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Old 07-08-2018, 10:34   #76
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
I discard equipment of that era all the time.

Not reliable.

It may work today, but there is too high of a risk it could fail tomorrow.

Way past life expectancy.

A proper maintenance program includes replacing stuff like this before it is likely to fail.

Marine electronics become increasingly likely to fail after 10 years, especially in a saltwater environment.

It is the sudden failure that is the issue.

Whether one knows how to repair them to the component level is moot.

Counting on that to justify keeping old stuff on the boat until it breaks, to avoid the expense of proper maintenance is not good seamanship.

Nor is carrying spare "long past due for replacement" redundant electronics.

On a fair weather day, it may no big deal if it quits working, and you can drift along while you dig old (hopefully not saltwater logged) spares out of the bowels of a locker and dick around for however long it takes to cobble something into some semblance of functionality.

What if it "gives up" during a thunderstorm while you are trying to claw of a lee shore in zero visibility?

The prudent sailor knows to be weary of brand new installed systems, until time dictates they are reliable (and you pass the high start of the bathtub curve and transition to the level near zero mortality rate.)

After 48 hours of flawless operation, you can pretty much expect you are past the "broke right out of the box" segment, or the bad application / installation possibility.

From there, there is about a 98% chance you won't have a problem for the next 5 years. But then, you start climbing the other side of the bathtub curve. The likelihood of failure is on the increase, but still fairly infrequent, about 10 to 25%, until about 10 years old. But after this, the likelihood continues to increase with each year.

If one wants electronics they can count on to work, they should be replaced about every 10 years.

If one doesn't feel they need electronics they can count on, then there is really no point in having electronics at all, except to give one something to tinker with when it breaks.

Anyway, to the OP, sorry for the drift to electronics, but the principle remains the same.

It is never to early to practice good seamanship and employ sound preventative maintenance.

This goes for every boat system, including the anti-fouling.

If one can't afford to maintain a boat properly, they shouldn't own one. They are just putting themselves and others at needless risk, wrecking a boat that could be saved, by someone with the means to do so.
I can't agree with the post, you responded to, that advocated buying used equipment as backup. I can see keeping your own equipment for that purpose, for example a VHF. As far a plotters and alike?

A real commercial fisherman has two of everything. Not the BS you see on TV. A longliner someplace between the US an Norway. Even an old RDF might get you home.
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Old 07-08-2018, 10:40   #77
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
I discard equipment of that era all the time.

Not reliable.

It may work today, but there is too high of a risk it could fail tomorrow.

Way past life expectancy.

A proper maintenance program includes replacing stuff like this before it is likely to fail.

Marine electronics become increasingly likely to fail after 10 years, especially in a saltwater environment.

It is the sudden failure that is the issue.

Whether one knows how to repair them to the component level is moot.
First, I wouldn't repair an old piece of marine electronics because they are too cheap to replace

If a Skipper is super worried about his equipment failing he better bring backups/spares. My backup is a compass.

I think my electronics is at least 20 years old and works great.

My maintenance program for marine electronics is as follows: When it breaks replace if minimal troubleshooting doesn't fix the problem.

Also, everyone is different. This is the first boat I've ever had with any electronics and so far I've been about the same distance offshore on all of them which is about 15 miles or so even with the beach cats

If I were planning to sail say 200 miles offshore or so the first thing I'd probably do would be to rewire my boat. It still has the original wiring. (and some the PO installed)

For the type sailing I'm doing now though, it's good enough. Plus I'm not sure how long I will keep this boat. So far, I've had it for 7 years and replaced no electronics except the autopilot.........and it didn't fail

Plus I like to take the minimalists approach to cruising. It's a chance to drop off the grid for a while.

Many times my electronics isn't even on when I sail unless I'm near the shipping channels then the radio is on

Homemade switch/fuse box courtesy of the PO. It even has an analog Battery Power Monitor on the top of it. I did get rid of a lot of the excess wires though that were coming out of that box.

My GPS and Depth Finder are placed out on the Bridge Deck when I sail, and one of my Suunto Handheld Compasses.

There's 400 Watt Inverter behind the GPS in the picture. It's only a few years old. I have a 1500 Watt Inverter as backup.
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Old 08-08-2018, 05:49   #78
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
First, I wouldn't repair an old piece of marine electronics because they are too cheap to replace

If a Skipper is super worried about his equipment failing he better bring backups/spares. My backup is a compass.

