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Old 15-05-2017, 09:46   #16
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Re: Batteries and idiots

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
OK I'm going to be a little argumentative, but for a 22' boat that is only used weekends I wouldn't pop for a monitor, I would however get a good, real charger, maybe a 30 amp Sterling Pro? Take it with you to the next boat.
I think also due to the trolling motor that 4 golf cart batteries is not overkill, it is either 2 or 4 after all.
A decent voltmeter and you can gauge battery SOC accurately enough for your use in my opinion, take the monitor money and put it into a good charger.
What charger do you currently have?


Schumacher electric 15 amp/ auto switch to maintainer: 2 amp. Acts as voltmeter to a degree: last three batteries=
8.9 - leaking acid
8.7 - leakin acid
11.7. - presumed dead r/t parallel charging.

(Thank you!)
Bill
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Old 15-05-2017, 09:56   #17
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papasail View Post
Schumacher electric 15 amp/ auto switch to maintainer: 2 amp. Acts as voltmeter to a degree: last three batteries=
8.9 - leaking acid
8.7 - leakin acid
11.7. - presumed dead r/t parallel charging.

(Thank you!)
Bill
Hi Bill,

A little more info could help find a solution.

1. Leaking acid from where on the battery?

2. What size and kind of battery IE is it a group 27 or larger, how many amp hours? If you have a smaller battery 2 amps might be too much for float (maintaining battery) over a long time and could be killing them.

3. How far do you motor to get to open water? Do you need emergency, get home if the wind dies power for the motor?
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Old 15-05-2017, 10:19   #18
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Okay guys, a bit more...
You're definitely helping with my education. In my neck of the woods gas propulsion in small horsepower is hideously expensive, a little nerve wracking, (and here it comes) people steal them like candy. The goal was to begin my education, given I'll be exactly like you guys, and need to know how to manage a multifocal battery/ solar/ wind/ alternator system. (Ugh!).

I've learned from every post so far.

Batteries did not freeze, so I will presume gassing/ boiling/ loss of acid = ruination.

Batteries are not quite as far forward as i would like, but directly under compaionway door. Appropriate sized power cable to trolling motor 1/2" thick - 6'.

Have x2 new FLA batteries, and realize keeping them cool is a priority, and no lower than 50% usage (no way to know).
Debated on parralleling the two batteries, vs. "rotating" use on a trickle charge 2 amp maintainer: as previously posted (schumacher auto charge maintainer... 14 amp to switchover 2 amp).

Will an auto charger make sense for two batteries in parallel?

Rotating the batteries has reduced capacity, but offers a "backup," which I don't presently have.

Got a 5 speed trolling motor/ 3 speed reverse: very basic... my father (now out of the picture) learned how incredibly efficient they are in a national engineering challenge for electric boats.

Arkansas 104 degree summers/ zero way to cool the boat.

Distance to main body of water is 1/4 mile, with intermittent use thereafter. Have a 12"x12" solar panel switched, while trolling motor not in use... seemed to help a great deal actually.

Give votes for best shoe-string system at present. Living with what I got (and optimizing survival of the system) seems best course.

Biggest question: is trickle charger going to work on x2 parallel batteries. (Last charger was FatMax auto charger -8 amp switchover to maintainer) it's what burned up the other batteries.
Dock power/ 15' extension cord/ beefy).

Thanx all!!!
Bill
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Old 15-05-2017, 10:44   #19
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Hi Bill,

If you have room for a pair of 6V golf cart batteries, this will give you the most bang for the buck and batteries that will stand up better to deep discharge and abuse better than the 12V "Marine" batteries.

Each one is about 60 lbs and about the size of a large car battery (google GC2 battery to get the exact dimensions).

A pair in series (to give you 12V) from full charge should give you 8-10 hours of motoring if you keep it at moderate speed and still be at 50% level.

If you have the specs for the trolling motor it will tell you how many amps (average) it pulls at each speed setting. Say it draws 8 amps at middle speed range. That will be 8 amp hours if you run for one hour. 16 if you run for two hours. The 6V batteries will give you just over 200 amp hours at full charge so 100 amp hours to use to reach 50% state. That's about 12 hours running. NOTE: It will take more amp hours back in to recharge than you used running. It's an efficiency thing.

So with basic math you can come up with a rough estimate of how much of your battery capacity you used and how much you have left.
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Old 15-05-2017, 10:49   #20
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
OK I'm going to be a little argumentative, but for a 22' boat that is only used weekends I wouldn't pop for a monitor, I would however get a good, real charger, maybe a 30 amp Sterling Pro? Take it with you to the next boat.
I think also due to the trolling motor that 4 golf cart batteries is not overkill, it is either 2 or 4 after all.
A decent voltmeter and you can gauge battery SOC accurately enough for your use in my opinion, take the monitor money and put it into a good charger.
What charger do you currently have?
I think details on what charger he used would be the right place to start. Given the use it seem the most likely culprit.
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Old 15-05-2017, 11:03   #21
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papasail View Post
Schumacher electric 15 amp/ auto switch to maintainer: 2 amp. Acts as voltmeter to a degree: last three batteries=
8.9 - leaking acid
8.7 - leakin acid
11.7. - presumed dead r/t parallel charging.

