Where should I place the anchor roller in to be clear of the bobstay?

[Eastward ho 24]

I did add a second hole to the upper bobstay fitting to add a block for the snubber. My lower bobstay fitting is glassed in .next season I'm gonna beef that up. So I'll have the option for a bridle,lower bobstay, and block on the end of the sprit..Im gonna reaseaech a "ketle" I don't know what that is. My sprit will have 2 5/8 bolts to the deck plus the posts bolted to the aft bulkhead. With a through bolt. The sprit I'd deff waaaaay overbuilt. So I'm sure any way I choose will suffice short of ripping the whole forepeak out.( Which actually the 1/2 corecell and 1708 came today ) and recore reglassing it.i got a bucnch of money in this project with the lofrans tigress anchor, 316 sprit and sarca excel. Adding lots of weight up there crossing my fingers. I should have paid more attention to where the whisker stays ,bobstay, and old anchor roller were. Now that the boats bare and 2 hrs away I'm build the sprit at home. I think I'm gonna just put it on rig it up and the weld the roller assy. In place once it's in the water. I guess anchoring will involve some manual manipulation to get the anchor clear of the stays the best I can. I'm picturing it clanging off the bottom of the sprit underway, and being a pain in the arse to deploy and retrieve . I did have visions of sipping beer and being able to pay little attention to it when I drop and haul it. But it is what it is. Moving the roller like 6 inches off the sprit will probably give me a foul lead to the windlass any way.

[Eastward ho 24]

I'm looking at this as the mock up for location

[Eastward ho 24]

Would like to move it here for bobstay clearance but I'm scared of windlass chain fairlead angle being fouled

[Don C L]

Well, my own $.02 is to just copy what other D32s have in terms of roller location. If you are sure you won't be riding on that usually then farther out is better. BUT I should add, even if you are not going to be usually riding on that roller, it will need to be suitably strong because if/when you need to bail out of a rough anchorage, the strain will be on that while you take up on the anchor rode, at least until you are able to take off some of the strain by motoring up on it a bit. (As an aside, this is a good time to say to work out some well rehearsed and reliable hand signals for your first mate who will be helping for this, because you'll be doing it in a loud wind most likely.) I'd say you'll still be sipping beer when you let the chain out, just let it out really slowly at first. You may need to guide the anchor a bit with your free hand. I can certainly see the logic in running the snubber down through a shackle but then it comes up through the hawsehole I am assuming; THAT will need lots of chafe protection too. I don't recall those D38 hawseholes being very smooth at all. In my experience which did include some rough 3am rude awakenings, taking up on the chain and releasing the chain hook worked ok, BUT it is true, or I would agree, that it is better to be prepared to release the whole thing if needed. BTW, I never considered the snubber to be of value in shock absorption; it is so thick and short it didn't offer much. The weight of the chain's catenary is the source of shock absorption IMO. A kellet might be of help there, but it is more complication to deal with if things get rough. Better to let out more scope. And hauling in a kellet from a bowsprit... I'd have to think about that one.
BTW how is the roller going to be supported on the outside? Are you going to weld a frame for it on there? Just eyeballing it it looks like you could get away with 3" I guess, but will it be well supported out that far from the sprit?

[groundtackle]

Eastward guy, excellent work so far and thanks for bringing a common issue fwd.This is exactly how things are devolved.
My thoughts.. get the roller as close to CL and aft and as possible. Shift the windlass to stbd or indexed exactly inline once the roller position is cemented. The bobstay conflict is happening regardless of the location fwd or aft, so bring that roller aft and inboard for strength. Watch the whisker stay interference or anything else. I'd need or we need more pics.
Get the whole sprit thing up off the ground on sawhorses or higher. Tack weld on the roller axle shaft and start playing with up and down. Move the position around. You have a perfect and real time opportunity to work bugs out. Welcome to my world and that is how we do it, I personally don't know another way.
Lets help Eastward to end up with the best bow roller he can.
We could all talk about snubbers and sprits after he gets this roller correct...or now too.
Chris

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by groundtackle

This is exactly how things are devolved.

Umm, sure you didn't mean to say "evolved?"

You know I agree it is better to get it as far aft as possible and in line for strength, and I certainly defer to you on all this, but I am just thinking of those times when you're hauling up on the anchor and the bow, moving to stbd for whatever reason causes the chain to drag under and hang up on the bobstay. There must be some kind of geometrically calculated sweet spot in there, not too close and not too far out, to take that into account(?)