I think my electronics is at least 20 years old and works great.

My maintenance program for marine electronics is as follows: When it breaks replace if minimal troubleshooting doesn't fix the problem.

Also, everyone is different. This is the first boat I've ever had with any electronics and so far I've been about the same distance offshore on all of them which is about 15 miles or so even with the beach cats

If I were planning to sail say 200 miles offshore or so the first thing I'd probably do would be to rewire my boat. It still has the original wiring. (and some the PO installed)

For the type sailing I'm doing now though, it's good enough. Plus I'm not sure how long I will keep this boat. So far, I've had it for 7 years and replaced no electronics except the autopilot.........and it didn't fail

Plus I like to take the minimalists approach to cruising. It's a chance to drop off the grid for a while.

Many times my electronics isn't even on when I sail unless I'm near the shipping channels then the radio is on

Homemade switch/fuse box courtesy of the PO. It even has an analog Battery Power Monitor on the top of it. I did get rid of a lot of the excess wires though that were coming out of that box.

My GPS and Depth Finder are placed out on the Bridge Deck when I sail, and one of my Suunto Handheld Compasses.

There's 400 Watt Inverter behind the GPS in the picture. It's only a few years old. I have a 1500 Watt Inverter as backup.
FWIW, I do not consider avoiding surveys, omitting liability insurance, not maintaining a proper boat, putting others at risk, and sailing without the VHF on to avoid responsibility to render emergency assistance, prudent seamanship nor advice to follow.

What difference does 15 or 200 miles offshore make?

3 hours or 40 hours to safe haven if all hell breaks lose.

In 15 minutes it could be all over.

If it's bad, one should head out, not in.

When old crap breaks down in a storm, Davy Jones doesn't care if someone is 1 or 1000 miles offshore.

The only real difference is that the closer to shore, the more likely one's junk will become a hazard to navigation or break up on the rocks and make a mess for someone else to clean up.

Avoiding maintaining a clean and fast bottom because it is inconvenient or breaks the bank, is the first step to this slippery slope of poor maintenance and lack of seamanship.
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Old 08-08-2018, 07:40   #79
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
FWIW, I do not consider avoiding surveys, omitting liability insurance, not maintaining a proper boat, putting others at risk, and sailing without the VHF on to avoid responsibility to render emergency assistance, prudent seamanship nor advice to follow.

What difference does 15 or 200 miles offshore make?

3 hours or 40 hours to safe haven if all hell breaks lose.

In 15 minutes it could be all over.

If it's bad, one should head out, not in.

When old crap breaks down in a storm, Davy Jones doesn't care if someone is 1 or 1000 miles offshore.

The only real difference is that the closer to shore, the more likely one's junk will become a hazard to navigation or break up on the rocks and make a mess for someone else to clean up.

Avoiding maintaining a clean and fast bottom because it is inconvenient or breaks the bank, is the first step to this slippery slope of poor maintenance and lack of seamanship.
I'm not sure where you are coming up with all this. I don't know any marinas in this area that will let you dock there without at least $500,000 worth of liability insurance,

As far as surveys, if you've owned a lot of boats you should have an idea of what to look for. Why pay for knowledge you already have?

I also don't see many boats that aren't maintained properly when I'm out sailing but it is sort of hard to tell from 5-10 miles away from other boats. The boats that are not maintained are usually sitting at a marina being neglected

As far as the VHF radio being off when I'm out of the shipping lanes, sometimes there's so much chatter on there from ships, folks wanting to dock calling marinas, Sea Tow pulling boats in and sending their warning, the military, and others chatting I just turn it off at times for some peace and quiet. The Coast Guard and police boats are available for rescue

If far offshore it would be on since the radio traffic out there is much less

The difference between 15 miles and 200 is that I can pretty easily paddle my kayak in from 15 miles out. (should my boat burn up from bad wiring which is why this came up in the first place. I have battery fuses now though so I'm probably good to go) As far as weather, I can see the sky and usually have an idea of the type weather I'll be dealing with for the next few hours

Not putting antifouling on for a few months is fine. You need to understand that a fast bottom with new antifouling still isn't that fast. The boat is still a monohull

Mine will heave too just as well with either a clean or a dirty bottom. I sort of do like having the boat on the hard every now and then though

Also, my boat is a very tough old boat.........especially for the $2,000 I paid for it .......and I didn't get a survey.

