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Old 06-02-2023, 08:55   #16
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Re: Freaked me out

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Originally Posted by Papasail View Post
A lot of heavy duty resources can go into buying a sailboat, and what he said freaked me out about it. Tell me it’s less life-threatening than he made it out to be, or that at least the payoff is worth the tough work.

Depends on your plan. From a personal safety standpoint, buying a sailboat is safe; the risks are financial. Sailing a sailboat in inland and coastal areas is (from a personal safety standpoint) safe, and the statistics bear this out.

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The risk of death and/or significant misery while crossing our oceans should not be minimized. If one looks at the actual numbers to assess the risk I am confident you will find them surprisingly high.

I agree completely except that I do not believe there are any useful statistics on the number of sailors lost on passage. The best information comes from racing (which has greater risks) and from things like ARC and other rallies that tend to draw less confident and less experienced sailors. Even so what we have is anecdotal from these sources.


There are well-found cruising sailboats on passage with capable crew that just disappear or (less often) involve known fatalities. I don't know of any source for statistics on this sort of thing, wish I did.
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Old 06-02-2023, 09:05   #17
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Re: Freaked me out

no matter how scarily things get out on the water is sometimes I know the danger pales compared to getting into the car and driving ANYWHERE
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Old 06-02-2023, 09:52   #18
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Re: Freaked me out

The vast majority of sailors and cruisers (by a long shot) are not crossing oceans or pushing the high latitudes. The data shows that what most people are doing is exceedingly safe.
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Old 06-02-2023, 10:02   #19
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Re: Freaked me out

What he said:
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Old 06-02-2023, 10:59   #20
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Re: Freaked me out

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Tell me it’s less life-threatening than he made it out to be, or that at least the payoff is worth the tough work.
From your most recent post, it sounds like you and I are on similar journeys to solo sail and cruise. For inspiration and lessons learned, I recommend the following:

Blog reading:
Bill Dietrich soloed a motor sailor for 14 years. His Magnolia's log is very informative. Start from the beginning and work your way through it. He shares every dollar he spends and, while he was extremely cheap, even I we spend 4x what he did, I should be very comfortable aboard. I had the pleasure of buying him lunch during one of he years trips back to the states. Very realistic view of what one man can do if he has the money and the courage to go it alone. One of the funniest observations to me was how, over the years, his opinion of photographing a "good looking woman" on the beach came at lower and lower in standards, if you know what I mean. (hahaha).
Excellent transparency into his limited expenditures and his careful maintenance of an old boat that lasted until . . . well, no spoilers. Enjoy.
https://www.billdietrich.me/RetireSailboat.html
https://www.billdietrich.me/Magnolia.html#LogFiles

YouTube watching:
Barry Perrins was n in his late 50's or early 60's when he began his solo cruising life. He's a British fellow with a witty sense of humor and as likeable a guy as I've ever found on YouTube. Very realistic view of solo passages, good, bad, sad and ugly. The content gets better and better with each "season." His pacific crossing may just bring you to tears and he's still out there producing content, as his circumnaviation is only half way through.
Be sure to view his episode numbers in sequential order to get the most enjoyment. Sometimes you have to page back find the very next one.
https://youtu.be/9XCpeuGOJJc

Nike (pronounced Nee-ka) is a German woman who appears to be in her 30's when she bought Karl . . . a completely distressed steel hull vessel. Her perservation and determination to clean it up and make it seaworthy was inspirational to me in that, I found myself constantly saying . . .If she can sail and live on this thing, I should have it made on what I'm planning to buy. She also has many years of content and is still out there. Her English is perfect and her Spanish, along with her native German make her quite capable of communicating throughout the Caribbean and Pacific regions. A very incredible young woman with great skill at adapting to the physical, mechanical and engineering requirements of starting with a very distressed vessel.
Again, be mindful of what season and episode you are on so that you don't accidentally jump ahead of the sequential order.


The really cool thing about these YouTubers is when you find them meeting up and interacting together in their cruising locations. I found Nike through Barry and later Barry introduced viewers to this next couple, whom I am really enjoying too!

Ran Sailing
Malin and Joran are a Swedish couple who set out from a frozen homeland when she is just 28 and he 38. They cross the North Sea, English Channel, Atlantic and Caribbean all in their first two years out there. English is not their first language but they are highly fluent (Malin especially with Swedish, English and Spanish. . . she's amazing). The first dozen or so episodes are a little clunky as the pair gets used to being on camera and speaking English every episode but it improves quickly. Joran is a highly skilled videographer and drone pilot. They probably have the highest quality videography among the three channels listed here. I'm on episode 90 and there are 334 published. They are also still out there and if the picture on their homepage is a spoiler . . . it appears she will be getting pregnant soon and they will have a thrid person aboard. Enjoy!


