Where to buy... vintage style nav lights....LED

[Rowglide]

I am winding down my refit, and have been trying to maintain the classic aesthetic of my Hans Christian 43ketch.
I am looking for replacement navigation lights, and want LED to keep my 12v use to a minimum. Does anyone know of a source for this type of product? I still want to be USCG compliant, so just swapping out bulbs isn’t my ideal solution.
Any suggestions?

[jt11791]

I don't understand, why can't you install LEDs in the current fixtures?

[Rowglide]

I would love to just swap out the bulbs, that would be easy and inexpensive.

But there are a bunch of reasons why I won't:
Fresnel lens not being optimized for a multi element LED bulb
Color possibly not falling into acceptable wavelengths
Angles not meeting requirements
Lights are approved/designed as a system(Housing, Lens, Bulb, Bulb Mount), changing the bulb type would void its USCG, COLREG, RINA and other type approvals.

But most important to me...
Insurance companies tend to seek a way out of payouts. In the unfortunate event of a collision, I feel confident that they would take full advantage of a Navigation light "modification" to reduce if not eliminate their obligations.

Jim

[Orion Jim]

Originally Posted by Rowglide

I would love to just swap out the bulbs, that would be easy and inexpensive.

But there are a bunch of reasons why I won't:
Fresnel lens not being optimized for a multi element LED bulb
Color possibly not falling into acceptable wavelengths
Angles not meeting requirements
Lights are approved/designed as a system(Housing, Lens, Bulb, Bulb Mount), changing the bulb type would void its USCG, COLREG, RINA and other type approvals.

But most important to me...
Insurance companies tend to seek a way out of payouts. In the unfortunate event of a collision, I feel confident that they would take full advantage of a Navigation light "modification" to reduce if not eliminate their obligations.

Jim

Wise observations. Most don't consider the negative impact of just changing a bulb in an existing fixture. You may have to go with one of the existing LED fixtures and stain or paint the housing to look less like a cookie cutter fixture. I also love bronze but know of no bronze LED fixtures on the market.

[Jack Sanford]

Contact R&W Rope in New Bedford, MA. They carry both Davey & Co. (English) and Toplicht (German). R&W is a first rate outfit, and both Davey and Toplicht supply some of the highest quality traditional marine products in the world, including navigation lights.

[rbrentp]

One can buy almost any type of LED retofit bulb on EBAY. You can get them in a variety of whites that work perfectly behind your res and green lenses. You can get the same intensity -number of LEDs - more or less as desired.

I retro fit everything into originals and they are brighter than originals and there is no other difference to the human eye. I went brighter just because and the electrical drain with all on is less than one with a previous bulb.

[rogern]

I found this on the marinebeam website: "As an end-user, and a private boat owner, there is no federal or USCG-requirement for you to have certified fixtures on your vessel. This is strictly a requirement for boat builders." If, as stated, there is no legal requirement, then I think the insurance company would have no way to deny a claim. Of course, I'm not a lawyer, so I may be wrong. JOSO

[Steadman Uhlich]

Good answers from OP and others above.

For "vintage" and "bronze" and "traditional" gear, I would also look to Schooner Chandlery (a CF member and a website store/portal), because they showcase some odd, interesting, old fashioned, and traditional type gear for older boats.

https://schoonerchandlery.com

Disclosure: I have no financial or other connection to Schooner Chandlery, I simply like their boat and their style and site.

Good luck.

[Cheechako]

Personally I think you are worrying too much about insurance companies, but hey, I dont trust them either. However, I find them to be dumb as a stick in most instances. If you must, Refit the bronze ones you have with LED's. Then put a big approved red/green new light on the pulpit for compliance concerns. Use one or the other.
Or just rebuild the sockets you have and continue to use incandescent bulbs.
I really wonder if the original lights are CG approved in the first place, so there's an out for the Insurance company anyway. If they are not marked with the approval no's they are not approved. (I have been involved with USCG compliance checks at a boat manufacturer)

[Bill Seal]

If you look around, you can probably find red and green LEDs. Far more efficient than starting with white and filtering out the wavelengths you don't want. As for as Fresnel lenses, on a sailboat they're sort of stupid, with the windward side pointing into the sky while the lee side points into the water.

[Ken Z]

Try minney s marine surplus in costa mesa ca.

[wrwakefield]

I don't know about vintage style sources...

I will mention that when faced with similar needs, I researched and bought the Marine Beam bulbs from Cruising Solutions [who were very helpful...] for my AquaSignal 40 Series deck level navigation lights. [Both bow lights have color faded lenses from time in the tropics...]

They are now proper color and much brighter than the 25W incandescent bulbs they replaced. [As you know, match the LED color with the lens, using warm white for clear lenses.]

I am not the slightest concerned that someone won't like the light sources themselves. These are bright, color correct, and effective- much more so than the clear incandescents bulbs as viewed through the faded color lenses... [Port appeared a blue-green color- for years without event- before the new LED bulb was installed.]

