Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 28-09-2019, 06:17   #16
Registered User
 
boom23's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Med.
Boat: Amel 50
Posts: 989
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

It all depends on your requirements and budget. There are a lot of good (enough) ocean crossing livable monohull and cat boats out there.

My wife and I spent 3 seasons in the S Pacific on a 45ft cat. We felt safe and we were the envy of the anchorage. We had lots of room and things didnít fall off the table. But, we both didnít like the jerky motion and loud bridge deck slapping.

We now have a monohull, which has much better motion and no loud noises. But, she heels and things fall off the table. Sheís almost as livable at anchor, as far as space is concerned. Overall, we prefer the monohull.

You, and your wife, need to try both. You also need to think about maintenance. Our cat was much harder to maintain than our monohull.

Youíll figure it out. Itís a good problem to have...
boom23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 06:20   #17
Registered User
 
Fore and Aft's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Gympie
Boat: Volkscruiser
Posts: 1,476
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Heck yeah Dale I see that all the time. A lot of these newer production boats are so easy to replace components in compared to the older yachts.
It’s really the labour rates that have killed the old boat market and I think Danmlt should get the newest best maintained yacht he can afford. With a 2 year old kid I doubt he has the time to really fix anything on the yacht.
Certainly if he sticks with one hull he should be able to find something reasonably priced. I also doubt he would use the other hull in a cat for the first few years. Not many parents I know would want their kid tucked in another hull where you cannot hear them.
Cheers
Fore and Aft is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 06:21   #18
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Germany
Posts: 216
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Maybe you check the statstics what Kind of catastrophic boat failure happens Most.

Smashed windows
Lost keels
Lost riggs
Damaged hulls from hitting floating trees
Lost rudders(and SUNK) like With unprotected rudders on cats..
Ibetitsthisway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 07:16   #19
Registered User
 
Marathon1150's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Vancouver, Canada; Papeete, Tahiti
Boat: Beneteau Idylle 1150 (Papeete), Beneteau First 35s5 (Vancouver)
Posts: 337
Images: 11
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Quote:
Originally Posted by daletournier View Post

Nothing escapes age, nothing! Old boats are old, people very rarely understand just how many parts and systems make up about.

Boats age and the work that needs doing compounds with age unless the owner has constantly done what's needed.

A mate on an old boat needs to destroy his teak interior to get the black iron tank out.
I absolutely agree, "nothing escapes age" and boats live a very hard life in a very difficult environment in which we expect a lot from them. I once read that all boats are constantly self-destructing. On the other hand, some boats age better than other boats. Initial build quality and maintenance can slow but not stop the aging process.

And even really initially expensive boats will have some peculiar design features that either lead to a high risk of failure of certain systems, or are designed to make some repairs very difficult.
__________________
Desolation Island is situated in a third region, somewhere between elsewhere and everywhere.
Jean-Paul Kauffmann
Marathon1150 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 10:18   #20
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Chemainus BC
Boat: Pedrick Cheoy Lee 41 offshore, Carver 37 Explorer
Posts: 255
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Let me offer a different take. I would take my '88 41' Pedrick Cheoy Lee Offshore every day, all day long. Open, safe, comfortable, stable, fast, easy to handle by one, the extra options were 5/8" teak deck, aluminum toe rail and 2 extra coats of varnish below. During 1 year of offshore sailing, we lost a bearing from our traveler car. We also had a Monitor windvane, which is difficult for a sugar scoop stern vessel. Ask who would want their vessel back under any terms, and you may be surprised.
Greg Mason is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 10:26   #21
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: NYC and Sag Harbor NY
Boat: LeComte NE 38
Posts: 66
Images: 10
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Your dream and desire to go a good one, your cargo a precious one, and comfort, sea-kindly motion, ability to claw off a lee shore important as is good overall sailing performance in all types of weather. I am not a multi-hull person and have done some cruising in the BVI on a 50' cat which was great fun but would not be my choice for a world cruising home.

