Origo 6000 alcohol oven, building/design one yourself?

[Franziska]

Hi,

at first, please do not turn this into a "which oven fuel is best" discussion.

Say you have made your choice and settled for alcohol. You start hunting for a new or used Origo 6000 (which was the only true stainless reliable one on the market until recently).
Now you realize it's not made anymore and used ones are very few to none on the market too.

I was wondering if anyone considered building/re-engineering one along the same basic design.

It should not be too complicated and a crowd sourced design which gives the plans away for free would make something similar available again. Maybe even an improved version and focusing on a simple built method even by non metal specialist people and safety.
The plans would need to have a "don't do this at home and if you do anyway it it's completely at your own risk". Disclaimer on it ;-)

Esentially it's a stainless box with a drawer for the burners underneath.

The main issues to solve seem to be:

-Best way to control temperature
-Content of heat pods (Glass wool, stone wool, metal wool??)
-Insulation
-Air supply & exhaust
-Maybe adding a computer fan system to distribute the hot air inside could be added? Slowly blowing in a little bit of cool air from the outside through some sort of heat reflection baffles might work?

This: https://zenstoves.net/Stoves.htm might be a starting point for the burners. Or one uses burners of the alcohol stove Origo 3000 which I believe is still in production.

Just thinking out aloud, pondering the idea and wondered if someone might catch on to this....

[SVTatia]

Why not start with an used marine stove..any fuel and convert to alcohol? They are not pressurized right?

[Franziska]

Actually, you are right.

A used Origo 3000 or similar would already provide the heating box (in the lower drawer).
They are unpressurized and have two burners of the same type as the 6000.

Next subject, if one does not have the ability to weld and would want to rivet instead. What kind of gasket tape could be used between the sheet metal sides and top/bottom of the box?
Needs to be heat resistant and provide a reasonablely air tight seal.

Any thoughts on a good fire and heat resistant insulation on the outside?

Maybe an existing stainless box of some sort could be revamped? Old oven or microwave from the scrap yard?
Maybe even an old marine gas oven might be the best starting point, add a drawer for the heaters underneath and a way of heat control....

Btw. Anyone who has an Origo 6000 what are the drawbacks of the current design?

Still just thinking out aloud... ;-)

[Hesti]

As far as I understand the design of our 3000, one critical design aspect is, that the burners may not become to hot. If they become to hot, my assumption is, that the amount of alcohol gas they produce can be very high and that could cause excessive flame and heat production - which could be very dangerous. My understanding. I would assume, that the dangerous temperature might be around the boiling temperature of the alcohol. My assumption. So, such a design would not only need design, but also some serious lab testing with some serious temperature measuring to be sure you stay on the safe side of things. Under all working conditions.



As for most applications for which you might want a baking oven - could you perhaps do the same in a nice big oval cooking pot?

[Franziska]

Great comment. Thanks.

So all but the flamering should be well protected in the lower drawer.
Agree shoreside testing would be very important.

We've got one of these circular ring ovens. You can use it for a lot of stuff. Love it, but it's still a tad limited in what you can prepare in there.
The cook on board (my boyfriend) prefers an oven ;-)

[SVTatia]

Originally Posted by Franziska

Actually, you are right.

A used Origo 3000 or similar would already provide the heating box (in the lower drawer).
They are unpressurized and have two burners of the same type as the 6000.

Next subject, if one does not have the ability to weld and would want to rivet instead. What kind of gasket tape could be used between the sheet metal sides and top/bottom of the box?
Needs to be heat resistant and provide a reasonablely air tight seal.

Any thoughts on a good fire and heat resistant insulation on the outside?

Maybe an existing stainless box of some sort could be revamped? Old oven or microwave from the scrap yard?
Maybe even an old marine gas oven might be the best starting point, add a drawer for the heaters underneath and a way of heat control....

Btw. Anyone who has an Origo 6000 what are the drawbacks of the current design?

Still just thinking out aloud... ;-)

I have converted an alcohol stove to kerosene and after many many years with Kerosene, I have taken two stoves entirely apart, both gas which I bought used. Reason 1? I am cheap, Reaosn 2, I'm scared of gas and can't find Kero stoves anymore - so I needed to check the fittings and clean everything.
The first one a Princess has all stainless on the outside, but inside it was a mess of rust and I was trying to rebuild. No go, too much work and I culd not recreate some of its sheet plates. Threw it out. My loss.
The second a Force 10 3 burner everything inside and out is stainless, and I took apart to cleanup, check the oven insulation, fittings and put everything back together. The only tricky part on a pressurized stove (other than the burners of course) are the manifold and oven regulator.
My point is, these marine stoves have their innar parts screwed on, there are no welds. The burners can be screwed or riveted to the plates. But, you have to have the proper burners to start with.