[groundtackle]

Oops,yes spel chek. Devolved thankfully is a word.
Sprits, bobstays, anchor rodes and conflicts are synonymous.
I'd believe you design that roller position without concern for the bobstay, pretend its not there. The bobstay must be strong though. I prefer to use a fixed length solid rod, no wire. Something that can take that abuse.
Chris

[roverhi]

Would agree, put the roller as far aft as possible and have the chain and anchor still clear the bow. The anchor is weight you don't need way out front. All weight saved in the ends improves sailing performance going to weather by reducing boats tendency to hobby horse. Yes there will be times when the boat yaws into the chain when you're trying to retrieve it but that will be momentary. Hold off hauling the rode till the bow shears in the other direction and then continue hauling. If the roller is more than a foot out the bowsprit it will be further out than almost any anchor roller on a non bowsprit boat.

[Eastward ho 24]

Thank you thank you I think this is all coming together. With the clipper bow and a relatively short sprit. Doesn't leave much room for fore and aft but I will keep it as aft as possible. I'm going to go ahead and design it as if the "bobstay isn't there". I have some 3.5" SS c channel I'm gonna weld a kicker out then run a piece fwd. A 1/2" through bolt will run through this, the delrin roller,and through the sprit then bolted. But for now it's back to the job. I'll keep posting my progress. I'm sure I'll have some more questions and I thank everyone here for all the help. Id also like to thank groundtackle which is who I bought my Excel anchor from ,and has gone above and beyond help in coustomer service, and answering lots of unrealted questions.

[sailah]

When I built my bowsprit I added an extra hole below where bobstay attaches to hull fitting. I think it was 1/2" but I can't remember. I haven't used it for anchoring yet but that's why I put it on there. I would have been more happy to have the hull fitting wrap the hull more but I was unable to achieve that with water tank under V berth. The upper bolt goes through stem and is 1/2" 316. The lower bolt goes thru sampson post and is a 1/2"-13x12 316 bolt again.

I just don't like the idea of sideloading it although I feel it is pretty strong.

I'll probably build a bridle snubber as a backup and try it this summer

[hpeer]

I skipped the above responses, short time to respond. I have a 44’ steel cutter and replaced the sprit with a SS sprit just as you are doing. With the old sprit the anchors came up near centerline near the bow. A huge PITA! We anchor out a lot and surely don’t need that hassle.

I moved the rollers forward and outboard. I drew it up in a CAD program and laid in a variety of new generation anchors and made sure they would fit.

Now I have a 125’ Mantus, which has a monsterous roll bar and launching and retrieving the anchor is a treat. Not suggesting you over do he anchor as I did, just describing what is possible. I’ll try to post a pic.

[groundtackle]

Nice work sailah, shiny. One trick with Tig is to use smaller filler rod, I like .035" and feed it fast.
Been experimenting myself and with others with that waterline attachment point. Dead ending the snubber down there, then thru a low friction ring attached to the chain claw (or soft shackle) then back onboard the foredeck fairlead / hawse / friction ring. Ultimately back to cleat or even better all the way aft like a furling line might run, to a winch. Now that stem fitting load would be half. Always pros and cons.

Talking with Eastward ho and discussing adding another roller higher aft and dropping the fwd one.
Chris

[Eastward ho 24]

I assume a chain gypsy is sensivite to a foul fairlead? By moving it outward did it foul up?

[hpeer]

A couple more

[sailah]

Originally Posted by groundtackle

Nice work sailah, shiny. One trick with Tig is to use smaller filler rod, I like .035" and feed it fast.
Been experimenting myself and with others with that waterline attachment point. Dead ending the snubber down there, then thru a low friction ring attached to the chain claw (or soft shackle) then back onboard the foredeck fairlead / hawse / friction ring. Ultimately back to cleat or even better all the way aft like a furling line might run, to a winch. Now that stem fitting load would be half. Always pros and cons.

Talking with Eastward ho and discussing adding another roller higher aft and dropping the fwd one.
Chris

Thanks Chris, I'm an amateur TIG welder but I enjoy the practice.

After I was done, I buffed everything and then set the lot out to be electropolished which is what makes it shiny.