Stepping outside of the vintage box, if/when I have to replace our current fixtures, I will use the 3 mile [not 2 mile] visible [bright!] LED hermetically sealed units from Hella.

Best wishes finding what suites your needs.

Cheers! Bill

[Sailorbob8599]

Originally Posted by Rowglide

I would love to just swap out the bulbs, that would be easy and inexpensive.

But there are a bunch of reasons why I won't:
Fresnel lens not being optimized for a multi element LED bulb
Color possibly not falling into acceptable wavelengths
Angles not meeting requirements
Lights are approved/designed as a system(Housing, Lens, Bulb, Bulb Mount), changing the bulb type would void its USCG, COLREG, RINA and other type approvals.

But most important to me...
Insurance companies tend to seek a way out of payouts. In the unfortunate event of a collision, I feel confident that they would take full advantage of a Navigation light "modification" to reduce if not eliminate their obligations.

Jim

Well ROWGLIDE, if the Insurance companies had not given this consideration in the past, they certainly can now that you have alerted them to the differences although, I suspect they are already aware of that anyway. But why give them more ammunition and another angle to work on?

This to me, appears similar to the newscaster explaining in detail some criminal act performed by a local perp which I see only serves as a guide for other idiots who haven't the brains to figure it out for themselves. I wonder WHY newscasters have to explain in detail what kind of new drugs are being used, or how to prepare drugs for use. All they appear to be doing in my opinion is educating the uneducated in what drugs to steal from a pharmacy, or worse still, explaining to younger children how to "do" drugs.

Rest assured, Insurance people also read what others write, so why give them ideas they may not have had in the first place? Other than that, as another post noted: "on a sailboat, more often than not, your nav lights are either pointing skyward, or into the water" ... Methinks you worry too much but then, I also recall when building my last boat, I often found myself searching the chandleries for fittings "not yet designed" simply because I "wanted" one for my boat. O yes, and another fault many of us have is; Better to build it much stronger than it needs to be such as: Oversize rigging and oversize sheets etc ... WHY? well, ... just in case. We are all a bunch of worrywarts.

Having read what others have written here, my advice is, put the LED's in, stop worrying and go sailing. It's later than you think.

[hellosailor]

I doubt you would find vintage nav lights powered by LEDs, simply because no one made them new, and few retrofits have ever been given USCG testing.

There is NOTHING IN THE USCG RULES that requires you to buy them "certified" if you are a civilian recreational vessel.

You can easily try to retrofit them, and you can easily TEST the retrofit and record their compliance, so any legal or insurance questions are dismissed.

Exact spectroanalysis of the color is not going to be an issue as long as "red is red and green is green" and that is normally kept in line by using red led's in the red light, green led's in the green light. DO NOT use white led's, they will not comply.

The simplest approach is to get the brightest led's you can fit in the fixture, put them in, and then go tow, three, five miles away and see how it looks. If you can see it...well gee, that pretty much passes COLREGs. It can't be "too bright". So, yes, you have to fiddle around a bit to ensure that whatever you put in is lighting the whole sector. And you'd want to buy premium led's from a reputable source.

But if you're restoring a boat...no reason why this job should be a stopper. Odds are that when you are done, you will have something way better than any retail purchase would be. And of course, if you really are concerned about paperwork and litigation? There's nothing toi stop you from submitting your own actual lights to the USCG for testing. Simply owning "certified" lights does not diminish the more important question, as to whether whatever lights you had, were working properly at the time. Don't let the paperwork terrorize you.

[Rowglide]

Originally Posted by Sailorbob8599

Well ROWGLIDE, if the Insurance companies had not given this consideration in the past, they certainly can now that you have alerted them to the differences although, I suspect they are already aware of that anyway. But why give them more ammunition and another angle to work on?

This to me, appears similar to the newscaster explaining in detail some criminal act performed by a local perp which I see only serves as a guide for other idiots who haven't the brains to figure it out for themselves. I wonder WHY newscasters have to explain in detail what kind of new drugs are being used, or how to prepare drugs for use. All they appear to be doing in my opinion is educating the uneducated in what drugs to steal from a pharmacy, or worse still, explaining to younger children how to "do" drugs.

Rest assured, Insurance people also read what others write, so why give them ideas they may not have had in the first place? Other than that, as another post noted: "on a sailboat, more often than not, your nav lights are either pointing skyward, or into the water" ... Methinks you worry too much but then, I also recall when building my last boat, I often found myself searching the chandleries for fittings "not yet designed" simply because I "wanted" one for my boat. O yes, and another fault many of us have is; Better to build it much stronger than it needs to be such as: Oversize rigging and oversize sheets etc ... WHY? well, ... just in case. We are all a bunch of worrywarts.

Having read what others have written here, my advice is, put the LED's in, stop worrying and go sailing. It's later than you think.

Not sure, but maybe you sprinkled a bit too much paranoia on your corn flakes. I am looking for a specific item, if its not available, OK. But the only way to find out if its out there is to ask people who work and play in the industry.
Rowglide (Jim)