And unlike many boats that have been totally refitted, mine has a new 8 oz mainsail! (and a new outboard, pull start, no alternator, when I first bought the boat)

I try to spend money on the important things not on a few pieces of electronics that I don't need
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Old 08-08-2018, 08:33   #80
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
I'm not sure where you are coming up with all this. I don't know any marinas in this area that will let you dock there without at least $500,000 worth of liability insurance,

As far as surveys, if you've owned a lot of boats you should have an idea of what to look for. Why pay for knowledge you already have?

I also don't see many boats that aren't maintained properly when I'm out sailing but it is sort of hard to tell from 5-10 miles away from other boats. The boats that are not maintained are usually sitting at a marina being neglected

As far as the VHF radio being off when I'm out of the shipping lanes, sometimes there's so much chatter on there from ships, folks wanting to dock calling marinas, Sea Tow pulling boats in and sending their warning, the military, and others chatting I just turn it off at times for some peace and quiet. The Coast Guard and police boats are available for rescue

If far offshore it would be on since the radio traffic out there is much less

The difference between 15 miles and 200 is that I can pretty easily paddle my kayak in from 15 miles out. As far as weather, I can see the sky and usually have an idea of the type weather I'll be dealing with for the next few hours

Not putting antifouling on for a few months is fine. You need to understand that a fast bottom with new antifouling still isn't that fast. The boat is still a monohull

Mine will heave too just as well with either a clean or a dirty bottom. I sort of do like having the boat on the hard every now and then though

Also, my boat is a very tough old boat.........especially for the $2,000 I paid for it .......and I didn't get a survey.

And unlike many boats that have been totally refitted, mine has a new 8 oz mainsail! (and a new outboard, pull start, no alternator, when I first bought the boat)

I try to spend money on the important things not on a few pieces of electronics that I don't need
Any respectable marine insurance company should demand a recent survey by a qualified person before issuing a policy, especially for a 40+ year old $2000 boat.

Not that it can't be OK, just the likelihood that it will be, is extremely rare, and the photos you have posted confirms it.

I recommend you get a proper marine survey.

You may think you know everything there is to know about boat inspection, maintenance, and repair, but I assure you, reality couldn't be further from the truth.

You are just kidding yourself to appease your conscience.

Despite all of my experience inspecting, sailing, troubleshooting, repairing, maintaining, and improving boats, both personally and professionally, and despite the fact that I have studied, written, and passed comprehensive exams proving I know what I'm talking about, I still hire a surveyor, when I purchase a boat.

My son is in the process of purchasing his second boat. I will inspect it with him to help ensure he stays clear of a lemon, but I still recommend he hire a surveyor, and I will help him repair all of the issues cited, and make any improvements he and his wife desires.

Quite frankly, I can't think of a circumstance where anyone, even a qualified surveyor themselves, should not hire an independent pre-purchase surveyor.

Learning everything you can to inspect a boat or taking someone knowledgeable for pre-purchase inspection to avoid expense on boats that aren't worthy of a survey is prudent.

Skipping having a survey performed, after you have determined a vessel is worthy for your consideration, is not.

Insurance companies should never allow it; if not for their protection, for everyone else's in the boating community.
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Old 08-08-2018, 08:36   #81
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

Another idea the OP may want to consider would be to do all his testing and repairs etc then pull the boat just before cold weather sets in. Some marinas have deals on that.

Here, I can keep my boat in the yard for the same price as my slip. (November - February)

All you have to pay for extra is the haul out and power wash. Then you paint and supplies etc
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Old 08-08-2018, 08:48   #82
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
Any respectable marine insurance company should demand a recent survey by a qualified person before issuing a policy, especially for a 40+ year old $2000 boat.

Not that it can't be OK, just the likelihood that it will be, is extremely rare, and the photos you have posted confirms it.

I recommend you get a proper marine survey.
The first thing you are not considering is that possibly the boat was worth more than $2,000.

It's last sail was a 2 year cruise from Massachusetts to Florida and the Bahamas. (5 years before I bought it)

Common sense tells you that the PO probably went over the boat with a fine tooth comb and made all repairs necessary before he sailed.