Have you looked at Sparkman and Stevens Hylas 47 or 49 (both 3 cabin and suitable for a family, or a Bristol 45.5 or 47.5 ? (these are safe, good sailing boats, well built and solid with excellent sea-kindly motion and interior comfort. (The Bristol boats also offering flexibilty in terms of shallow draft to get into those interesting a less deep harbors but with a CB for good windward performance.

There are several on the market that have had great work done by knowledgeable owners and would be available for reasonable cost.

Find your boat, follow your dream, enjoy your family, see and sail the world.

Keep us all posted on what you end up buying and best wishes!!!
__________________
P Alter - NYC - Sag Harbor, NY
LeComte NE 38
palter@skolnick.com
PAlter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 11:53   #22
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hawaii
Boat: Jeanneau SO DS 49
Posts: 275
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

I was in your shoes 6 yrs ago. My last boat was a Gulfstar 50. Loved it, but had it's 70's era problems, osmosis, bulkheads breaking, deck leaks, on and on. My new to me boat is a 07 Jeanneau 49 DS. The med is overflowing with ex charter boats for sale. It was half the price of a 40' cat. We have sailed her from Croatia to Tonga averaging 175 miles a day on our passages comfortably, on autopilot, shorthanded. The roller furled main means my wife can furl it by herself easily. She tacks though 65 degrees, (cats tack 120), never heels past 15 degrees, huge interior with windows all around. Tons of storage space, sail locker, 4 double cabins or 2 owners cabins. Huge cockpit, swim step which we board with the dingy beam to the transom. I don't see how any last century boat could be better built than a modern one. The hulls are stronger, materials better, designs light years ahead, spacious beyond belief. I was a charter cat captain and sure I love to sail at 20 kts, but on all our passages we beat every cats time that season. Even on day sails, cats are most often running an engine while sailing. A 50 cat has 1000' mainsail, thats a lot to handle. When a cat touches a reef, rudders and mini keels get damaged quickly. I just lose some paint on my cast iron.
SteveSadler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 12:00   #23
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Andy and Liza Copeland spent a number of years circumnavigating with their 3 kids on their Beneteau First 38 1985. If you do a search using their names you will get a lot of information, including links to the books they have written.
seajester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 12:06   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2018
Boat: 50ft Custom Fast Catamaran
Posts: 4,579
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveSadler View Post
I was in your shoes 6 yrs ago. My last boat was a Gulfstar 50. Loved it, but had it's 70's era problems, osmosis, bulkheads breaking, deck leaks, on and on. My new to me boat is a 07 Jeanneau 49 DS. The med is overflowing with ex charter boats for sale. It was half the price of a 40' cat. We have sailed her from Croatia to Tonga averaging 175 miles a day on our passages comfortably, on autopilot, shorthanded. The roller furled main means my wife can furl it by herself easily. She tacks though 65 degrees, (cats tack 120), never heels past 15 degrees, huge interior with windows all around. Tons of storage space, sail locker, 4 double cabins or 2 owners cabins. Huge cockpit, swim step which we board with the dingy beam to the transom. I don't see how any last century boat could be better built than a modern one. The hulls are stronger, materials better, designs light years ahead, spacious beyond belief. I was a charter cat captain and sure I love to sail at 20 kts, but on all our passages we beat every cats time that season. Even on day sails, cats are most often running an engine while sailing. A 50 cat has 1000' mainsail, thats a lot to handle. When a cat touches a reef, rudders and mini keels get damaged quickly. I just lose some paint on my cast iron.
And this is where things get really, really interesting. I have both of the boats you are describing. Except, my Gulfstar 50 is a decade newer than yours. It’s one of those very limited run Sailmaster edditions. The ones that were built heavy duty for a cruising globally. I think they only made about 15 or 16 of them.

