North Channel Regulatory Q's

[hamburking]

I've sailed Lake Ontario for many years, including post 9/11.
I've sailed Erie, Huron and the North Channel, but that was years ago.

In all that time, I've only ever been stopped once...the CG wanted to see our lifejackets and flares. NEVER, EVER, has anyone asked about the head.

I think it would only be an issue if you were being a drunken idiot, in which case they would be looking at any and all issues to throw at you.

Around here, the common knowledge is that the police and CG leave the sailboats alone...they are after the powerboaters, just trying to keep us all safe. Don't tell anyone, but I don't even have the required canadian boaters license, and no one has ever asked for it either.

[Ungvar]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

32 - CONVEYING LIQUOR IN VEHICLE, BOAT

Conveying liquor in vehicle, boat
(1) No person shall drive or have the care or control of a motor vehicle as defined in the Highway Traffic Act or a motorized snow vehicle, whether it is in motion or not, while there is contained in the vehicle any liquor, except under the authority of a licence or permit. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (1).
Exception
(2) Subsection (1) does not apply if the liquor in the vehicle,
(a) is in a container that is unopened and the seal unbroken; or
(b) is packed in baggage that is fastened closed or is not otherwise readily available to any person in the vehicle. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (2).
Conveying liquor in boat
(3) No person shall operate or have the care or control of a boat that is underway while there is contained in the boat any liquor, except under the authority of a licence or permit. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (3).
Exception
(4) Subsection (3) does not apply if the liquor in the boat,
(a) is in a container that is unopened and the seal unbroken; or
(b) is stored in a closed compartment. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (4).
Search of vehicle or boat
(5) A police officer who has reasonable grounds to believe that liquor is being unlawfully kept in a vehicle or boat may at any time, without a warrant, enter and search the vehicle or boat and search any person found in it. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (5).
Definitions
(6) In this section,
boat
boat includes any ship or boat or any other description of vessel used or designed to be used in the navigation of water; ("bateau")
police officer
police officer includes a conservation officer. ("agent de police") R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 32 (6); 2006, c. 34, s. 16 (47).

That's easy enough to read, if it isn't open you're cool. Pretty much agrees with what every one said.

Carraige yes, consumption no. A search can only be carried out on reasonable grounds.

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[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by hamburking

I've sailed Lake Ontario for many years, including post 9/11.
I've sailed Erie, Huron and the North Channel, but that was years ago.

In all that time, I've only ever been stopped once...the CG wanted to see our lifejackets and flares. NEVER, EVER, has anyone asked about the head.

We simply do not have the police presence in Canadian waters. CCG doesn't stop anyone for inspections, its not in their mandate. Our police presence is limited to the OPP (Ontario Provincial Police) and you rarely (haven't seen one in years) see them outside of Georgian Bay and Lakes Ontario and Erie are policed a local police departments (Toronto, Peel Region, Hamilton etc.) and they are woefully ignorant of all but the most basic laws (# of life jackets, alcohol etc.).

In 30years on the Great Lakes I've been stopped by police once and I think they just wanted a closer look at the beautiful 65' Fairline I was piloting or perhaps it was the owners gorgeous wife in a bikini that caught their eye.

In US waters it's a different story, I can't count the number of times I've been boarded in the Great Lakes all down the eastern seaboard and most particularly in Florida. In the US Great Lakes you have CG (homeland), State police, Sherrifs department, town police, county police and environmental police ...... and they all have boats. Quite often these guys stop you cause' their bored.

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by Ungvar

That's easy enough to read, if it isn't open you're cool. Pretty much agrees with what every one said.

Carraige yes, consumption no. A search can only be carried out on reasonable grounds.

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Ok but there is a kicker ....I have not been able to find it but I have seen it before. There is somewhere in Ontario statutes one rule that equates a boat with galley, marine head (with pumpout fitting) and cooking facilities to a house and specifically excludes vessels without such.

I witnessed five kids in a j24 charged under this law about five years ago. They ran the boat into the break wall at Port Credit Yacht Club and sunk it. One of them got snotty with the cop when up popped a cooler full of booze, The cop put some crime scene tape on it and told them they were being charged for carrying liquor on a boat without the requisite facilities. I have a large chunk of that boat on my website page on Moisture Meter Mythology that I use for testing and demonstrating moisture meters.

[Ungvar]

That makes sense to me Boatpoker, the accident and liquor bottle would equate to probable cause for a search.

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[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by Ungvar

That makes sense to me Boatpoker, the accident and liquor bottle would equate to probable cause for a search.

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I hesitate to bring it up here cause' you tend to get dumped on (fair enough) when you can't back it up but ...... the point I was trying to make is that somewhere in the Ontario statutes is a law that prohibits carriage or conveyance of alcohol in a vessel that does not have a head with pumpout, sleeping and galley facilities and that is the law these kids were charged under as their J24 race boat had none of these. None of the kids had been drinking but it was a mistake to get snotty with the cop.

