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Old 31-10-2021, 03:53   #226
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Originally Posted by Doge View Post
Crypto can do everything that Visa can do and everything that banks can do. Much better than banks in fact because you can transfer money between countries very easily and with very low fess. Hence it's appeal to countries like El Salvador where more than twenty percent of GDP comes from remittances from abroad. It has value because it's a better system.

If you stake your Cardano the yield will be around 6% annually. Similar for other proof of stake coins. Bitcoin and Doge use proof of work and so have no yield.

Can you explain why fiat money doesn't rely on greater fool theory? It has no intrinsic value and people can just make more of it whenever they feel like it. It doesn't even have the value of being a good system. Cardano on the other hand is a token that you need in order to use the network. If you want to use the Cardano blockchain to create an immutable record of educational achievement as Ethiopia is doing, you need to use the token.

Basically its a better system and one that doesn't rely on trusting bankers. Hence mass adoption will continue and the price will rise in the long term.

Sorry, this is incorrect. "Fiat" money is managed by central banks who control money supply and interest rates, and which are efficient media of exchange inside at least one economy.



Crypto could be an efficient medium of exchange if it were adopted by an entire economy such that prices were denominated in some coin, AND if the coin were managed by a central bank setting interest rates and regulating money supply to control inflation and deflation. But coins like Bitcoin can't serve that function because of fixed money supply. No one would hitch an economy to a currency which can't be managed. We would have 1929 every 20 years over and over again.



"Fiat" currency is cheaper and more efficient to exchange between other "fiat" currencies, especially if you are using one of the large ones like USD, EUR, Yen, and all the more if you are using good Fintech like Transferwise. Crypto has a lot more overhead. It's not "better" in this sense, either.



But the main drawback of crypto as a medium of exchange is that the value of any given crypto is not connected to anything, so you are taking FX risk with any spending you do, and very great FX risk due to the inherent volatility. If your purpose is to efficiently buy and sell stuff, you need to be in the currency in which that stuff, and the component parts of whatever you sell, is denominated. Otherwise you are just adding random FX risk into a different kind of operation. This one problem is overcome with stable coins, but what is the point of stable coins? They are less efficient to trade than the currency they are backed with, and you have risk associated with the backing mechanism. This is a toy, not an actual financial tool.


As a repository of value (the other function of money), it's like "investing" in Dutch tulips. You might make out like a badit, but some people make out in casinos, too. Not useful as a medium of exchange, no intrinsic value -- the best case scenario for coins like Bitcoin is that it could have so many holders with a stake in the value of it that it starts to behave like gold. But gold is also a poor medium of exchange and a poor repository of value, a very niche asset with a specific role in small quantities in certain kinds of portfolios. But Bitcoin has a LONG way to go -- like a few thousand years maybe -- to get to the status of gold.


So, no. Invest in real estate, good companies, best of all, your own company. Hedge currency risks if you're spending money in currencies other than your own. Stay away from the casino except with the tiniest part of your portfolio and then only just for fun.


"Trust the banks"? If the whole world economy melts down and all the banks fail, where do you think crypto will be? No where. But bank failures which could wipe out your own spending money are technically almost impossible in countries with decent central banks and deposit insurance. USD and Euro aren't going anywhere. There will be inflation now, probably, and some swings in interest rates and exchange rates, but that's life -- don't keep your assets primarily in ANY kind of money, but that's a rule for all parts of the economic cycle. Keep your assets in something with inherent value, good real estate, your own company, good shares, and diversify that portfolio. Match the risk profile of shares and bonds to the time horizon of your investment. And stop reading that tin foil hat stuff.
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Old 31-10-2021, 05:05   #227
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Re: Best investment while we travel

Man, I read through this whole thread hoping for some great tips on investing...what a bummer !

I'll just stick with trying to be diversified over multiple formats.

In other words...a little of this and a little of that, and a bit of the other thing.