If after reading and watching all of this content, you're not convinced you can do this . . . you may want to consider a new path in your retirement.
Finally, if you'd like to read my planning jhourney it's also detailed here on the Cruiser's Forum under Sailors Confessional:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ds-265651.html

Best of luck. Looking forward to reading or watching your adventures one day.
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Old 06-02-2023, 11:33   #21
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Re: Freaked me out

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I can't resist...
And pretty small ones at that.

The guy was wrong. Have you ever driven on a freeway? THAT should freak anyone out. I drive on LA freeways and I am still alive. Sure, as in any venture you don't want to do something dumb, but just as you can (usually) easily avoid certain death on a freeway, the same is true on a boat. You're only going maybe 10 mph and maybe you'll get a splash in the face. With a sailboat you have TONS of weight underneath you holding the boat from flipping over. There's a lot working in your favor in a sailboat.

But there will always be folks who love to talk about the disasters and how they are lurking over every wave.

And by the way, what's wrong with 10' swells? As long as they long period and aren't breaking, they can be really fun. It really is an amazing and wondrous sight to see your whole horizon filled with huge blue-green hills that rise an fall before you, a mountainous topography that rolls across in front of you and you are able to scud up the side of one hill and slide down the face of another. I bet you will love it, not fear it, after you gain more confidence in yourself and the boat.

As you gain experience sailing, your fears will abate and your imagination of wild storms and sea monsters will calm.
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Old 06-02-2023, 14:57   #22
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Re: Freaked me out

: excited [emoji847]!
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Old 06-02-2023, 15:08   #23
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Re: Freaked me out

Thank you all….

I’ve learned this year, that the opposites are what bring those most remembered & charitable moments:

With cold toes, comes the coziness of the woodstove and a warming bench.

Hot summer days bring the refreshing jump in a seimming pool

Overcrowded cities bring the joy of natural solitude.

Hunger brings plump satisfaction.

[emoji848]When I’ve finally made it to the other side of the fence (this year), perhaps “the guy who knew a guy, who had a brother, who said it all goes bad…” will be the source of joy in a really large belly laugh when my first adventure finds me jumping in a Caribbean sea.

[emoji1598][emoji41]
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Old 06-02-2023, 15:35   #24
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Re: Freaked me out

Papasail my boy and I often repeat this mantra when we are about to do some stupid stuff.
Cheers
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Old 06-02-2023, 15:40   #25
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Re: Freaked me out

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And by the way, what's wrong with 10' swells? As long as they long period and aren't breaking, they can be really fun. It really is an amazing and wondrous sight to see your whole horizon filled with huge blue-green hills that rise an fall before you, a mountainous topography that rolls across in front of you and you are able to scud up the side of one hill and slide down the face of another. I bet you will love it, not fear it, after you gain more confidence in yourself and the boat.

As you gain experience sailing, your fears will abate and your imagination of wild storms and sea monsters will calm.
Very true. We encountered 10 foot swells as novices sailing down the West Coast of Baja California. They were more uncomfortable then scary.

It's all a matter of perspective. I have met cruisers down here that are scared of 20 Knots and 4 foot seas. They motor around in calm winds and never actually sail. Which is great if that's what you want to do.

15 knots used to worry me, but after sailing in 35 knots, 15 knots is a calm sail.

I have also met cruisers who will not leave a marina if winds are supposed to be more then 20 Knots. They are scared to anchor in that.

We were on anchor for Hurricane Kay, 60 plus knots of wind. When the winds died down to 30 knots we all went to sleep.

Your experiences are key, and will dictate your fear and what you are comfortable with. For the most part, cruising is uneventful. Don't let someone else scare you.
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Old 06-02-2023, 20:52   #26
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Re: Freaked me out

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15 knots used to worry me, but after sailing in 35 knots, 15 knots is a calm sail.
^^^^This. I'm told one always remembers one's first gale. But if something went wrong while you were coping with the gale, it might be a really neat story to tell. "Today's misfortune is tomorrow's adventure." Might even be a story you could "dine out on."

It is natural to be wary as you begin to confront the details of a new endeavor. If you are worried about the $$ costs, buy small, buy inexpensive, and first, learn if you like sailing; if you can cope with being seasick, but does the fun of it make your heart go pitty pat? After you answer those questions for yourself, and have a little sailing experience, consider what size boat, and what type of boat you want. You are in charge here, not a stranger with a scare-you story trying to keep you from your goal.