These old full keel boats have rather simple systems. It's just not that hard to check them yourself. Just figure the 40 year old engine is shot, sails are shot (mine had recently purchased jib and storm jib) etc. There are no keel bolts to inspect since they usually have encapsulated keels

This boat also had all the electronics to include depth, GPS X2, autopilot, and VHF

The ground tackle was good as well with a CQR on the bow with chain and rope rode totaling about 250' plus a backup Bruce, chain, and rope rode of almost 300' and then 3 danforths

Dodger, Bimini, compass.........although the old Danforth Compass has now failed which is another reason I bought the Suunto Hand Held compasses

As far as insurance companies, I don't set policy for them, but mine is with State Farm and they are sort of respectable with all their years in the business
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Old 08-08-2018, 09:58   #83
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
Any respectable marine insurance company should demand a recent survey by a qualified person before issuing a policy, especially for a 40+ year old $2000 boat.

Not that it can't be OK, just the likelihood that it will be, is extremely rare, and the photos you have posted confirms it.
Well, I did the survey and that was seven years ago.

I've had the boat in pretty steady winds to 30 mph and squall winds in excess of 40 knots.

No problems either time

Other times, I've been stuck on a lee shore (maybe 50-70 yards off the beach) with 25 knot winds and waves around 3' and the ground tackle held without dragging

This boat was to be a trainer for my next boat but I can't see buying a larger boat when this one does most everything I need it to do

A little better performance and a bit more speed would be nice but not necessary. It pushes me to sail better by positioning the boat to take advantage of what nature provides as far as the weather, tide, wind, and traffic

And lastly, I started boating in the waters here when I was 16 years old as Captain/Skipper so I do have a bit of experience with boats, motors, the Bay, the tides, and the weather here

Back then there were no surveys for $300 power boats. No cell phones. No VHF or other instruments usually were on the boat. Sometimes no life preservers. Which ever POS anchor and rode that came with the boat was used

But there was always plenty of bait (Peeler Crab), beer, and fun
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Old 08-08-2018, 10:47   #84
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
Well, I did the survey and that was seven years ago.

I've had the boat in pretty steady winds to 30 mph and squall winds in excess of 40 knots.

No problems either time

Other times, I've been stuck on a lee shore (maybe 50-70 yards off the beach) with 25 knot winds and waves around 3' and the ground tackle held without dragging

This boat was to be a trainer for my next boat but I can't see buying a larger boat when this one does most everything I need it to do

A little better performance and a bit more speed would be nice but not necessary. It pushes me to sail better by positioning the boat to take advantage of what nature provides as far as the weather, tide, wind, and traffic

And lastly, I started boating in the waters here when I was 16 years old as Captain/Skipper so I do have a bit of experience with boats, motors, the Bay, the tides, and the weather here

Back then there were no surveys for $300 power boats. No cell phones. No VHF or other instruments usually were on the boat. Sometimes no life preservers. Which ever POS anchor and rode that came with the boat was used

But there was always plenty of bait (Peeler Crab), beer, and fun
Unsafe at any speed.

The point is not if one can purchase a boat without a survey, without repairing the deficiencies, and without performing overdue maintenance.

Of course, anyone can do any dang foolish thing they want, until they get caught by the authorities, a jealous boyfriend/husband or the grim reaper.

The point is, ONE SHOULDN’T. (For their own sake at others.)

That you don’t give a crap about your own safety is one thing; that you care even less about others is unconscionable.
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Old 08-08-2018, 11:01   #85
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Unsafe at any speed.

The point is not if one can purchase a boat without a survey, without repairing the deficiencies, and without performing overdue maintenance.

Of course, anyone can do any dang foolish thing they want, until they get caught by the authorities, a jealous boyfriend/husband or the grim reaper.

The point is, ONE SHOULDN’T. (For their own sake at others.)

That you don’t give a crap about your own safety is one thing; that you care even less about others is unconscionable.
It seems you keep trying to incite "others" into this with your made up stories

My boat is totally safe. It's totally seaworthy.

It has all the electronics, (plus compass backup) it has a 2011 engine, sails are near new, autopilot, dodger, 5 anchors, Blue Sea Battery Fuses and Terminals, Solar, Victron MPPT Controller, PFD's, MOB Float, Flares, flare pistol, fire extinguishers, anchor lantern light, tether and Jackline, Harness, Hand Held VHF, automatic bilge pump, manual bilge pump, and so on down the line plus a skipper with 46 plus years of experience or so on the water in all sorts of old beatup boats (I had a car payment when I was a teenager so my boats. motors, and trailers had to be bought at a very low price)

You can just see how my nice my boat looks in the water, that's it's in great shape, and the best part is I didn't have to pay a lot for it or to keep it this way

Much safer than a newbie on a $200,000 boat with total insurance
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Old 08-08-2018, 12:55   #86
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
It seems you keep trying to incite "others" into this with your made up stories

My boat is totally safe. It's totally seaworthy.