BTW - I just saw as ad for a very nice gas stove in the classified - great candidate for a convession.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ve-225381.html

[psk125]

Originally Posted by Hesti

As far as I understand the design of our 3000, one critical design aspect is, that the burners may not become to hot. If they become to hot, my assumption is, that the amount of alcohol gas they produce can be very high and that could cause excessive flame and heat production - which could be very dangerous. My understanding. I would assume, that the dangerous temperature might be around the boiling temperature of the alcohol. My assumption. So, such a design would not only need design, but also some serious lab testing with some serious temperature measuring to be sure you stay on the safe side of things. Under all working conditions.



As for most applications for which you might want a baking oven - could you perhaps do the same in a nice big oval cooking pot?

Hesti brings up an important point. We had a boat with an alcohol stove blow up in our harbor because alcohol vapor in the cabin ignited. It was a pressurized stove, perhaps 30 years ago, but if Hesti is correct about hot burners creating too much alcohol vapor even in a non-pressurized unit, it would be smart to be careful.

[Paul Howard]

We baked bread for five years during a circumnavigation of the world on the stove top using a pressure cooker without the pressure nob in place. lots of recipes and directions available from Pardey's books and on. A straight sided pressure cooker is best, not the curved vertical ones. We used a Presto.

Baked pizza in a skillet with tight fitting lid, too, as well as cookies.
ON a propane two burner stove.

[Franziska]

Thanks everyone.
Good points, keep them coming please.

The Origo 6000 does not use pressurised burners. We aim for something similar.

Yes this takes slightly longer to get to temperature, but we are not in a hurry when sailing. Just start cooking a little earlier :-)

Little side comment, our plan is to get rid of heavier than air gas (Butane/Propane). Please do NOT turn this into a fueltype discussion. See my opening post.

[StoneCrab]

Question.
When you say pressurized are you referring to a system like a Coleman lantern, where it gets pumped up and has a hot loop of tubing for preheating the gas?

[hamburking]

Originally Posted by Hesti

As far as I understand the design of our 3000, one critical design aspect is, that the burners may not become to hot. If they become to hot, my assumption is, that the amount of alcohol gas they produce can be very high and that could cause excessive flame and heat production - which could be very dangerous. My understanding. I would assume, that the dangerous temperature might be around the boiling temperature of the alcohol. My assumption. So, such a design would not only need design, but also some serious lab testing with some serious temperature measuring to be sure you stay on the safe side of things. Under all working conditions.

I think you have it backwards. What makes the origo so good is that the burners DO get hot...that's what makes them great. They get hot, the contents expand, and you get a bit of pressure...which makes them burn hotter. This can be seen when you light one...weak flame at first, then what appears to be a pressurized flame soon after (as the reservoir pod heats up).

[hamburking]

To design a new Origo 6000, I would start with an Origo 4000 for the top. Now the design is more than half done. The rest is basically a metal box for the oven underneath.

[Franziska]

Not quite. I agree that the 4000 would be the perfect top part.
Still the top part is not the tricky part, as it is still in production. It's the bottom part which is the tricky part.
It's not made anymore.

As far as I understand it's a metal box with a drawer underneath which houses 3 Origo burners.

Now here comes the part which seems unclear at the moment.
Are these burners supposed to be heat shielded (I'd think so), or not?
Are only the flame rings exposed to the inside of the oven chamber?
How are they regulated from the outside?

I do not have an Origo 6000, maybe there is someone who can take pictures of the drawer and mechanisms? Or, someone has a manual?

Originally Posted by hamburking

To design a new Origo 6000, I would start with an Origo 4000 for the top. Now the design is more than half done. The rest is basically a metal box for the oven underneath.

[Franziska]

Stone Crab

No, it's not an actively pressurized system on the Origos. It may be indirectly pressurized a bit if the pods heat up. Not sure if they do and are supposed to.

[SVTatia]

Originally Posted by Franziska

...It's the bottom part which is the tricky part.
It's not made anymore.

As far as I understand it's a metal box with a drawer underneath which houses 3 Origo burners.

Now here comes the part which seems unclear at the moment.
Are these burners supposed to be heat shielded (I'd think so), or not?
Are only the flame rings exposed to the inside of the oven chamber?
How are they regulated from the outside?

I do not have an Origo 6000, maybe there is someone who can take pictures of the drawer and mechanisms? Or, someone has a manual?

There is no drawer, its just a lid that lifts up so that you unclip and remove the burner. It seems the burner is not heat shielded as it protrude into the oven. The trick is the knob. If it it is the same length as the top then it could be fitted into the bottom. Actually, what does the knob do? I'm just here for curiosity as I never used an alchohol stove...

See on section 8.2, page 18 of this manual:

https://images-eu.ssl-images-amazon....12R3aSGT7S.pdf