(Thank you!)
Bill
I am going out on another limb and bet this charger does not have a float voltage setting, just turns the amps down, however over time if voltage is kept high it will cook a battery bank.
You could probably get by with a charge tender that does have a float voltage setting, or best would be to buy a "real" three stage battery charger.
Like this guy

Marine Battery Charger - Sterling Power Pro Charge Ultra- Power Factor Corrected Battery Charger (PFC) PCU - 10amp two bank

Shop around, you could probably get it cheaper, just in my opinion do not buy one that you cannot program a custom charge voltage
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Old 15-05-2017, 11:09   #22
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Re: Batteries and idiots

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Originally Posted by Colin A View Post
I think details on what charger he used would be the right place to start. Given the use it seem the most likely culprit.
Saw the specs in your later post. I assume the boat is plugged in while your gone? You may want to look at one of the dedicated trolling motor chargers with a 15A inlet to the boat. I have had trouble with the shumaker chargers before in the shop. I would not leave one unattended for days given some issues I have had with them.

I have used Pro mariner and Powermania small chargers with good luck on small boats.

If you do change the batts again I would seriously consider golf cart batts.
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Old 15-05-2017, 11:31   #23
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Ok so your boat is alittle bigger than mine.

Here's what I'm setting up on mine:

A). 2-12v Trojan T-1275.
B). 50w panel mounted on the companionway board.
C). PWM controller.

A) 2 batteries because that's what I think I have room for. 12v because if one battery dies I'm still getting 12v to run things. T-1275s because they are garunteed to deep cycle rather than some mis-labelled hybrid. $185 each +tax.

B). Since the boat is sitting for long periods between uses, I don't need to charge fast, so what if it takes 4d to get to full, next weekend is 5d away.

C). For panels under 200w PWM is more efficient than MPPT. And lots cheaper.

For the OP A) probably applies to you also.

If you are going to leave the boat on the dock hooked up to shore power get a small 3amp smart charger. From Sun night thru Fri night it will be able to put out 360a-hr which would be well in excess of the total capacity of the batteries.

Make sure it is a multi-step charger or it will damage you new batteries.

Alternatively you already have a solar panel. What's the rated capacity in Watts's? Let's assume 20w. That means you can expect to get about 5 or 6a-hr per day out of it.

Trolling motors get about 1lb thrust per 1amp. Let's assume you have a 27lb thrust trolling motor and you use it full power 30min going out and another 30min coming back. That's 27a-hr which is about what you get from the panel during the week. The extra 10a-hr you get on the weekends is over what you need for motoring.

A PWM controller for you panel would be about $50.
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Old 15-05-2017, 11:50   #24
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papasail View Post
Schumacher electric 15 amp/ auto switch to maintainer: 2 amp. Acts as voltmeter to a degree: last three batteries=
8.9 - leaking acid
8.7 - leakin acid
11.7. - presumed dead r/t parallel charging.

(Thank you!)
Bill
Schumacher = POS

Replace it if you don't want to kill your new batteries.

Electrical Systems 101
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Old 15-05-2017, 12:25   #25
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelie View Post
Ok so your boat is alittle bigger than mine.

Here's what I'm setting up on mine:

A). 2-12v Trojan T-1275.
B). 50w panel mounted on the companionway board.
C). PWM controller.

A) 2 batteries because that's what I think I have room for. 12v because if one battery dies I'm still getting 12v to run things. T-1275s because they are garunteed to deep cycle rather than some mis-labelled hybrid. $185 each +tax.

B). Since the boat is sitting for long periods between uses, I don't need to charge fast, so what if it takes 4d to get to full, next weekend is 5d away.

C). For panels under 200w PWM is more efficient than MPPT. And lots cheaper.

For the OP A) probably applies to you also.

If you are going to leave the boat on the dock hooked up to shore power get a small 3amp smart charger. From Sun night thru Fri night it will be able to put out 360a-hr which would be well in excess of the total capacity of the batteries.

Make sure it is a multi-step charger or it will damage you new batteries.

Alternatively you already have a solar panel. What's the rated capacity in Watts's? Let's assume 20w. That means you can expect to get about 5 or 6a-hr per day out of it.

Trolling motors get about 1lb thrust per 1amp. Let's assume you have a 27lb thrust trolling motor and you use it full power 30min going out and another 30min coming back. That's 27a-hr which is about what you get from the panel during the week. The extra 10a-hr you get on the weekends is over what you need for motoring.

A PWM controller for you panel would be about $50.
My setup is similar to the above but my 12 volt batteries which are in parallel are a mixed breed.(not recommended but I hate to discard the working $75.00 Walmart starter battery that's been on the boat for 6 years.)

One is a 12 volt starter battery (for the original diesel that's been removed) and the other is a deep cycle battery are so says the label

I have a 65 watt solar panel charging them through a 20 Amp Windy Nations Controller. It works great and you can set the float level where you want it. My old $12.00 controller always charged them to 14.4 which "they say" isn't good on the batteries except the Walmart Battery was hooked to that controller for at least 4 years.

My float voltage is at 13.6 volts at the moment

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Old 15-05-2017, 13:21   #26
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Re: Batteries and idiots

Everything you would ever want to know about battery charging with solar power:

https://handybobsolar.wordpress.com/

This (opinionated) dude come at this from the RV angle, but it's still electricity and the knowledge he shares would work equally well on a boat, perhaps with some hardware adaptations for the marine environment.
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