"Self Etching Primer" for epoxy?

[Chotu]

I have areas that are rough and other areas that are glass smooth inside my epoxy hull. These occur within the same 1sq ft section of hull surface.

I need to use something to beautify the boat interior surface of the hull, which is typically sanding any shiny epoxy, then putting a mixture of epoxy and low density filler and colloidal sillica in place. Used like sheetrock mud/bog. Then sanding smooth and painting.

However, I CAN'T BE AROUND WET EPOXY OR ANY EPOXY DUST anymore.

So, I need to find alternatives. Is there some way to chemically etch epoxy similar to how that can be done with aluminum?

I'm putting polyester over epoxy for cosmetics like this. It sticks, but not incredibly well. You can peel it with a huge force. If I have glass smooth epoxy to cover, it's going to be a very tenuous bond, if any.

Ideas for this?

[jimbunyard]

For cosmetic applications, I'd just use a scotchbright and water or water/vinegar, followed by straight water. Epoxy has tenacious bonding properties, as anyone who's casually scraped the excess epoxy-based putty off putty knives onto the nearest convenient flat surface and then tried to remove (after it cured) should know.

Or you could, though I wouldn't, have never tried, and don't recommend it, wiping it with a liquid epoxy remover, something like this, https://www.esslinger.com/attack-epo...r-and-cleaner/ letting that dry, and then painting.

Its (and others like its) principal components are generally toxic and/or carcinogenic, highly volatile and easily absorbed through skin; most require at least full-face carbon-filter respirators; some require supplied-air respirators.

Given your current problems with epoxy exposure, anything more than 'a coat of paint and a see-how-long-it-sticks' seems almost overkill...

[Chotu]

That’s a pretty good idea about scotch bright and vinegar and water.

What happens to me is when I break the epoxy polymer by dry sanding it is it realeases some amines from the polymer and that's enough to knock me on my @$$ for a couple days with a anaphylactic reaction.

However, if I used chemical proof gloves (I definitely use a supplied air respirator these days), I could wet sand with vinegar which would neutralize any free amines. All in all that's some good thinking.

Also keeps the boat free of the epoxy dust (assuming it's all cleaned before it dries), which means I can continue to work inside.

[Rucksta]

Have you considered vinyl ester resin?

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Rucksta

Have you considered vinyl ester resin?

No. The chemistry is very close to epoxy. In fact, vinylester is a kind of epoxy in a way.

I am using polyester now.

But the entire boat is already built out of epoxy. So I need to bond some things (like smoothing work, painting)!to the interior of the hull so it looks nice.

[mlydon]

Are you sure the hull is epoxy? Most are Fiberglas......

In any case, proper bonding requires ‘tooth’ - no way around that. Perhaps you need to get someone to do it for you.....

Matt

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by mlydon

Are you sure the hull is epoxy? Most are Fiberglas......

In any case, proper bonding requires ‘tooth’ - no way around that. Perhaps you need to get someone to do it for you.....

Matt

Pretty sure the hull is epoxy. I infused the hulls myself and mixed every drop of resin for the connectives.

This is why I'm allergic to epoxy.

But yeah. Trying to figure out alternative methods of getting that tooth or some miracle self etching chemical to create microscopic tooth. The vinegar wet sand sounds fairly safe since any free amines would be instantly destroyed as they come out of the polymer. And no dust.

I’d love to hire someone to do the entire thing. However, there is no one available at this time. I have talked to many custom builders, low hourly people, you name it. Everyone’s busy.

[Jim Cate]

I'm not a big fan of such, but in your case perhaps some form of "wall paper" would eliminate this problem, or at least reduce the areas that would be painted. Adhesive backed veneer or other thin material would stick to the glossy epoxy just fine.

I seem to remember that you were going to hire a chap from CF to help out. I take it that this didn't work out.

Keep up the struggle, mate! Your determination is admirable.

Jim

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

I'm not a big fan of such, but in your case perhaps some form of "wall paper" would eliminate this problem, or at least reduce the areas that would be painted. Adhesive backed veneer or other thin material would stick to the glossy epoxy just fine.

I seem to remember that you were going to hire a chap from CF to help out. I take it that this didn't work out.

Keep up the struggle, mate! Your determination is admirable.

Jim

Thanks Jim. You were right. Maybe a veneer would work. I will have to test that.

I was going to hire the guy from here on the forum. He was expecting a little more than I could offer in terms of housing and a car. I did not have all of that available on top of the boat build.

[captlloyd]

Have you considered an automotive type body filler ?

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by captlloyd

Have you considered an automotive type body filler ?

Definitely trying that out. That’s polyester. Bondo is polyester

[keyway]

Right or wrong I have used bondo and spot glazing compound over epoxy above the waterline. Seems to work fine. There is a fair amount of sanding throughout The process of course. Full body protection suits and vapor respirators help a lot. I try to do the work then get out and decontaminate immediately. Back to the bondo. After a good scrubbing with soap scotchbrite and water. I will prime the epoxy before I apply the bondo. All said and done I prefer epoxy based fairing coumpond. It sands easier than bondo.Have a good one

[Tusitala]

I've been on a few European boats that the owners finished or refinished where they used polypropylene fabric on the hull sides and bulkheads. There was a bit of foam on the back and was glued in place, probably with contact cement of some sort. actually looked good, and hid a ton of rough spots. I'll see if I have any interior pictures of the boats.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by keyway

Right or wrong I have used bondo and spot glazing compound over epoxy above the waterline. Seems to work fine. There is a fair amount of sanding throughout The process of course. Full body protection suits and vapor respirators help a lot. I try to do the work then get out and decontaminate immediately. Back to the bondo. After a good scrubbing with soap scotchbrite and water. I will prime the epoxy before I apply the bondo. All said and done I prefer epoxy based fairing coumpond. It sands easier than bondo.Have a good one

Agreed. The epoxy is way better. This is all interior work. The exterior is done and it's all epoxy. This is just areas inside the hull that need to be smooth and white to look pretty.

Thanks for the point of view and experience using Bondo polyester. I'll give it a shot and see.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Tusitala

I've been on a few European boats that the owners finished or refinished where they used polypropylene fabric on the hull sides and bulkheads. There was a bit of foam on the back and was glued in place, probably with contact cement of some sort. actually looked good, and hid a ton of rough spots. I'll see if I have any interior pictures of the boats.

Could thins be done in a way that would make it impossible for mold (my other major allergen) to grow?

The only reason I'm down the smooth, hard surface path here is to see any mold, then easily be able to scrub it off before it really takes hold.

Seems like a very fast and nice looking way to go, however

Doing the very large shower area first so that'll give me enough practice with the polyester over epoxy sanding to know if it's feasible for the rest of the boat.