So in my experience with the Gulfstar 50 foot boat, it’s perfect. There is absolutely nothing with it that can go structurally wrong. This thing is a tank. It also has tanks. LOL 350 gallons of water. 250 gallons of diesel. It’s a monster. It’s so much boat in 50 feet it’s crazy. It’s one of the strongest built boats I have ever stepped foot on and I have owned lots of them and been on lots of them. No deck leaks, no osmosis thanks to an epoxy barrier coat. So it’s very interesting to see our completely different experiences with what someone may call a Gulfstar 50.

And then we can move on to 50 foot catamaran. Check. Got one of those also. The reason yours was no good is it sounds like it didn’t have boards. So it can’t point at all. It sounds like it was heavy. May be a lagoon or something? Mini keels? Those boats aren't the same thing as a performance cruising catamaran. So even though it sounds like we are talking about the same pair of boats here, we are talking about two completely different sets of boats.

And I think this is what makes it so hard for someone to do the research like the OP is doing and come up with the right decision. There is just so much variability it almost comes down to the individual boat. You could find a boat from the 70s that is in perfect condition and well-built. And maybe it has been taken care of and everything works on it. Like my Gulfstar 50 sailmaster from the mid 80s.. or you could find a Gulfstar 50 just like the one you said you had. Falling apart. Bulkheads breaking. Not built well.

as far as catamarans go that’s an area of specialty knowledge. I think there are several people on this board that know a lot about it. A few of them are coming to mind right now. But there’s a lot you can do wrong in buying a catamaran. If you are looking to sail it, those heavy condomaran things are not going to work out very well. You’ll be motoring. But there are also plenty of good catamarans with Highbridge deck clearance, boards, light weight, that can outperform pretty much any Mono of similar length. Also, when it touches a reef, no damage to the catamaran. The rudders kick up, the dagger boards bounce up or break off as designed, and you are ready to go. Maybe some scratches on the bottom. It’s all on the individual boat. The one you described had a lot of design flaws.

taking all of that complexity and then trying to figure out what is most important to you is extremely difficult. I am suffering through the same thing right now. I feel I have two of the best boats I could have. But I can’t choose which one is right because The trade-offs create a case of FOMO for each decision. I would imagine that some of what the OP has trouble with as well. It’s very hard to settle on the right boat. Definitely a first world problem, no doubt, but it is difficult to figure it out.
Chotu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 13:02   #25
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Sea of Cortez
Boat: Passport 41
Posts: 213
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingssail View Post
On the other hand, with a midships boarding ladder the dingy can come along side and be held in position while one parent climbs up then can reach down to help the child.
On *other* other hand, boats with boardability at the transom also have the ability to come along side

kev_rm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 13:44   #26
MJH
Registered User
 
MJH's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: Tayana Vancouver 42ac
Posts: 660
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmlt View Post
Iíve been looking at buying a yacht/boat to live aboard with my wife and 2 Ĺ year old daughter that would take us from the Med, across the Atlantic, cruise the Caribbean, through the Panama Canal and onto the Galapagos and across the pacific visiting the many charming island it has on offer with a long stop in NZ before completing the circumnavigation past good hope and back to the med. I was raised on the water and had a 12 year career in the Superyacht industry with 10 of those years as captain. I currently own a brokerage and yacht refit company in malta so I think Iím quite clued up on yachting.
YET Iím so confused about what boat I think is best for what I want. Iím so drawn to older weíll built full keel yachts but my wife is insistent on a cat for livability. She also says if we canít afford a cat I want a Beneteau or jeanneau because they seem homely. I understand where she is coming from because a stable platform of a cat brings such comfort especially when weíd be at anchor most of the time and are not planning on testing the southern ocean apart from South Africa. To be honest I canít afford a cat at this time and donít want to wait till I can as the desire to get away from this negative corporate world is my one drive for a happy life! So the options that I have are mass production boat with comforts and space which my wife falls for( as do many people who donít understand whatís out there) or a solid boat from the 80ís that gives me peace of mind. Whenever Iíve raised a discussion within many forums I always get that Beneteauís have crossed more oceans than any other brand, yet I just have such doubts about the strength of these boats. I wish I had the cash flow to set myself up with a new solid cruiser but I am not in that position. Another issue is the transom, having a little girl I see it as a necessity from a safe boarding to and from the tender as we head to shore and back. So my point is the more I research the more confused I become. I think itís time to make a call and see what our choice is like! Iíd love your feedback positive or not!
You are between a rock and a hard place...I don't envy you your situation. On the other hand she is not against living on a boat or against a circumnavigation...yet, which has killed many a men's dreams...it could be worse.