I will say I have been doing pretty good with options trading.
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Old 20-12-2021, 20:36   #228
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Originally Posted by Simi 60 View Post
Cool,
No logical comeback
I win the internet's.
Our friend Doge coin is down about 20% since late sept 21... while the only crypto one would seriously consider (Bitcoin) is up 17%... that's in the last 3 months.

Member named Doge was seriously shilling a shitcoin.
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Old 21-12-2021, 07:57   #229
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Re: Best investment while we travel

The problem with Crypto (and Stocks/bonds) is that they don't CASH FLOW and there is NO tax benefits to shield income. The only way to access the cash is by selling and paying the Broker and the Tax Man - every time!

That is why the Real Estate, especially the commercial I have and recommend is great for cruisers. Steady cash flow, depreciation to reduce the tax hit and principal paydown of the loan so that you have a 'nest egg' upon return.
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Old 21-12-2021, 08:03   #230
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Originally Posted by RELENTLESS 1 View Post
The problem with Crypto (and Stocks/bonds) is that they don't CASH FLOW and there is NO tax benefits to shield income. The only way to access the cash is by selling and paying the Broker and the Tax Man - every time!

That is why the Real Estate, especially the commercial I have and recommend is great for cruisers. Steady cash flow, depreciation to reduce the tax hit and principal paydown of the loan so that you have a 'nest egg' upon return.
Of course if you're taking advantage of depreciation and your "nest egg" isn't actually losing value then you pay that same tax when you sell it. There's no free lunch there.
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Old 21-12-2021, 08:10   #231
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Re: Best investment while we travel

True, but you have appreciation - which over time keeps up with inflation. You can refinance to purchase a home, you don't necessarily have to sell and pay the gain then. Lastly, as I have told the Admiral, there is a stepped up basis upon the passing of either of us, and that means no tax on the gain/appreciation (and a new depreciation basis). Not the only way to finance the dream just a way I have found that works. Cheers
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Old 21-12-2021, 17:55   #232
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Originally Posted by RELENTLESS 1 View Post
The problem with Crypto (and Stocks/bonds) is that they don't CASH FLOW and there is NO tax benefits to shield income. The only way to access the cash is by selling and paying the Broker and the Tax Man - every time!
.
NOT true... you can have your egg and eat it too.

You can borrow CASH with Bitcoin as collateral. I did this in Feb '21, borrowing USD which was deposited in my bank within 12 hours of submitting my application.

This is a non taxable event because I did not sell my BTC.
As long as Bitcoin appreciates more than 12% by Feb '22 I can simply refinance my loan and still be in profit.
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Old 21-12-2021, 18:45   #233
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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NOT true... you can have your egg and eat it too.

You can borrow CASH with Bitcoin as collateral. I did this in Feb '21, borrowing USD which was deposited in my bank within 12 hours of submitting my application.

This is a non taxable event because I did not sell my BTC.
As long as Bitcoin appreciates more than 12% by Feb '22 I can simply refinance my loan and still be in profit.

Rooster to feather duster in the making
Seen and heard the same talk with shares.
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Old 21-12-2021, 22:55   #234
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Rooster to feather duster in the making
Seen and heard the same talk with shares.
Possibly very true, however, I was pointing out with the actual facts that it is possible to cash out (technically) without paying tax.
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Old 22-12-2021, 03:03   #235
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Re: Best investment while we travel

OP went dark after starting this thread in October 2016. I wonder if he went to cash or an annuity, the options he posed.

The DJIA was around 20,000. It is now over 35,000. NASDAQ was around 5500. It is now over 15,000.

An annuity struck when interest rates were near zero may not be an attractive return if inflation continues at an escalated rate.