[RogerD]

Visitor Information - Transport Canada
Transport Canada Visitor Information
Requirements for Foreign Recreational Boaters In Canadian Waters

Alcohol and Boating

Operation while impaired

Boating while impaired is an offence under the Criminal Code of Canada.
Operators with more than eighty (80) milligrams of alcohol per One Hundred (100) millilitres of blood are liable to the following fines:

• 1st offence: at least One Thousand ($1,000) fine
• 2nd offence: at least Thirty (30) days of imprisonment
• 3rd offence: at least One Hundred Twenty (120) days of imprisonment

The maximum sentence may vary depending on provincial statutes.
Consumption of Alcohol
In most provinces:
Alcohol may be consumed on board the pleasure craft only if it meets all of the following conditions:

• The vessel has permanent sleeping facilities
• The vessel has permanent cooking facilities
• The vessel has a permanent toilet
• The vessel is anchored or secured alongside a dock

Check with the appropriate provincial authorities (OPP for Ontario, SQ for Quebec, RCMP for all other provinces and territories) for carriage restrictions.




Interesting page - you should read it all - it may answer more questions.


Roger

[chp]

Originally Posted by Ungvar

Are you sure about this? Can you provide a link to legislation? Or even police or TC Boating guidance materials? What about the hundreds of cottages and island residents who use their run abouts for beer runs, cruising yachts who use there dinghies for beer runs, canoe trips who wait until their tent site to get the party started. Under what authority does the search and seizure take place? What about all the week enders out there with alcohol stoves?

I am quite certain this is an erroneous statement.

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Sorry I should have specified open liquor. Same as in a car. The reason I know this is because I was with my dad on his open power boat when we got boarded and charged for the open liquor, even though we hadn't drank any yet. Also they confiscated the beer. I'm sure that ended up going to good use. As I said I've never been even looked at on my sailboat and that is 10 years on Lake Ontario. Not even a safety check, but I've seen a lot of power boaters boarded. As for the original question about the head, I don't know of anyone who has ever been questioned about it in Ontario.

[Sailor Doug]

Sailing in Canada you will not even see a police boat. Major cities have real boats but most of the time it is only a underwhelming runabout. They day launch on weekends to keep the kids and the near shore fisherman in check. The down side is that their boats are too small to help if there is more than 15 knots.


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[seabreez]

I talked with a Canadian official who unequivocally said that if the boat is legal in its home water of the US then it will be legal for the purposes of a trip to Canada. Your head may not be legal for an Ontario citizen, but you can still visit from the US.

You might liken this to a more restrictive auto emissions law. You can still take your car to Canada.

Cars are a totally different issue but boat... beware.

A few years ago I was going to Lake Champlain and when we crossed the border to US, we were inspected and the Border Officials were looking for the "Y" valve as many Quebecers have. We came from Ontario and were legal and inspected and were good to go.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

the point I was trying to make is that somewhere in the Ontario statutes is a law that prohibits carriage or conveyance of alcohol in a vessel that does not have a head with pumpout, sleeping and galley facilities and that is the law these kids were charged under as their J24 race boat had none of these.

I'm just armchair lawyering here - there's language in the quoted regulations about the alcohol being properly secured for transit and not easily accessible... and the J24 probably wasn't going from point A to B, it was just out for a daysail (point A to point A), so the only logical reason for carrying a cooler full of iced brewskis is...

[seabreez]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

I'm just armchair lawyering here - there's language in the quoted regulations about the alcohol being properly secured for transit and not easily accessible... and the J24 probably wasn't going from point A to B, it was just out for a daysail (point A to point A), so the only logical reason for carrying a cooler full of iced brewskis is...

Here is a funny one! The police came along a fishing boat... a 16 footer and the fisherman was stopped, anchored, fishing and minding his own business. The police asked to look inside his tackle box, and there was 2 beers! The police asked if he had been or intended to drink those 2 beers? The fisherman replied; "yes" and commented that 2 beers would not take him over .08. The police said OK and left. Concluded what you wish.

[Nicholson58]

we have a couple heads, one with a tank and an AIR HEAD. Their current reg's were not written with AIRHEAD in mind but they have no problem with it. We entered the NC West end and checked in at Meldrum Bay. It was a call in -no officer. The usual questions and they didn't care that we had a modest amount more than the regulatory volume of beer & booze. You might have to prove that you were pumped out - save receipts or otherwise prove you didn't foul the water. We were never stopped or inspected by anyone.


Its difficult to do the NC without a holding tank and stay legal since its so far between pump-outs.


Plan to stop in Little current. Free dockage at the city dock until about 9:00 PM so you can hook up, get water & electric, go shopping, do laundry, get a shower.