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**a64pilot** · 05-03-2014, 13:56

My understanding is chain plates on an IP are next to impossible to replace as they are glassed in. I'm sure this boat was rarely sailed, and probably never sailed very hard. (it's never had an autopilot, nor a windlass) I'll inspect the chain plates as well as I can during survey, and if I find no evidence of corrosion I'll eave them alone until I plan on beginning my cruising, if I find evidence of corrosion, I'll almost certainly walk away from the boat. Price I have offered does not include a complete re-fit.
I'll be learning sailing slowly with this boat, not venturing very far until I can afford to retire, then if this is the boat for me, I'll re-fit her for serious cruising, and if not put her up for sale.

**HappyMdRSailor** · 05-03-2014, 14:07

Well...

As long as you're on the high side of the budget.... You might as well go all in, and fit carbon rod....

FSMike · 05-03-2014, 16:30

SSMR, Inc. St. Petersburg, Fl. Had my last boat (Allied Seawind Mk. II ketch) rerigged there and was quite pleased. Too senile to remember the cost.

jcapo · 05-03-2014, 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Any good contacts for getting rigging replaced in South Fl? East or West side? Or should I wait until I get her home in Panama City and find someone there?

Christian Dam. He works alone so you only pay for one guy. His hourly was less than $100 in 2010 and worth it. He was based in Hollywood at that time and may still be. He will travel to the keys and further north.

Dam Rigging

Paul L · 06-03-2014, 02:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

My understanding is chain plates on an IP are next to impossible to replace as they are glassed in. I'm sure this boat was rarely sailed, and probably never sailed very hard. (it's never had an autopilot, nor a windlass) I'll inspect the chain plates as well as I can during survey, and if I find no evidence of corrosion I'll eave them alone until I plan on beginning my cruising, if I find evidence of corrosion, I'll almost certainly walk away from the boat. Price I have offered does not include a complete re-fit.
I'll be learning sailing slowly with this boat, not venturing very far until I can afford to retire, then if this is the boat for me, I'll re-fit her for serious cruising, and if not put her up for sale.

How hard the boat was sailed has little to do with the state of the chainplates. I'm not sure what issues you see that make you you think the standing rigging needs replacing, but I can't see spending the money on new standing rigging and not know the state of the chainplates. Why not save the money and do the re-rig before you set off cruising and do the chainplates at the same time. There is a company who is mobile (out of Texas I think) and pretty much all they do is IP chainplate replacements. Have you asked this question on the IP owners site.

**a64pilot** · 06-03-2014, 04:14

Guy's
Thanks for the info. I'm assuming the standing rigging is original is why I think it needs replacing, but I have zero sailboat experience so I'm having to rely on others opinions. Another assumption is if I pay to have it inspected, any rigger will condemn it based on age if nothing else, so at that point I believe I have paid for an inspection that I knew what the results would be before hand, and have painted myself into a corner insurance wise? My understanding was I'd be better off not paying for an inspection and just going ahead and replace the 27 yr old standing rigging.
Chain plate wise I'm under the understanding that two things cause their replacement, fatigue and corrosion. Fatigue of course from being sailed often and hard, and corrosion from neglect. I believe I can get a good enough look visually to give an opinion corrosion wise.
Or should I go ahead and NDI the swedge fittings on the deck myself (I'm a level II aircraft NDI Tech and have the equipment and knowledge necessary) and keep the old rigging in place (if I find no cracks) until we get ready to go out cruising at which point everything is replaced? This boat will spend the next few years being lightly sailed in good weather around the panhandle area of Florida in the Gulf.
I've not yet asked anything on any IP owners site. It's not even my boat yet, survey is Mon. the 10th

**HappyMdRSailor** · 06-03-2014, 05:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Guy's
Thanks for the info. I'm assuming the standing rigging is original is why I think it needs replacing, but I have zero sailboat experience so I'm having to rely on others opinions. Another assumption is if I pay to have it inspected, any rigger will condemn it based on age if nothing else, so at that point I believe I have paid for an inspection that I knew what the results would be before hand, and have painted myself into a corner insurance wise? My understanding was I'd be better off not paying for an inspection and just going ahead and replace the 27 yr old standing rigging.
Chain plate wise I'm under the understanding that two things cause their replacement, fatigue and corrosion. Fatigue of course from being sailed often and hard, and corrosion from neglect. I believe I can get a good enough look visually to give an opinion corrosion wise.
Or should I go ahead and NDI the swedge fittings on the deck myself (I'm a level II aircraft NDI Tech and have the equipment and knowledge necessary) and keep the old rigging in place (if I find no cracks) until we get ready to go out cruising at which point everything is replaced? This boat will spend the next few years being lightly sailed in good weather around the panhandle area of Florida in the Gulf.
I've not yet asked anything on any IP owners site. It's not even my boat yet, survey is Mon. the 10th