The one's who get the scary-you stories the most are young couples, sometimes with children. For some land bound people, the very idea is horrendous: no TV; no shopping; they will lack for education and enrichment; there may be pirates; there may be krakens; there may be bad foreign people. May be, should buzz!

For me the scariest thing that happened in the first 20 yrs. of our sailing together was when we were both 3 days out to see, and we came down with a flu so debilitating that we hove to, and maintained no watch for two whole days, just had the anchor light on, day and night. In the subsequent years, we did have a dangerous thing to cope with, and, it was hard, and it was scary, but it didn't leave the awful scars someone might say it would if it happened. Sometimes something happens that could go pear-shaped, but mostly, if you're reasonably alert, you put on your calm down hat and figure out how to cope.

Consider that Jim and I started sailing together coastally over 40 yrs. ago. During that time, Jim had once to go aloft at sea in 45 knots, fortunately not all the way to the masthead (broken baby stay due to crevice corrosion). Jim got really bruised up.

We had a spreaders in the water knockdown that bashed in our dodger and broke our windvane rudder. No injuries, rebuilt rudder, replaced hard dodger windows. Deciding to go towards shore, to where we could fix things, we were dismasted. And we motored in the next day. No one hurt, and we learned that we, who at that time cruised with no insurance whatsoever, were still ahead fiscally after replacing mast, running and standing rigging, the furler and the radar. Out about 10 yrs. at that point.

Broke a forestay hard (furler stress corrosion) on the wind -- turned right downwind, wrapped the sail around the foil, secured it, and sought emergengy anchorage. We had Sta-loks. Had wire shipped to us, and fixed it ourselves, with some help from the people ashore who gave us the use of their lawn to lay the furler and get the new wire through it.

We had our Solent stay furler break loose with the staysail unfurled, about 5 mi offshore, and the job was to capture and secure it before its flailing around did serious damage. No one hurt, though it was tricky to stay out of its way. The sail was trashed and repaired the furler. And that's all.

We've over 175,000 ocean miles, and years and years of exposure. So yes, there's the potential for it to be awful, but mostly, if you've got the persevering attitude, the physical strength, and like to solve problems for yourself, you're going to come out okay, and learn a bunch of interesting stuff along the way.

I agree with Mike, too, I think it's way safer than driving the freeway or being on foot in an inner city environment.

Ann
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Old 10-02-2023, 06:48   #27
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Re: Freaked me out

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On a steady (long) path to buying a sailboat.
You know when someone makes you doubt yourself, or the sanity of your dreams? That happened to me yesterday: talking to a guy: “ya know, my brother had a sailboat for years, and (bad, bad, bad), (“ten foot waves are nothing”),(“solo sailor? gonna get yourself killed!”)….

A lot of heavy duty resources can go into buying a sailboat, and what he said freaked me out about it. Tell me it’s less life-threatening than he made it out to be, or that at least the payoff is worth the tough work.

I’ve always been very competent at whatever I do…. very capable. But I just haven’t been on the other side of that fence.

Suggestions? Ideas? He’s stupid? He’s right?
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Old 10-02-2023, 06:53   #28
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Re: Freaked me out

In the late 1990s, my husband and I took our seven-year-old daughter from our stable, happy suburban Connecticut lives and careers, and followed his lifelong dream to sail away. We met a lot of people like the guy you mentioned! Our experience was almost solely on Long Island Sound, nothing offshore. I was terrified and didn't want to go. We wound up getting experienced help on our offshore runs. By the end of our three year voyage, I (well, all of us) were different people; while my husband was away, I handled the boat during Hurricane Mitch in Guatemala, something I would never have imagined at the start of the voyage. My husband is gone now, and I wouldn't have traded our sailing adventures for anything. I wrote a book about it that came out last year, Holding Fast: A Memoir of Sailing, Love, and Loss.
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Old 10-02-2023, 07:04   #29
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Re: Freaked me out

The only danger is that it will change your life immensely.
Whether for better or worse is up to you, mostly (as always). The odds are in your favor though.
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Old 10-02-2023, 07:05   #30
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Re: Freaked me out

Ha ha, love this topic....I could write a book....several books in fact, about people that told me I was crazy, dumb, stoopid, etc, etc, etc...
I put my ear flaps on and just ignore it all as rubbish.

Looking back, I have spent 35 wonderful years floating around, while the naysayers have achieved squat.
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