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john61ct · 13-02-2018, 17:37

And of course the fact that reduced deaths was a result of fewer miles driven is great.

Each result separately is a good thing, why say there's anything wrong with that?

**Dockhead** · 14-02-2018, 00:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyan

If the greatest invasion (with the largest armada) in the history of the world is merely listed among events of a "nasty mopping-up operation" .... well the best advice would be to search for that history book receipt. Hopefully it was Amazon. They are pretty easy to deal with.

He's right, though. D-Day was a spectacular operation, but it was minuscule (150,000 invaders) compared to any of the larger battles on the Eastern front, and did absolutely zero to change the outcome of the war. The Germans had long since been crushed. We did D-Day not to defeat Germany, but to ensure that the Soviets wouldn't overrun Europe completely. And it's a good thing we did, too.

**carstenb** · 14-02-2018, 05:08

Well, so far - on this thread about my wife and my impressions of sailing the east coast of the US, we had extensive discussions of:

WWII
Anchor balls
Driving laws
Speed limits
Police actions and their effect on driving habits

Guys, I realize that polite adult conversation drifts as the conversation moves forward and actually I encourage a bit thread drift - you never know what gems will come up unannounced.

But really now.........................

**TrentePieds** · 14-02-2018, 07:52

Bearing a good deal of the guilt for this exorbitant drift :-) I really do agree with Carsten: Let's get back to cruising. If anyone yearns to continue the discussion about history, private messages will do the job ;-)!

TP

**boatman61** · 14-02-2018, 08:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by carstenb

Well, so far - on this thread about my wife and my impressions of sailing the east coast of the US, we had extensive discussions of:

WWII
Anchor balls
Driving laws
Speed limits
Police actions and their effect on driving habits

Guys, I realize that polite adult conversation drifts as the conversation moves forward and actually I encourage a bit thread drift - you never know what gems will come up unannounced.

But really now.........................

Put it down to the medications.. and age induced TA..

hellosailor · 14-02-2018, 10:16

"D-Day... did absolutely zero to change the outcome of the war. "

So, you mean, the Allies could have retaken all of Europe without ever entering it? Or, that the southern invasions would have been enough? No, wait, we could have retaken it all through Russia?

The entire Allied high command was wrong to invade that way. OK, I can see that. I'm just not sure what moves would have been "righter" then.

Perhaps the thousand plane raids would have sufficed...Which choice are you suggesting?

**TrentePieds** · 14-02-2018, 12:02

Quote: "...age induced TA."

Qu'est-ce que c'est, que ça?

TP

**TrentePieds** · 14-02-2018, 12:10

Quote: "So, you mean, the Allies..."

Uhm, like, who WERE "the allies" in 1944? And just why did "Overlord" happen in 1944 and not in 1942 as Stimson and Marshall had demanded?

Let's never forget two things: Firstly that the first casualty of war is truth, and secondly that history is an amalgam of the legends of the victors, even when "the victors" are such only in their own minds :-)

TP

**Jim Cate** · 14-02-2018, 12:30

G'day Carsten,

I feel your pain, so will address your OP solely!

First, I'm always glad to hear stories of overseas visitors being well treated in the USA... and almost all such stories are favorable. I'm glad for several reasons, but the primary one is that Ann and I have been similarly well treated in all the countries to which we've cruised, and it's good to hear that the home team is doing its part.

The good news is that I suspect that you will continue to be welcomed as you sail onward, wherever you should travel. Folks seem to be interested in us yotties because we are a bit different from the regular travelers that wend their way around the globe. We've found that some are interested because they share our love for the sea, and some, say subsistence farmers in the inland hills of Fiji, are interested because they can not possibly imagine doing what we do. At any rate, showing respect for the lives of those you visit, not being demanding of their time or resources, and contributing any skills you may have as well as simple friendship will open many doors and enrich your lives as well as theirs.

Cruise on, and thanks for the great post.

