Propane hoses

[SeaStory]

We are working on updating our propane system. It looks like best practice is to purchase pre made hoses so that one has swaged fittings. Well, when it comes to something like propane, I am all about best practices. However, I have a few questions about getting the larger ends through the boat. Our current corroding copper tube runs through the liner, sometimes in inaccessible places (likely installed originally, before the liner was even put in). There is a run from the foot of the rear berth, between the hull and the liner, to the hanging locker at the head of the bed, about 7', that we can't see what is going or recover if anything gets caught.

We may have an alternative to run it through the headliner, which is mostly removeable in this area. Would running the propane hose higher up introduce any new safety issues? Should we try the lower run and only use the higher run as a fallback?

I am also having trouble picturing getting the fittings through the thru hull seal, but that is specifically addressed in the reviews as working well, so I guess I shouldn't question that.

[Cheechako]

Last I remember no fittings are allowed inside the boat other than for the flex hose at the rear of the appliance (stove I assume). That and in the tank compartment are only allowable. I've always used copper and trust it more than any soft hose. While copper readily turns green in places, that doesn't mean it's failing.
The marine appliance place I used to buy some stuff from sold some great propane flex hose (blue braided exterior stuff IIRC) but they categorically would not install the fittings. They sold you the fittings and insisted you installed them They were push on fittings that locked on.
No I would not run it overhead. Why is going through the liner an issue? You cant make the holes bigger?

[Mickeyrouse]

I can appreciate the appeal of made-up propane hoses with staged fittings. In refitting our boat I contemplated the same thing and also encountered the issue of fittings passing through holes. I have seen caution against rigid lines because of the risk of failure due to constant vibration.
I stayed with flexible hose rated for the purpose. I used the fittings with the left-hand thread that makes a surprisingly secure seal. I tested ( periodically re-test) with soapy water with the line under pressure to check for leaks. It has never failed the test. The old line never failed the test either, and showed any visible signs of wear or chafing, but there comes a time that good sense says to replace.

[SVTatia]

Originally Posted by SeaStory

We are working on updating our propane system. It looks like best practice is to purchase pre made hoses so that one has swaged fittings. Well, when it comes to something like propane, I am all about best practices. However, I have a few questions about getting the larger ends through the boat. Our current corroding copper tube runs through the liner, sometimes in inaccessible places (likely installed originally, before the liner was even put in). There is a run from the foot of the rear berth, between the hull and the liner, to the hanging locker at the head of the bed, about 7', that we can't see what is going or recover if anything gets caught.

We may have an alternative to run it through the headliner, which is mostly removeable in this area. Would running the propane hose higher up introduce any new safety issues? Should we try the lower run and only use the higher run as a fallback?

I am also having trouble picturing getting the fittings through the thru hull seal, but that is specifically addressed in the reviews as working well, so I guess I shouldn't question that.

Pre-made propane hoses can be purchased more economically from industrial suppliers such as Greenline.

I removed all my copper lines and replaced with hose. Because the hose goes thru lockers and bulkheads (my boat does not have a liner) I placed the hose inside 1" PVC electrical conduits (the grey stuff) from the deck entrance all the way to just above the stove. Overkill? Perhaps, but it can be routed anywhere, mine is up just under the deck, its was cheap, the conduit was easy to secure and no worries about chafe.

I would not install the hose inside liners, as the liners "dance" with the boat and could chafe the hose.

[tkeithlu]

SeaStory, let me recommend that you first pressure test your existing copper. It's not difficult to do (pressure gauge, turn on gas, turn off gas, wait), and as Cheechako mentions, copper can look bad and be fine.

Yes, you can make up your own fittings. The presssures involved are very low. Try

https://propanewarehouse.com/product-category/fittings/

If you still decide to replace with hose, meet these basic standards:

Tank locker drains by gravity overboard

No fittings or junctions in hoses outside the locker - separate hoses to each appliance

A way to turn off the gas in the locker but at the appliance (usually a solenoid switch at the stove)

Pad (grommet) the hoses where they go through sharp bulkheads, and support the hose against shifting about

Install a hard-wired propane detector low in the boat near the appliance

[chris mac]

Interesting timing. Our solenoid stopped working just after crossing to bahamas. (Nov 27) I was able to remove it and continue functioning, but the condition of the connections is worrisome so we turn the propane off after each use.
I have ordered(friends coming to the bahamas bringing it) all new hose, solenoid and fittings. Yes, the rubber propane hose is thicker than the copper. It is also more tolerant to movement.
I would recommend using the same run if possible, without adding connections inside the boat. If you have to change routing, make sure it is secure, cant be pinched or punctured. And soap test all connections after install.
As for fishing in the new, I would use small line(like paracord) tied and taped to the copper, then use the line to pull in the new hose. Less risk of losing it.
Good luck

[hafa]

Originally Posted by chris mac

...we turn the propane off after each use.

