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Old 28-11-2021, 18:20   #1
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Is this damage a deal breaker?

Newer good condition boats are few and far between up here and when this one came on the market, it ticked all the boxes and pulled the trigger on an offer. Because of my work, I wasn't able to see it for a week but didn't want to miss out. Put in an offer with subjects, including personal viewing and survey. Offer accepted.

I went to look at it this weekend and while it was exactly as described in almost every way, I did find some damage that was not listed and the broker looked surprised and unaware of it too.

Assuming these have been there a while as he said the boat hasn't left the dock in 18 months. First one is a hole in the top deck, about the size of a quarter. water can get in I think and have had a lot of rain lately. Its about 18" forward of the mainsheet traveller.

Second is impact damage on the transom.

Everything else with the boat was immaculate and well taken care of, inside looked new and no signs water or moisture anywhere. Other than these two issues, is exactly what I am after. The boat is a Sun Odyssey 409

What would repairs cost or is this going to lead to potentially bigger problems? I have a survey booked in a couple weeks.



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Old 28-11-2021, 18:53   #2
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

It's going to depend on what's under these holes. Is there a balsa core under the hole in the deck? How wet is it, how far has the water spread and is it into a critical area, structural or something really hard to get to for drying and repair.

Similar on the transom. What does it look like on the inside where you see the impact? Is there any damage to nearby areas, bulkheads or whatever?

Of course there's still all the stuff underwater.
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Old 28-11-2021, 23:11   #3
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

These look really minor. Remember it is a used boat. I doubt these are anything but gelcoat dings. Either way the surveyor should pick up any real issues with these, if they exist, which I doubt.
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Old 29-11-2021, 04:06   #4
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

The deck looks like a void beneath the gelcoat, nothing to worry about lots of boats have them. Ours had such a void on the cockpit locker lid for the last 13 years until I finally patched the hole and painted the deck.


The transom looks just fine as well. Just gelcoat cracks from backing into a dock.

No sense getting worked up about either one of these.
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Old 29-11-2021, 04:14   #5
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

This is why YOU independently hire, and spend money on, a good surveyor, if you have to ask this question.
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Old 29-11-2021, 07:05   #6
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailmonkey View Post
The deck looks like a void beneath the gelcoat, nothing to worry about lots of boats have them. Ours had such a void on the cockpit locker lid for the last 13 years until I finally patched the hole and painted the deck.


The transom looks just fine as well. Just gelcoat cracks from backing into a dock.

No sense getting worked up about either one of these.
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Old 29-11-2021, 07:31   #7
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bccoast View Post
Newer good condition boats are few and far between up here and when this one came on the market, it ticked all the boxes and pulled the trigger on an offer. Because of my work, I wasn't able to see it for a week but didn't want to miss out. Put in an offer with subjects, including personal viewing and survey. Offer accepted.

I went to look at it this weekend and while it was exactly as described in almost every way, I did find some damage that was not listed and the broker looked surprised and unaware of it too.

Assuming these have been there a while as he said the boat hasn't left the dock in 18 months. First one is a hole in the top deck, about the size of a quarter. water can get in I think and have had a lot of rain lately. Its about 18" forward of the mainsheet traveller.

Second is impact damage on the transom.

Everything else with the boat was immaculate and well taken care of, inside looked new and no signs water or moisture anywhere. Other than these two issues, is exactly what I am after. The boat is a Sun Odyssey 409

What would repairs cost or is this going to lead to potentially bigger problems? I have a survey booked in a couple weeks.



I am deeply concerned about the damage to the stern.

Before engaging a surveyor, get inside the boat and crawl to the stern. Do you see ANY sunlight? If so that repair will take some work. Before engaging the surveyor, explain to the seller, you expect him to fund that repair.

If that flys, get a full survey.
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Old 29-11-2021, 09:47   #8
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snore View Post
I am deeply concerned about the damage to the stern.

Before engaging a surveyor, get inside the boat and crawl to the stern. Do you see ANY sunlight? If so that repair will take some work. Before engaging the surveyor, explain to the seller, you expect him to fund that repair.

If that flys, get a full survey.
thanks, I did look as best I could inside but the aft quarter bed has plywood that is screwed down. The inside was 100% dry, however, what worries me is if there is water in the sandwich construction which I assume is sealed and wouldn't vent into the bilge?

We will be having a discussion this week prior to the survey and make sure he does agree to cover repairs. I also want to make sure that he agrees to let the surveyor fully inspect the areas which may include removing screwed down panels etc.

I am not so concerned about the cosmetics of the fiberglass/gelcoat repair, more about the potential for water in the shell and what implications that may mean. is this a $3k repair or a $30k repair?
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Old 29-11-2021, 10:04   #9
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

I bought a boat with very similar damage at the stern which the surveyor (MY surveyor, not the seller's or the broker's) said was just gelcoat damage. There was no evidence of damage from inside. I had my boatyard (very reputable) filling a couple of holes where equipment had been removed but the holes left open by the PO, so I had them do the "gelcoat work" on the transom. It turns out the impact that chipped the gel coat also caused some delamination damage over a broader area and it cost me a couple of thousand US$ to fix. That was a small percentage of the boat's purchase price and upgrades I was installing, so I was not terribly upset, but not everyone would have the same view.

My point is, you should understand this could be a bigger issue than it seems and cost a boat buck or two to fix, but only you can decide if it's a deal breaker. Does the boat otherwise meet all or most of your needs? What is the sales price and would you be willing to pay more? Do you have the fiberglassing skills to fix it yourself or the monetary resources to pay someone else to fix it? Used boats are almost never perfect and it's unlikely you'll ever find one with no problems.

Have your surveyor look at this and get someone to give you an estimate to repair it.

Good luck.
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Old 29-11-2021, 10:04   #10
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

I would be beyond surprised if there’s a core in that area with the cracks.
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Old 29-11-2021, 10:47   #11
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

I have a 2010 Jeanneau SO 44i, on the transom you can get into the starboard push pit lazzarette and see where that joint meets the deck to the hull, if you see any water trails from this area it would be safe to say you have thru hull issues.
I do not think in either case it is critical damage and neither place will you find balsa core construction underneath the gel and glass, esp if the vessel ends with an (i) like Sun Odessey 44i, this indicates that no balsa was used to “core” the vessel.
I Hope this helps I am very happy with my vessel in many ways.
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Old 29-11-2021, 11:24   #12
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

Before you go too far, take a small plastic headed mallet and tap around the holes. If and when the sound changes, you will have an idea of the size of the water intrusion. Depending on how large an affected area, you can decide if the boat is a no go or take the next step and hire a good marine surveyor. If it's been sitting that long on the dock, very likely the owner may be unaware of the issues, because he was not aboard when the damage occurred.
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Old 29-11-2021, 12:45   #13
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

They look minor but apparently you hadn't had a Servey. What's below the waterline?
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Old 29-11-2021, 14:19   #14
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

As long as your offer is subject to survey inspection and you have hired a good surveyor, nit referred by the seller or broker, you have nothing to be concerned about until the survey report comes in. It would be good if you were present during the survey. A boat that hasn't left the docks for 18 months can have a number of other problems depending on how she was laid up and maintained during that period. I'd be curious about why she hadn't been off the dock for that long. JMHO
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Old 29-11-2021, 16:25   #15
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Re: Is this damage a deal breaker?

Lots of good advice here, thank you all for responding. will keep you posted.
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