Jim

cyan · 14-02-2018, 12:39

Well I guess I got confused about all those D-Day boats. Seemed kinda like a fairly big deal. Mopping up? mmmK.

More importantly, I am concerned about cruising visitors to the US not feeling welcome by uniformed folks near the border recently. As part of the crowd that warmly welcomes tourists, I am curious about the static they might now receive. This does not sound good.

**boatman61** · 14-02-2018, 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Quote: "...age induced TA."

Qu'est-ce que c'est, que ça?

TP

Transient Attention..

**TrentePieds** · 14-02-2018, 13:24

@ #191:

Thank you. Acronyms are, in general, outside my ken. Not the result of age, but of cultural background ;-)

TP

Eric50 · 14-02-2018, 13:33

As European having had the chance to work few weeks in USA, but not fortunate to sail there, I would like to add my own experience of USA in this thread:

Working on 4 continents since decades, my first rule when I go abroad is "at Rome, do like romans".

Therefore, whatever I have to deal with and that is new or difficult to me, I will not complain about it.

About the people, I experienced during 4 weeks in Morgan City, Louisiana, the most friendly and socially developed people, open arms I ever met.

I was absolutely astonished to find (although I am very familiar with anglo-saxons people due to my work) out, at the end of the day at the parking lot of the hotel that in few minutes people that were totally unknown from each others were organizing BBQ and drinks almost each end for the day and introducing themselves as it was completely natural behavior for them !

This was lasting the week, until the week after newcomers were arriving and old ones were leaving, and it started again...if that is not really living together, I don't know what it can look like ?

Another thing that astonished me is the way the police was integrated, accepted and fully part of the community : every lunch time I was in a steak house and could see 4 policemen from the city arriving and saluting everybody like they were from the same family, knowing every body first name, asking about everyone if they felt great, or had any issues, exchanging jokes before having their own lunch...I whish it could happen in my country !

So, based on my experience; American people are very nice ones, indeed and they seems to have a very good way of life. I do not ignore that this is not fantasy land as well, like any other country, but it is definitely one of the top one in the world, no doubt about it.

About the customs and procedures, it is like everywhere else in the world, this can vary, depending on which officer you'll deal with, my first concern will be to ensure that I am aware of all the rules and to stick to them. Nothing particular on that side, but it can be much worst in most of the other countries in the world...so USA is again in the top range.

About the anchoring day signal, the "ball", it is normally an international rule as I know, but they are also NOT applied in my country, or barely, on the opposite of northern country in Europe were most of the sailors are using them...So USA is may be not the best example...but they are not the only one !

About the shipyards / shipchandler, the low level of workmanship is not only in USA, you should come in my country to realize how bad and expensive it can be at the same time !!!!!

About the 6th of June 1944 and the overlord operation, I have a very special feeling about it and the American, not to forget the English, Canadian and very small amount of my fellow citizen that came that day to be killed 15 miles away from where I live in Normandy.

For me these heroes, died for my freedom, and I will never thanks them enough and never forget that, I think about them and their nations every time I am alongside the coast where everything happened, we will never be grateful enough to them.

I am not quiet sure by the way that it was a useless operation as Staline did asked many time and for a long time to have a 2nd front opened in the west, as he was felling at the verge of being defeated at some point in the conflict...who knows ?

According historians, it takes about a century to establish the truth and according Napoleon "history is lies that everybody agrees on..."

So considering all of this, I am looking forward to go back to USA with my boat this time and have the chance to spend as much as possible there and enjoy the people and the country.

On the opposite of numerous countries I have been to where I hope I will never have to go back again !!!!

sailpower · 14-02-2018, 13:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThomD

Other than that, the only anecdotes about alienation I regularly hear are from families whose kids get scholarships to US universities (our contemporaries are at that stage with their children), and discover masses of armed, rifle carrying or CCW students when they go to check out the campus, and come scurrying back home. You can imagine the kinds of places, and then you wonder "Hockey"?

Interesting. Which schools?