This


We finally got a proper tank locker last year, but still only open the tank valve when the stove is actively in use, then close it as soon as the cooking is done.

[capt jgw]

Yep. Industrial hose shop. Three's no such thing as marine grade propane hose so no need to pay marine grade prices. Hose shop can make up whatever length you need. Most bigger towns should have a shop. I'm now setting up a new boat and plan to mock up the hose run with 1/2" rope to get the length right, then have the hose made. ABYC code requires swaged ends, no hose clamps allowed. And no connections other than in the tank locker and at the appliances. Multiple appliances require individuals runs from tank to each appliance. There are plastic three piece bulkhead fittings that will fit over the ends before you tighten them up.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by capt jgw

Yep. Industrial hose shop. Three's no such thing as marine grade propane hose so no need to pay marine grade prices. Hose shop can make up whatever length you need. Most bigger towns should have a shop.

Hydraulic hose is not safe for propane.


Propane is a powerful solvent that attacks all types of rubber and most plastics. As a result, hydraulic hose used for propane will fail from the inside out over the course of years, and will leak even when the exterior still looks fine.


There are two solutions in use. The USA way of doing things is to manufacture hose with a nylon liner. Nylon is one of the few plastics that propane doesn't diffuse through and that propane doesn't dissolve. In theory these are supposed to last indefinitely but I don't trust them much past 10 years, less for the cheap ones.



The UK way of doing things is to use a thick rubber hose and mark it with an expiration date by which time it must be removed from service. The idea is that there's a sufficient amount of rubber that the hose will last for its design life.


Propane hose custom cut to an exact length and with your choice of termination is available from some propane dealers or from https://www.propaneproducts.com/hoses-41-1.html

[evm1024]

https://ph.parker.com/us/en/lp-gas-propane-hose

As noted, your local hose shop will know what to do. They are usually by the trucking/industrial area.

I use Premier Rubber in PDX. It is near Jubitz.

https://www.premierrubber.com/

[wingssail]

When I installed our propane system in 1986 (yes, 35 years ago) the local supplier recommended a fabric covered, steel reinforced, rubber hose which he said would close if burned. It was sold in lengths and I bought attachable fittings which I installed. I don't know if it is still sold or what it is called.

This hose fits through the bulkhead holes (which I cut myself) and I put the fittings on after running the hose. There are two tees. One in the propane locker going to the BBQ and one, which I now know violates the standards, is behind the stove to allow connection to the propane water heater further forward.

There are no grommets where the hoses run through the fiberglass bulkheads.

One section of hose is outside (going to the BBQ).

Because we have no liners or panels covering the hose (or wiring runs) we can inspect the full lengths of the hoses. In 35 years we have observed no chafing or other deterioration of this hose.

BTW, we have had at least 4 surveys in 35 years and this propane system has never be listed as an exception.

[deblen]

Some helpful info. Cheers/Len


Safe Boat Propane System Installation

[NakedCity]

I just replaced my old copper with a 30' Trident brand hose from Defender $122. no problem with gland entering propane locker. I don't believe running the line high or low in boat makes any difference a leak will find it's way to the bilge regardless.

[SeaStory]

Originally Posted by deblen

Some helpful info. Cheers/Len


Safe Boat Propane System Installation

Our solenoid is one step better condition than the one pictured

OK, we are finally getting on with some of the work. Except the 30' Trident Marine hose we ordered said it was 1/4 ID. It isn't, and the Trident Marine site confirms that all their premade hoses over 20' are 3/8. Will likely get a 1/4 ID made locally and return this to West Marine.

With the 3/8" fittings at the stove, I also chose a 3/8" solenoid. But if we are getting 1/4" hose, now that seems like overkill? It looks like the 1/4" might save a tiny bit of space, making it easier to mount the new regulator, as well.

Oh, and the Dickinson Marine stove is on backorder until May, so once we finally wrap up the new propane system, it will all get hooked back up to the old Princess stove with one rusted through burner for a few months

[capt jgw]

Originally Posted by Jammer

Hydraulic hose is not safe for propane.


Propane is a powerful solvent that attacks all types of rubber and most plastics. As a result, hydraulic hose used for propane will fail from the inside out over the course of years, and will leak even when the exterior still looks fine.


There are two solutions in use. The USA way of doing things is to manufacture hose with a nylon liner. Nylon is one of the few plastics that propane doesn't diffuse through and that propane doesn't dissolve. In theory these are supposed to last indefinitely but I don't trust them much past 10 years, less for the cheap ones.



The UK way of doing things is to use a thick rubber hose and mark it with an expiration date by which time it must be removed from service. The idea is that there's a sufficient amount of rubber that the hose will last for its design life.


Propane hose custom cut to an exact length and with your choice of termination is available from some propane dealers or from https://www.propaneproducts.com/hoses-41-1.html

I didn't say hydraulic hose. Industrial hose shops have all kinds, including propane rated hose. I've had them make up propane lines s couple of times.