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Old 13-05-2020, 17:09   #16
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

If you are really going the aircraft hose route, then go with Teflon hoses, they have an infinite life, most SS covered hoses are rubber hoses and in aircraft use should be replaced every five years, but almost never are.
You can make up your own hoses, you buy the hose and fitting separately and put them together.

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catal...clickkey=32709

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/search/search.php

One source, I would go with Experimental hoses for less cost, they are just as good, just not Certified and you don’t need Certification.
If you want fireproof, it’s a high temp sleeve covering, you can buy it in bulk and add it yourself or have hoses built that way.

There are at least three different levels of fire resistance of aircraft hoses depending on their use, but fireproof has to withstand a 2,000F flame over its entire length while its under pressure for 20 min if memory serves.

But again, this is all overkill for a boat, and as crazy as this sounds, they may not meet USCG spec, simply because no one ever had them Certified.
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Old 13-05-2020, 17:14   #17
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

Ref silicone hoses I’ve been using them for coolant for a couple of years and for raw water, so far with no issues, but if you use silicone hose you cannot let any fuel or oil get on them, it basically I believe dissolves silicone hoses and for sure will cause them to fail.
I have used silicone hoses on high performance motorcycles for years and I like it as it’s softer and more flexible and easier to run.
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Old 13-05-2020, 17:21   #18
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

Almost all aircraft standards are Mil spec standards, US military created almost all standards long ago.
https://flywithspa.com/docs/pbm/toc453317738.html

TSO is a Technical Standing Order that provides specs for a part to meet aircraft standards, tires for example or oil filters will be built under a TSO, but some things don’t have a TSO, one was never written, landing lights for instance, and that is why it took almost forever to get LED landing lights, because there was no TSO where you could show compliance, just no one ever got around to writing a TSO for landing lights it seemed.
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Old 13-05-2020, 19:07   #19
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

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Originally Posted by Ecos View Post

Lines and hoses are not AN parts. Fittings and bolts are AN parts. Hose is a MIL-Spec part. In aviation, AN does mean something as do NAS, MS and a TSO. AN fittings from Ace Hot Rod are probably bogus parts from China. You need to know your source.
Do you have a point, or are you just showing off your personal collection of abbreviations?

Please, show me where 'AN' "fittings and bolts" are specifed in any Army, Navy or Air Force publications, or by the FAA in any of their specs or regulations.

And while you're at it, how bout a link to the 'AN' governing body and to their rules, regulations and mode of determining that said "fittings and bolts" fit the 'AN' criteria.

For starters though, just advise for what the abreviations you so casually (and a little rudely) throw around actually stand...
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Old 14-05-2020, 05:29   #20
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

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Originally Posted by jimbunyard View Post
The 'inner hoses' on these 'AN' lines (a generic term which really means nothing at all), are quite variable and range from unreinforced pvc or teflon to wire reinforced hpdm to ???

Same as for fittings, I've seen steel in several different finishes, SS, and I believe aluminium and wouldn't be surprised if someonw made them in bronze or titanium.

Any discussion about the merits or deficiencies without taking the actual relevant specifications of both hose and fittings is meaningless.
Folks, there is no fancy hot-rod hose system that one can be sure of in the long run. I'll say it again: Stick with CG approved quality hose, double clamped with AWAB clamps. All hose needs to be carefully inspected annually. I have never worked on an older boat that didn't have some deteriorated hoses, often in places that could sink the boat. If you are restoring a boat, get ready to replace [U]all[U] your hose as a matter of good practice.
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Old 14-05-2020, 06:11   #21
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

AN is Army Navy. An old standard for parts largely superseded I think but sometimes still applicable for aircraft parts, bolts anyhow.
NAS is National Aeronautical Standard, which I believe is the new AN if you will.

Almost all aircraft standards are actually Military standards, for just about everything from O-rings to fuel and lubricants.

Most any part used has to comply with accepted standards whether AN of NAS or a particular manufacturers part, for example the brake master cylinder used on Thrush Aircraft was a NAPA part for I think a 1957 Studebaker truck, that was modified by the seals having been changed to be compatible with aircraft hydraulic fluid. Windshields we had manufactured locally out of automobile safety glass, because crop duster often hit birds and need safety glass. You couldn’t buy the identical part from NAPA legally, the reason was it hadn’t gone through the manufacturers quality control system.
There are ways to use “standard parts” especially for old aircraft where the correct part just doesn’t exist anymore, but it gets a little complicated as the FAA is real good about publishing advisory circulars and they love to point to them, but AC’s as they call them are not approved data, but can be used in gaining approval, it’s their legal out. The FAA has gotten real bad about throwing the approval liability on the mechanic.
Beechcraft door locks can be bought at any hardware store, they are desk locks. The starter solenoid for my Maule was an OMC part for outboards.
It’s not realistic for every single part to be “special” aircraft parts, very often a manufacturer will Certify parts, with FAA approval of course.