Investing is so easy in hindsight. I wonder what decision the OP made, what adjustments he made over the 5 years, and what he would do different (if anything)

Peter
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Old 31-12-2021, 21:50   #236
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Re: Best investment while we travel

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Originally Posted by sailingfarmer View Post
The problem with stocks is the market is close to an all time high... the reason the stock market is so high is because of a lack of options. Bonds pay diddly and CD's worse. Stocks are very risky if the FED ever raises interest rates and takes the dollar and economy off life support. Say you buy a stock today and stocks sell off 50%.... suppose because of the week economy as a result of a crash generates less dividends or none... if you try to sell your stock you not only get less or no income but you can lose 50% of the value of your investment. That is why stocks are considered historically riskier than bonds or fixed income.
Yes. If you're a lucky dog and have a big pile of investment money in the stock market, now might be the time to get some out. ATHs are the best time to sell. It might continue to go up, most likely will over time. But the odds of it dropping are ever increasing.
For what it's worth, I would if I were lucky enough to be in your shoes, take some of that money and buy a solid property ideally in somewhere where property values are not at ATHs, and space is limited, and the trends that drive growth are likely to continue. That lesson comes from here, the properties that are in shortest supply have gone up the most in value. Flat land in the middle of nowhere with nothing around it has not. Water/Near waterfront on the other hand... at least if it's not right at sea level
I would then find a reputable AirBNB management company and hand it over to them well insured for the purpose. This reduces a lot of risks over long term tenants, as the tenants have a limited time to cause damage, the company has a vested interest in protecting your property and will have someone on scene often for changeovers.

This has 5 benefits to my mind and I WISH I could do this.
1. You have a backup plan. Cruising doesn't work out? You get too old? You get tired of it? You get hurt or sick? You have somewhere to go on land, and you know what it costs already. Property going up or down doesn't really affect this. Many people including me are now priced out of the market. I wish I'd done this at the first opportunity when I was young. I could have but got steered away by family. Live and learn.
2. Some net profit, potentially a lot of it.
3. The property isn't vacant.
4. There are many benefits to owning property, whether it is for borrowing money, insuring a boat, or as simple as the many marinas that do not want people who's home address is their boat to come and stay.
5. You yourself can use it as a respite from cruising, simply by blocking out the time in the schedule as not for rental. This can save BIG dollars when not if you need to refit/repair the boat, or want a break from life at sea.

Side note: I got in bitcoin early. Like .75c/coin early. Invested a thousand bucks because I had it into building mining rigs. Handed them over to a friend to run because he was better at software than I. We accumulated around 100 coins. I was clear that I wanted to hold onto them, anything that gets progressively harder, is unlikely to go down in value much. He then without asking spent them on something stupid, and decided the mining rigs were too much hassle...
Hindsight is 20/20. If I end up wealthy, which is bloody unlikely in this life, I will put a small % into the top 3 coins, a third each. Mostly as a hedge, crypto often does things opposite to the market, it gives me a small reserve of money in times of need if everything else goes to hell as has happened twice in my life now. Would I invest in it to make money? At an ATH? No. I think the same thoughts I had at the start still apply, if it carries on as I think it will, I will probably be looking back in anger at me now the same way I look back in anger at my friend then. But it might also do the opposite.
I would likely go:
A property I can buy outright, that I don't buy outright but finance at a locked in rate that is so cheap these days and let the AirBNB pay for it, whatever doesn't go to financing payments/a small kitty for repairs goes into the investment/cruising accounts at a 50/50 split. Leaving sufficient cash out of the market at the bank to pay for 10 years of payments no matter what the market does. I have been broken and lost everything before. Sometimes it takes many years to climb back to level ground again.
50% of the remaining balance in high yield dividend stocks with good long term reputations and consistent performance, or ETFs or managed by someone else. 10% into crypto, 10% into actual cash money, mix of prepaid credit cards, bills, precious metals. 10% into cash money stored in a safety deposit box at a different bank from my other money, in the middle of nowhere that doesn't have a high disaster rate(earthquakes/fires/weather etc). 10% into a bank in another major world power(EU/Aus/NZ). 10% to invest in higher risk/high return stocks.

I thought of that often when I was homeless after losing everything recently.

I have often believed that this was a relatively good starting point to thinking about staying secure in an insecure time in the world.
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Old 13-05-2022, 16:28   #237
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Re: Best investment while we travel

In case anyone is interested, this link is to an article in today's New York Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/12/t...ion=Technology

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