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Old 05-08-2019, 16:28   #1
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Chucking the diesel?

No longer blue water but just coastal cruise LA here in BC. Very weary about the old iron mainsail (noise, smell, couplers, big fuel tank, shaft, cutlass etc etc eftc etc etc etc x infinity) I was thinking of replacing the whole time consuming *&#$% apparatus with a good quality outboard (eg yamaha long shaft 9.9 hp). I am sure there has been a discussion of some sort here on CF but I did a search and could not find one. Some opinions or "link" would be very appreciated. thanks...
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Old 05-08-2019, 17:42   #2
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

how much fuel do you use?
how are you going to store that in gasoline..more dangerous than diesel..
how more weight are you going to add aft?


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Old 05-08-2019, 17:57   #3
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

OK......first you live in BC give your head a shake, a 9.9 will get you off the dock not through the passes when you miss the tide because you have a 9.9. I love to sail but in these waters motor allot of the time........even if you have unlimited time you still need to move against wind and tide more often than you like......maintain it and use it.......

I looked in detail at electric, yes it can be done, but not for the North East Pacific, or as landIes call it the PNW......suck it up buttercup.
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Old 05-08-2019, 18:13   #4
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcguy View Post
No longer blue water but just coastal cruise LA here in BC. Very weary about the old iron mainsail (noise, smell, couplers, big fuel tank, shaft, cutlass etc etc eftc etc etc etc x infinity) I was thinking of replacing the whole time consuming *&#$% apparatus with a good quality outboard (eg yamaha long shaft 9.9 hp). I am sure there has been a discussion of some sort here on CF but I did a search and could not find one. Some opinions or "link" would be very appreciated. thanks...
My opinion is you are trading a whole lot of known problems for a whole lot of unknown problems.

Here are few that come readily to mind.

Woefully underpowered - I don't know much about your 36' steel sloop but I bet it is heavy and even a 10 hp inboard would be very inadequate.

Mounting issues; I can't see any transom mount working which leaves it to mounted where / how?

Battery charging or perhaps you have a genset?

Fuel storage?


The time and effort in re-powering with unknown quantity is better spent sorting out existing issues (again just my opinion). Many of us have good iron mainsail, you can too .
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Old 05-08-2019, 19:49   #5
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

For a smaller/lighter vessel I would say sure but make sure you get a high-thrust model. Given your displacement is somewhere in the 32-40,000lb range I’m gonna say probably require some serious compromises to work.

There are 2 paths:

9.9hp High-thrust outboard. HT models have different gearing and props to optimise for speeds near 5-8kt rather than near 15-20kt. In other words they are optimised for mothership speeds rather than dinghy speeds. It’ll probably push you near 1.0xsqrt(LWL) or 75-85% hull speed in calm seas and winds. The compromise here is that you have to time all you pass transits to be near slack or to have the current with you. This is what all sailors used to do so if you are willing to bide your time it would work.

The second option is a hybrid system. Mount the outboard and use it for distance cruising.

In place of the inboard mount an electric gocart motor pushing a folding or feathering prop. A 16hp setup will cost about $2500 plus another $2k for batteries (4x firefly G31 for 48v).

At the full 16hp using 250amps you will have about 22min run time to 80%DoD.

At 10hp you will get about 36min thrust.

This is not great but for making it thru a moderate length pass against some current would work. You would need 2-3d recharging the motive batteries under decent solar conditions (4x160w panels) before you could do it again.

For the Gulf Islands some of your passes would be too long to do this against much current. You would need to time the tides for some.

For long range cruising I might consider this. For gunkholing in BC I would probably be tied to work and a schedule and this wouldn’t work for me.
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Old 05-08-2019, 23:28   #6
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcguy View Post
No longer blue water but just coastal cruise LA here in BC. Very weary about the old iron mainsail (noise, smell, couplers, big fuel tank, shaft, cutlass etc etc eftc etc etc etc x infinity) I was thinking of replacing the whole time consuming *&#$% apparatus with a good quality outboard (eg yamaha long shaft 9.9 hp). I am sure there has been a discussion of some sort here on CF but I did a search and could not find one. Some opinions or "link" would be very appreciated. thanks...
Sounds like what you are suffering from is what the French call "ennui".

The cure is to get rid of all internal combustion motive power and take up pure sail. From the sound of the place where you sail the periods of consequent high excitement interspersed with moments of sheer terror will definitely cure you.
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Old 06-08-2019, 01:00   #7
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

Oars.
And lots of galley slaves.
Plus lots of extra food and water storage - and maybe a second head.
IC engines changed the world - mostly for the much better.
Use them with the skill and care they need and they are our best friends. Turn a key, push a button, and they get us out of whatever jamb we got ourselves into.
Misuse them and don't maintain them - and they transform into a hunk of junk.
A good set of tools is a place to start.
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Old 07-08-2019, 19:59   #8
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

Wotname .... "My opinion is you are trading a whole lot of known problems for a whole lot of unknown problems"


Correct ... thanks
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Old 08-08-2019, 12:41   #9
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

Found a formula for hp per weight on sailboats. Breaks down to 1 hp per 500 lb. This is for "normal" conditions. Boat design, condition of bottom, ect. need to be taken in account. Worked out for my boat, 32 ft with a 25hp extra long shaft. Boat performs just as well as it did with the 24hp internal engine. That is when the internal was running as designed. RIP
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Old 08-08-2019, 12:51   #10
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

That’s not a formula, that’s rule of thumb for power to maintain hull speed powering into 30kt wind and waves.

If you want to figure out power to make a given speed thru flat water in calm conditions then the following graph is a good starting point. Click image for larger version

Name:	boatspeed skenes graph grid 2.jpg
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ID:	197485
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Old 08-08-2019, 13:08   #11
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

A PM from an owner of similar steel boat replaced his 3GM diesel for 9.9 yamaha long shaft outboard on a sliding gizmo to lower and raise it ... says 5 kts on flat water. "Raymond" posting above says ennui and I guess lot of truth to that. My transom (being steel) could handle 2 yammies and although ridding the boat of the diesel is still agitating my mind I will keep the diesel.
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Old 08-08-2019, 13:40   #12
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Re: Chucking the diesel?

So for certain boats of certain sizes for certain cruising demands (like mine) I am a proponent of outboards. My set-up works very well for me. But unfortunately in your case I would not recommend it at all. I'd make your diesel as tuned up, cleaned up and bomb proof as possible and then give it lots of sound proofing and Airwicks or Febreze the heck out of it and enjoy its clunky purring as it gets you around.
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