None of this has squat to do with boats I assume, I doubt a USCG inspector or a Surveyor is going to be impressed with an aircraft part, they are going to look I assume for USCG or ABYC approval, which I doubt aircraft parts have.
But they may, I assumed my aircraft Halon fire extinguishers wouldn’t be USCG approved so I kept dry chemical ones that were, last Survey it was pointed out to me that they were USCG approved. I just didn’t read the data tag.
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Old 14-05-2020, 10:29   #22
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

I used a few left over aircraft hoses in my fuel system and they look good. Remember AN fittings are 37deg and SAE are 45deg flares. With the pressures we have it probably isn't to big a deal
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Old 14-05-2020, 10:39   #23
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

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Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Ref silicone hoses Iíve been using them for coolant for a couple of years and for raw water, so far with no issues, but if you use silicone hose you cannot let any fuel or oil get on them, it basically I believe dissolves silicone hoses and for sure will cause them to fail.
I have used silicone hoses on high performance motorcycles for years and I like it as itís softer and more flexible and easier to run.
Silicone hose coolant loss

https://aviondemand.com/product-knowledge/gates-water-permeation-in-silicone-hose/
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Old 14-05-2020, 10:53   #24
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

Hotrod stainless is probably not going to hold up to salt water and salt air.
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Old 26-05-2020, 13:33   #25
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

Hello All,

If you want a good Hose & Fitting System that is also Coast Guard Certified just connect with Aeroquip. They have any and all components to address any Engine, Transmission or Hydraulic Application much less Refrigeration, etc., etc., etc..

Their AQP Line of Hose Elastomers is " Viton " providing a very Broad Range of Fluid Compatibility. JIC or 37 Degree Flare Fittings will handle any and all of your Fluid Line Connection Duties. Their FC234 is both ABS & USCG Certified for Fire Resistance - it used to be touted as Self Extinguishing but cant seem to find that reference now. Aeroquip also has FireSleeves that can be applied as well.

I would stay away from Teflon Lined Stainless Outer Braid Hose unless the specific application Demands It. Otherwise They are especially susceptible to failure in Suction Applications and I've seen less than stellar performance in Pressure Applications as well.

Regarding the Want-To-Be AN Fitting and Stainless Braided Hose Sources ... Plainly speaking most of it is questionable. Aeroquip has the real thing but be ready to Pay the Piper.

Want to see some real solid options here's a Link to their Catalog:
https://www.eaton.com/ecm/groups/pub...pct_479318.pdf

or for Marine Specific

https://www.eaton.com/ecm/groups/pub...t/pll_1027.pdf

Actual more than just a catalog, a bunch of useful information from Fluid Compatibility to Hose Failure Analysis and Fluid Velocity Charts.

Just a few qualifiers and disclaimers, DOD Contractor in the Preventive & Predictive Maintenance of Hydraulic and Main Propulsion Systems on everything from Aircraft to Submarines for over Twenty Years. Design Engineer of Ground Support Equipment. Formerly an Associate Distributor for Aeroquip as an OEM, no official affiliation with Aeroquip for over 20 Years.

I wouldn't use any less than the best in my Equipment and definitely wouldn't trust any less in the middle of the ocean. You Wont find Hose Clamps on a Destroyer or Submarine or an Airplane - except maybe in a Damage Control Situation ! Fine to have in your kit for emergencies, but personally I hate Hose Clamps ! There is an Adapter Fitting for practically anything.

And just to be clear when I refer to Hose Clamps I'm talking about the Worm Gear Variety.

Hope Someone Finds This Useful !

Have a Good Day,
Erasmuss
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Old 26-05-2020, 14:01   #26
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

[QUOTE=Erasmuss;
I wouldn't use any less than the best in my Equipment and definitely wouldn't trust any less in the middle of the ocean. You Wont find Hose Clamps on a Destroyer or Submarine or an Airplane -


Airplanes use hose clamps, lots of them.
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Old 26-05-2020, 14:07   #27
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

Really, You Use Worm Gear Hose Clamps on Aircraft ?
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Old 26-05-2020, 14:09   #28
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

And Most Importantly this is in the Context of Pressurized Fluid Systems.
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Old 26-05-2020, 14:21   #29
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

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Originally Posted by Erasmuss View Post
And Most Importantly this is in the Context of Pressurized Fluid Systems.
Had you mentioned that detail I can only give examples in small aircraft. Besides it depends on what the job is. You wouldn't use hose clamps in a fuel injection system but all kinds old planes used hose clamps for the oil cooler hoses.
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Old 26-05-2020, 15:08   #30
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Re: Hot Rod hoses? Stainless steal braid with AN fittings

I replaced copper hydraulic steering lines with Teflon/stainless steel jacket with nylon outer jacket. Working great, a few thousand miles in the South Pacific.
I did buy the Chinese lines and fittings. They assemble well and look good. The only problem is their “interpretation”of NPT. Their imperial taper was undersize on one Size of the fittings.I used Dowty type sealing washers to seal. The flare fittings are fine. They do recommend you don’t mix fittings from different suppliers.
I wouldn’t use them on an aircraft(I used to build airplanes) but for a boat they’re fine in my opinion.
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