Looping Shrouds / Stays Around the Mast . . .

[pressuredrop]

hear me out on this one...

(by conventional i mean aluminum mast, single spreader, cutter rig, currently rigged with s/s and norseman fittings)

going to do the rig soon with synthetics and the other thing that really appeals to me besides the deadeyes is the possibility of looping the shrouds/stays around the mast, i would like to loop the uppers and lowers, everything but the staysail tang... the lack of many mechanical fasteners (failure points) and the money saved on hardware (new tangs, less line terminators etc...) are very appealing

2 potential problems of course:

- the mainsail track. it will have to be offset on a shim of about 1/2" with a section of the shim missing (maybe 2.5") to accommodate looping of the the lower shrouds (no big deal). yes, i realize the lowers will have to be put on before the spreaders and sail track... i have no problems with this just one minor concern... should a lower break (highly unlikely and wont seriously jepordize the mast), getting the new one rigged would be a challenge, i.e. a splice would have to be made up the mast with the lower in place through the mast track... follow?
one solution i can think of is a removable area of mast track say 1' that over laps the lower/where the void is in the shim, then a splice could be made at the base of the mast out side the track and the lower slid up into position then replace the section of track... other option in an emergency is to pass the lower through the track and tie a knot to get by...


-the other problem is the mast head, the sheaves are too close to the top to loop so my thinking is remove the mast head fitting, find a few feet of an extrusion that fits outside (an inside extrusion if it will not interfere with the sheaves) the mast perfectly, cut holes for the sheaves, bolt/weld it on, and attach the cleats to hold the loops to the bolted on extrusion? anyone see any problems with this?

basically im a trying to decide if the benefits of this are worth the challenges that must be overcome and the potential problems in the event of a lower failure?

your opinions please??

[boatman61]

Thats how I rigged the masts for my Wharrams... minus the spreaders of course... the top shrouds loops rested on a wood half cleat each side of the mast...

[pressuredrop]

yea phil i got the idea from a tiki 30 ive seen locally. it is to elegantly simple to ignore, just want to make sure i will not regret doing it to a conventional rig

[capngeo]

So instead of looping the mast and having the aerial splicing issues, why not mount a padeye on the mast and use a choker hitch to connect?

[pressuredrop]

capngeo - not the worst idea my only concern would be the small radius formed by the choke hitch when it is pulled tight being a possible stress concentrator (remember the need for thimble when eye splicing...) and a pad eye is essentially a tang, which i am trying to avoid

and just to reiterate - aerial splicing issue will only be in the event of an emergency (failure), i will go about this project with the rig down

[Benz]

My boat is rigged that way (31' Cape George gaff cutter), and so far all is well. I used polyester-covered Vectran, and leathered the eyes. Just make sure the loops sit nice and fair with nothing to chafe against. Are you considering deadeyes and lanyards? Colligo makes some beauties.

[Brent Swain]

I used to rig that way. Worked well. Only two problems . Makes changing your rigging a lot harder, and stetches a bit more than with tangs.

[pressuredrop]

Originally Posted by Benz

My boat is rigged that way (31' Cape George gaff cutter), and so far all is well. I used polyester-covered Vectran, and leathered the eyes. Just make sure the loops sit nice and fair with nothing to chafe against. Are you considering deadeyes and lanyards? Colligo makes some beauties.

Ben - soo glad to hear its working for your, where did you source the covered vectran from?, and why did you choose it over dynex dux?....

dead eyes and lanyards for sure!, i love the colligo stuff but i have a stock pile of ironwood and ipe and an experienced woodworker willing to help me so i think i will make my own for the cost of a few 12-packs... i am also going to make the cleats for the loops from this wood...

one technicalish question - for the masthead should i stagger the cleats (i.e. fore and aft cleats at the same height and side cleats lower and opposite eachother)
or... put all 4 cleats at the same level and make the eyes sufficiently large that they rest over 3 cleats instead of one (follow this?), or do i want to avoid the 70-80ish degree bend this would put on the eye splice?

also does anyone know a good source for stainless steel straps to go around the lower deadeyes and strap them to the chain plates?

Thanks
Ben G

im sure ill have more questions, but i cant wait to do this and cant believe how affordable it is....

[boatman61]

On my Tiki 21 & 26 I had the shrouds lashed at the foot with braid... worked well.

[pressuredrop]

Ben -

one more questions, i know loop shrouds are standard fare on traditional gaff rigs, how do you fell about the suitability of looped shrouds on a conventional bermuda rig?

[Benz]

Hi Ben,

As long as the line is sufficiently strong, there is no reason why loops around the mast should't work for any rig. I chose Vectran over Dux because I got a good deal on a whole spool of it, and I like that the poly sheath protects the core from sun and chafe. I didn't bother staggering cleats--especially if properly leathered, the loops lying over each other don't chafe any. Just make sure that one loop isn't tending to try and lift up another when you tighten up. If you need to, stagger the cleats. But if you make your eyes the proper size, each loop should only end up touching its own cleat. You should by no means loop a shroud around three cleats.
Hope this helps. BTW, what kind of boat?

[pressuredrop]

boat is my avatar picture, 1963 allied seawind (converted sometime in the 80's to a pilothouse and cutter rig)