You don't say what her sailing/boating experience is. If she is an old salt herself with offshore experience and understands what it is like crossing oceans (which you say the family is going to do) in less than ideal weather, then respect her opinion/desire. On the other hand if she doesn't you have a tremendous educational/training task before you; Mother Nature doesn't care how pretty your boat is or what the accommodations are and all of you (that's you, your wife, and boat) must be prepared for all she can present.

With a limited budget and a list a must-haves begin to look at boats, a lot of many different boats, not so much with immediate purchase in mind, but for both of you to narrow down the options and budget. Take the time to create a list depicting the boat specs, what you both like and dislike about it. With the specs include the applicable ratios and explain to her what they indicate life is going to be like i.e. Comfort and Safety. Take her to boat seminars where experienced presenters describe their voyage and questions can be asked.

What you must not do is to take your family on this circumnavigation with a boat YOU don't feel confident in or comfortable with because you will not be happy. Whichever you choose, insure you and the boat are ready.

Good Luck,

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH
MJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 13:45   #27
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Fiji Airways/ Lake Ontario
Boat: Want a B430!
Posts: 1,527
Images: 11
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Aged boats mean maintenance.

Our 1990 was bought by me when it was three years old. Iíve owned it for 25 years. I have done maintenance including replacement of most hoses, new toilet, regular filter changes etc. all hatches have been rebeded twice in 25 years, as have many deck fittings. There is not a leak in this boat, and little moisture in the deck. This is constant maintenance.

That said, itís aging. Now seeing stress cracks. The fairing compound on the keel is decaying. Two years ago a bolt wore through the aluminum fuel tank. Six days ago the prop shaft broke, then the aged headsail tore. So old stuff ages no matter how good the maintenance.
Tetepare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 13:56   #28
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 37
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

Try "Britican.com." There you will find Simon, Kim & Sierra Brown s/v Britican. They have accomplished what you are setting out to do. Kim has written several articles regarding "how to", buy a sailboat, what to look for etc... . A fountain of information. You might also look at "The Britican Experience". Tell them Jim Hughes says hello.
jhughes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 16:06   #29
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Spain
Boat: 1983 Shannon 28
Posts: 163
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

First world problem. Buy a boat you both can fall in love with. Strong build, seakindly design and a manageable rig in all conditions for one person to handle should be your priorities for offshore voyaging.


Take your time and enjoy the tire kicking. No shortage of good, solid boats for sale.
Greg K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-09-2019, 16:07   #30
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 20,485
Re: After two years of research im more confused than even on what boat is right

It is quite interesting a fact that after two years of research one can still be confused.


Clearly, your research methodology was not good.



To cut to the cheese - how about a boat like a



https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/moody-376


???


Big enuf, fast enuf, inexpensive enuf and solid enuf. ENOUGH that is. ;-)


I mean, virtually any decent boat will do, as long as it is about the amount of space that you want to have for you and your family.


Do not overthink the boat factor as in the end most of them make it.


Cheers,
b.
barnakiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
arc, boat, research

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Somehow an even more boring thread than the last! Insurance... nematon785 General Sailing Forum 8 16-02-2017 14:17
It seems the more we look and read, the more confused we get about the boat to buy! terminalcitygrl General Sailing Forum 97 12-12-2012 19:52
Is a $100k Loss on a $400k Boat in Two Years About Right ? capcook Dollars & Cents 43 14-02-2011 15:50
More Than Two Dozen Dead in Christmas Island Shipwreck GordMay Cruising News & Events 5 15-12-2010 13:45

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 23:30.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.