It has all the electronics, (plus compass backup) it has a 2011 engine, sails are near new, autopilot, dodger, 5 anchors, Blue Sea Battery Fuses and Terminals, Solar, Victron MPPT Controller, PFD's, MOB Float, Flares, flare pistol, fire extinguishers, anchor lantern light, tether and Jackline, Harness, Hand Held VHF, automatic bilge pump, manual bilge pump, and so on down the line plus a skipper with 46 plus years of experience or so on the water in all sorts of old beatup boats (I had a car payment when I was a teenager so my boats. motors, and trailers had to be bought at a very low price)

You can just see how my nice my boat looks in the water, that's it's in great shape, and the best part is I didn't have to pay a lot for it or to keep it this way

Much safer than a newbie on a $200,000 boat with total insurance
Much less safe than someone with same skills, and a properly surveyed boat that has had all cited deficiencies corrected.

If you wish to prove me wrong, get a proper survey by a SAMs or NAMs accredited professional on the boat as it is right now and post the report.
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Old 08-08-2018, 14:59   #87
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Much less safe than someone with same skills, and a properly surveyed boat that has had all cited deficiencies corrected.

If you wish to prove me wrong, get a proper survey by a SAMs or NAMs accredited professional on the boat as it is right now and post the report.
Haha! Ridiculous!

Funny stuff though!

I don't waste money for no reason especially on boats that are in excellent condition like mine. I've already spent like $8,000 or so on this boat over 7 years including the purchase price. Why get a survey now?

My boat could easily do the ICW and then over to the Bahamas as is. And more. (I'm actually more used to being offshore on a Beach Cat so on my Bristol 27 I really have all the comforts of home comparatively speaking. Plus it's nice and heavy as compared to a 300 lb beach cat with the same sail area plus spinnaker)

But I'd never motor sail the ICW all the way down. I'd go nuts with boredom



Many spend hundreds of thousands to do that (sail/motor the ICW) and usually with the wrong boat. I think those are the folks you need to be talking to so you can get money out of them for no real reason

Check this young lady. She's doing a better job than I am at getting at lot out of an old boat with much less experience than I have. She's sailed it from Canada to Florida so far.

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Old 08-08-2018, 22:43   #88
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Haha! Ridiculous!

Funny stuff though!

I don't waste money for no reason especially on boats that are in excellent condition like mine. I've already spent like $8,000 or so on this boat over 7 years including the purchase price. Why get a survey now?

My boat could easily do the ICW and then over to the Bahamas as is. And more. (I'm actually more used to being offshore on a Beach Cat so on my Bristol 27 I really have all the comforts of home comparatively speaking. Plus it's nice and heavy as compared to a 300 lb beach cat with the same sail area plus spinnaker)

But I'd never motor sail the ICW all the way down. I'd go nuts with boredom



Many spend hundreds of thousands to do that (sail/motor the ICW) and usually with the wrong boat. I think those are the folks you need to be talking to so you can get money out of them for no real reason

Check this young lady. She's doing a better job than I am at getting at lot out of an old boat with much less experience than I have. She's sailed it from Canada to Florida so far.

Dinghy Dreams – Journal of a Sea Gypsy
Why get a survey now?

1. To identify the deficiencies present in the boat when you purchased it.
2. To identify the deficiencies that have developed due to age or fatigue since you purchased it.
3. To identify the deficiencies you have created due to neglect or “DIY” improvement since you purchased it.
4. Respectable Marine insurance companies demand a new survey every 5 years.
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Old 09-08-2018, 03:08   #89
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

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Why get a survey now?

1. To identify the deficiencies present in the boat when you purchased it.
2. To identify the deficiencies that have developed due to age or fatigue since you purchased it.
3. To identify the deficiencies you have created due to neglect or “DIY” improvement since you purchased it.
4. Respectable Marine insurance companies demand a new survey every 5 years.
Not needed.

Also my boat is self insured except for the $500,000 liability insurance the marina requires which means I'll be doing the identifying of what needs to be replaced and when

If it gets destroyed and I have to sell it for the price of the lead in the keel, I just go find another while saving all off the boat that is useful...….sails, electronics, solar, ground tackle, engine, tiller, fuel tanks, etc...…

I got some good info from the Atom Voyages Website and the boat purchase was due to Robin Lee Graham and some old full keel characters I hung out with at our dock in the apartments I lived in back in the day.