Mr. Pilot,

Here's my take... You're going to have a surveyor out.... Although he will say he's not qualified for a rig inspection, ask him to to include a general inspection in his list... If he thinks it's so unsafe that it merits replacing or a further inspection, then call the rigger de jeur... Have him come out and tell you what needs replacing by getting a quote...

Chainplates fail by corrosion.... The fatigue loads without corrosion present are not even part of the equation... You can ND all you want... If you find a problem, then you can address it... Your major places for probable failure will be in "non-testable" regions...

I'll investigate IP plates and see what I can add....

BTW... I think this is an awesome fit for you boat pick wise!

Tar34 · 06-03-2014, 06:18

Island Packet boats have a history of failed chain plates. The plates are embedded and glassed into the hull. Plenty of pictures if you just Google. Since the plates are essentially outboard as it relates to sail trim, I might consider external plates with with a backing plate. Benefits would be, less expense, new plates, easy install, easy inspection, current plates supplemental attachment points for other rigging, peace of mind. I don't think this would really compromise the look or sailing characteristics of the IP 38. Just a thought.

**a64pilot** · 06-03-2014, 06:24

MdrSailor,
I'm leaning more towards what you are saying, with the idea of pretty much replacing everything before we head full time.
My instructions for my inspector is I've told him his job is to show me why I shouldn't buy this boat. He mission is to find problems.
I have a six month old insurance survey for the boat that says rigging is fine, seller provided it, but it's obviously a "drive by" survey meant to not find anything.

**a64pilot** · 06-03-2014, 06:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tar34

Island Packet boats have a history of failed chain plates. The plates are embedded and glassed into the hull. Plenty of pictures if you just Google. Since the plates are essentially outboard as it relates to sail trim, I might consider external plates with with a backing plate. Benefits would be, less expense, new plates, easy install, easy inspection, current plates supplemental attachment points for other rigging, peace of mind. I don't think this would really compromise the look or sailing characteristics of the IP 38. Just a thought.

Actually I had thought of this, but never thought about leaving existing chain plates in, I assumed they would need to come out so they wouldn't be in the way of mounting the new plates?

Lojanica · 06-03-2014, 06:28

Pick the mast. Tangs and such may need work. Spreaders same. As far as wire have it cut and swaged on the top and leave the bottom long by a foot. When you put the mast up use a couple old wires to reattach to chainplates. Then all the other wires can be cut exactly and the sta-locs installed. After they are all perfect go up the mast and change out the last 2.

You'll save time and money picking the mast unless you're just changing a couple.

Lastly you'll save money by hiring a good rigger as they will know all these tricks. If you can help them it'll save you money as you and your friends can be the labor and they can be the foreman.

Tar34 · 06-03-2014, 06:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Actually I had thought of this, but never thought about leaving existing chain plates in, I assumed they would need to come out so they wouldn't be in the way of mounting the new plates?

They would be difficult to remove. Really no benefit to remove them other than cosmetic. Keep and use them....lightly...they are difficult to inspect...

**HappyMdRSailor** · 06-03-2014, 06:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tar34

Island Packet boats have a history of failed chain plates. The plates are embedded and glassed into the hull. Plenty of pictures if you just Google. Since the plates are essentially outboard as it relates to sail trim, I might consider external plates with with a backing plate. Benefits would be, less expense, new plates, easy install, easy inspection, current plates supplemental attachment points for other rigging, peace of mind. I don't think this would really compromise the look or sailing characteristics of the IP 38. Just a thought.

This is a brilliant solution!

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

MdrSailor,
I'm leaning more towards what you are saying, with the idea of pretty much replacing everything before we head full time.
My instructions for my inspector is I've told him his job is to show me why I shouldn't buy this boat. He mission is to find problems.
I have a six month old insurance survey for the boat that says rigging is fine, seller provided it, but it's obviously a "drive by" survey meant to not find anything.

Honestly... My gut feeling is ... I think you're going to be able to put off this expense for a few years....

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Quote:

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