricane evacuated a couple of times, I can tell you do not take the official routes, yes they close the highway to make both sides one way, but it still becomes a parking lot, while the backroads are deserted.
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Old 03-09-2019, 15:36   #25
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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Very often the boats that donít survive were not prepped.
I swear I believe that many boat owners must be cheering for the Hurricane, mouth watering at the thought of the Insurence check.
Or they are just plain lazy, or not very smart, but sometimes just absent and wonít or canít pay someone to do the prep work, there are people of course that you can pay to do that.

To answer your question, you have a plan. That plan may consist of already having a reservation if you will for a spot on the hard, I believe some pay in advance for that privilege.
Iíve not done that, so far may plan has been to find what I consider to be a survivable Marina, one I was in in Panama City I knew wasnít so my plan then was I had a spot picked out to anchor out, and I believe some boats that did survived Michael, none in the Marina survived, and you donít get much worse than Michael.

Anyway where I am at in Jacksonville which is I hope a survivable Marina, based on history it is. Anyway most have prepped well, a few have done nothing at all, even leaving lawn furniture on deck. It seems the boats with for sale signs on them have been marginally prepped by Brokers, something that I didnít know was done, only one or two prepped by owners, and even then you donít see new dock lines.

Anyway I hope what happens is that the storm gives us a pass, and those that did nothing will walk around with an air of superiority congratulating themselves for not buying into the hype.

Iíve seen it before a few times.

Itís interesting to see how different boat types prep differently, I have yet to see a a Cat pull the main, never seen it even once, must be a real bear to do.
Most power boats donít tie in well, I think maybe that as a rule they donít understand the power of wind as well as a Sailor?
You see things that are all over the place too, one couple on a sister ship to mine, stripped everything, even the Solar panel etc., but their lines are in my mind both way undersized and not nearly enough of them.

Then some say ďIíve done all I canĒ and get in the car and leave, where Iím convinced that if it gets bad that there is a lot you can do to save a boat from adding / replacing chafed lines, to adjusting loose ones etc.

Itís definitely a crap shoot, however I believe to a large extent you can control the odds.
Your a pilot so you understand wind forces. Do you really think you can do anything effective outside in Cat 5 conditions? Are you willing to die for a boat? Is your wife?

Problem with staying based on forecasts is, as Dorian has amply illustrated, sometimes forecasts change. Ive known people who died using that logic. Ah, forecast aint so bad...then right before landfall it amps up...not uncommon with hurricanes.
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Old 03-09-2019, 18:55   #26
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Re: Hurricane Measures

Go where there are barged cranes then drive her as deep as you care into the mangroves.


Dig a hole on a high ground, place the boat in the hole.


Pray (also if an atheist).


There is a large catalog of options but yours depend on where you are.


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Old 03-09-2019, 18:55   #27
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Hurricane Measures

You know I never said anything at all about Cat 5, you guys did.
Iím 25 miles inland, west of Jacksonville, up a creek so to speak with very little fetch. Even if Jax got hit with a Cat 3 I think I would see a fraction of that.
But yes as I have lines leading to my sheet winches and to my windlass, I do think I could adjust and replace lines in pretty high winds, but maybe just as or more importantly do something about the boat beside of me that the owner didnít even send someone to, that is single lined and they look old and rotten. I did add a new line of his midship cleat to hopefully keep him connected to the dock. Or maybe fend off other boats, add a fender etc.

But no, I never said anything about riding out a Cat 5 or even close to one, that was you guys. There are lots more 1ís and 2ís that hit than 5ís, and lots of boats are damaged in those 1ís and 2ís also.
As far as forecasts, I used to say they are guesses at 24 hours out, but that has stretched to 48 hours, beyond that I think they are still guesses, made by many highly educated professionals, but still best guesses.
However the car is in the parking lot, should the forecast change or be wrong, I get in it and am way inland in a couple of hours.
Different of course if your in the Islands as there is no place to go.
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Old 03-09-2019, 20:06   #28
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Re: Hurricane Measures

So why not go to sea well ahead of the hurricane and sail for open water?

With modern electronics you can get weather reports at sea and sail to avoid the worst of the storm.

Thx-Ace
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Old 04-09-2019, 04:28   #29
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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So why not go to sea well ahead of the hurricane and sail for open water?

With modern electronics you can get weather reports at sea and sail to avoid the worst of the storm.

Thx-Ace
Because you don't want to die.

Didn't you see how many times they changed Dorian's Forecast Track?

Here's Hurricane Ivan in 2004 as an example.

Try dodging that storm.

It took up the entire Gulf and made landfall in only a 3 days after it's final turn around Cuba. How far could you sail in 3 days?

Once you've been thru one of the big ones you'll know. It's quite scary especially the pressure changes, the surge, and the gusts. For home and boat owners lots of anxiety

Then after all that the week or two without power.

For the Bahamas it could be years in some places if ever before things get back to normal
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Old 04-09-2019, 05:49   #30
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Re: Hurricane Measures

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....

Pray (also if an atheist).


...
To paraphrase: there are no atheists in a Cat 5.
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