They were always talking up the strengths of their heavy and slow sailboats. They were some pretty good story tellers I must say. This in the 90's before the internet got so popular

My beach cats were tied down ashore just above the high water line but everyone hung out on the dock where the slips were $50.00 each

Atom Voyages - Good Old Boats List

From the site above:

A big plus for boats like the Pearson Ariel, Triton, Alberg 30, some of the Bristol and Cape Dory line and similar boats on this list is that they are relatively inexpensive and proven offshore capable. This means you have the option of not buying insurance and could even replace them with a small emergency savings fund, which I call being self-insured. Also their long production runs mean there are always some available on the market. And they have lazarette lockers that often can be modified for an outboard motor well when the inboard engine has reached the end of its life or, like me, you simply can't tolerate their wasting of space, complexity, and fouling your bilge with oil and fuel leaks.

A final word of advice to the novice sailor - resist the temptation to undertake a major refit and extensive modifications on your new old boat right at the start. It's best to make only the obvious repairs needed and go out and sail locally and on some coastal vacation passages to learn exactly what is and what is not needed for you. Otherwise you may end up spending years and many thousands of dollars more than expected modifying your boat and then find out on your first ocean crossing that the boat is not right for you or those great ideas you had during the refurbishment did not work out that well at sea.
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:07   #90
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Re: postponing antifouling paint job. OK or not OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post

A big plus for boats like the Pearson Ariel, Triton, Alberg 30, some of the Bristol and Cape Dory line and similar boats on this list is that they are relatively inexpensive and proven offshore capable. This means you have the option of not buying insurance and could even replace them with a small emergency savings fund, which I call being self-insured.
This is total BS. A small emergency savings fund is not going to protect the people around you endangered by your deficient electrical wiring and fuel systems, nor the environmental clean up when your 40+ year old thruhull hose rots through and sinks the boat. This is just shirking responsibility. Not seamanlike.

Quote:
Also their long production runs mean there are always some available on the market. And they have lazarette lockers that often can be modified for an outboard motor well when the inboard engine has reached the end of its life or, like me, you simply can't tolerate their wasting of space, complexity, and fouling your bilge with oil and fuel leaks.
Yeah, those outboards in motor wells work great. NOT. Real reliable. NOT.

Quote:
A final word of advice to the novice sailor - resist the temptation to undertake a major refit and extensive modifications on your new old boat right at the start. It's best to make only the obvious repairs needed and go out and sail locally and on some coastal vacation passages to learn exactly what is and what is not needed for you. Otherwise you may end up spending years and many thousands of dollars more than expected modifying your boat and then find out on your first ocean crossing that the boat is not right for you or those great ideas you had during the refurbishment did not work out that well at sea.
I've talked many off the ledge when they wished to "improve" their new used boat, that I knew they shouldn't.

However, this portion of the advice above is flawed, "...make only the obvious repairs...".

It should read, "Make the proper repairs needed for safety, performance, and maintenance, as determined by an independent qualified person".

I believe what the author meant was "Don't make unnecessary modifications, until you have sailed the vessel extensively and fully understand the purpose and reason for the original boat design."

To claim one hasn't performed some repairs and improvements over 7 years, because they are not sure if they like the boat or will keep it, is ludicrous. All boats fall in this category. Nobody knows what the future holds for them.

It is all too easy for the prospective buyer or owner to choose, purposefully, or even subconsciously, to ignore vessels flaws.

I am quite confident he didn't mean, "Perform only the obvious repairs you detect, and ignore the unobvious repairs a proper marine survey WILL turn up, that could endanger you and others around you."

If he did, he is simply another hazard to navigation.

I fear you have taken some of these concepts out of context to justify a "frugal to a flaw" mindset.

The problem is that, "One doesn't know what they don't know until they do."

This could lead to your demise (or someone else's trying to rescue you) from your own intentional or blissful ignorance.

If you believe your vessel inspection skillset is anywhere near close to an experienced, accredited surveyor, you are sorely mistaken.

I see the difference between owner and surveyor "excellent condition" claims, every day.

Get an independent survey by a SAMs or NAMs accredited professional.

Post the results.

Prove me wrong.
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