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Old 19-02-2017, 11:05   #31
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Originally Posted by moniia View Post
And epoxy itself after being properly cured does not give any adverse effects anyway, but with this extra coating makes it completely safe.
It is your life and your health (and of your guests, if any), so do what you think is right for yourself. Nevertheless, let me point out that epoxy composites are not known to be among food-compatible materials. On the coating you mentioned I have no data, so cannot comment further.

FYI:
| Plastics International
Food Compliant Plastic Materials | Plastics International
| Plastics International
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:12   #32
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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(...)

Your last paragraph gives an idea why I think about that. Quite a lot of my water will be in 6-8l bottles to supplement tanks, so some manual handling would be necessary anyway. Don't have and won't have a water maker so I have to monitor water AND divide water collected along the way. I'm thinking about 25l tank to have a good use of it when I'm not sailing alone, for myself it would be partially filled (1 week supply). Refitting will mean also changing water tanks to 4 separate ones totalling 600l. I think about using simple plug-in electric and spare simple manual pump to transfer water from the tank to the gravity tank without any complex (read: prone to failure) installation). Just with a use of a can
(...).

it is rather silly to quote own posts, but could you explain to everyone how much clearer do you need? A drawing, maybe?

No, I'll write in the way I want to. If YOU don't want to make an effort and read a WHOLE post - why bother answering?
As you can see, quite a lot of people don't have a problem with my style or precision- so maybe you should look for problems on your side...

And don't bother answering as I really don't want and won't answer your posts anymore. Prefer to talk to people who actually bother to read my posts.
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:19   #33
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

Hi Moniia,
No electrics on my boat either. Also no water tanks. I have a 2 1/2-gal round plastic insulated keg (made my Rubbermaid) with a spigot that I lash at head level under the roof (deckhead, really) of the cabin. This is for ready drinking water, and can be filled with ice in the tropics (a real treat). It is easy to wash out (very important, and the biggest failing of built-in tanks: when you get one corrupt fill, the tanks are compromised for ages). My entire water supply (130 gallons) is carried in half-and-one-gallon jugs, and I keep three ready jugs in a special spot next to the stove. Small jugs are easier to transport by dinghy than jerrycans, can easily be inspected for floaters and are easy to wash. If one breaks or is lost, it can easily be replaced.
You might consider removing your built-in tanks entirely, tossing all potable water plumbing, and using just jugs. I have found it to be the best thing in my case.
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:19   #34
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Originally Posted by mrm View Post
It is your life and your health (and of your guests, if any), so do what you think is right for yourself. Nevertheless, let me point out that epoxy composites are not known to be among food-compatible materials. On the coating you mentioned I have no data, so cannot comment further.

FYI:
| Plastics International
Food Compliant Plastic Materials | Plastics International
| Plastics International


I appreciate your concern and it is a valid point. You don't have data, I do. Coatings of a type mentioned above are accepted in the UK, Australia and Norway by public health bodies to be used as a lining in potable water tanks (in Norway it is the same kind of paint made by Jotul, named Tank DW or something similar). If anyone needs to research them a bit more - look for epoxy paint tank lining.

This particular is approved in the UK. Perfectly acceptable for me, as I'm living in this country and its standards are well known to me
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:36   #35
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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You asked so I'll give you my opinion: Keep the weight as low as possible. If you have not yet become comfortable with electrical power, keep your foot pump or install a hand pump.


Most boaters find electricity reliable so maybe you just need to install and maintain your electrical system properly.
This saved me writing.
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:37   #36
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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(...) food-compatible materials. On the coating you mentioned I have no data, so cannot comment further.

FYI:
(...)[/url]

Your point was really good so I dug a bit more on my iPad and found different company, same kind of product produced also in the UK, but in this case manufacturer attached an FDA approval, so I thought I should put it here for future reference as that is pretty useful bit of information for all of us:
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:59   #37
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

I am with Monika in principle. Having owned a Triumph TR3, I know Lucas, Prince of Darkness, intimately. A hand pump or foot pump makes sense. In my case, I can use a small bucket to dip water from the fresh water tanks through the inspection ports. But my tanks are under the cabin sole so easy for me to say.
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Old 19-02-2017, 12:08   #38
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Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

Your point was really good so I dug a bit more on my iPad and found different company, same kind of product produced also in the UK, but in this case manufacturer attached an FDA approval, so I thought I should put it here for future reference as that is pretty useful bit of information for all of us:

Click image for larger version

Name:	Image1487534858.097168.jpg
Views:	95
Size:	349.8 KB
ID:	141591
Click image for larger version

Name:	Image1487534891.350465.jpg
Views:	89
Size:	313.4 KB
ID:	141592

For some reason I could not attach that to the previous post.
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Old 19-02-2017, 12:11   #39
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Originally Posted by michaelratinter View Post
I am with Monika in principle. Having owned a Triumph TR3, I know Lucas, Prince of Darkness, intimately. A hand pump or foot pump makes sense. In my case, I can use a small bucket to dip water from the fresh water tanks through the inspection ports. But my tanks are under the cabin sole so easy for me to say.

My main tanks will be placed under the cabin soles as well after the refit. I have plenty of space there
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Old 19-02-2017, 12:57   #40
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Talking Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Hello,
Call me old fashioned or even backwards but I do not like depending on electricity to provide me water from my tanks*.
I have on my boat a tap with a simple hand pump which is handy as each stroke delivers precise amount of water but as I'm preparing quite a large refit and just found what looks like a perfect spot for a gravity tank, I decided to think about that a moment before I commit to one or another solution. I like an idea of a gravity tank mainly because of its sheer simplicity, went with a pump only because in a current setup gravity tank would have to be either on the other (bow) side of the boat or on the top of a coachroof. None of these locations were especially attractive to me

I'm thinking about putting about 25 litres (roughly 5.5 gallons- imperial ones for all you across the pond) which would be situated practically right over the tap, around 2 ft - 2ft 6in upwards.

Any thoughts about such installation? Does anyone use a gravity tank?
And no, I won't convert to electrics. Once bitten...

*I still remember being stuck on the boat with full tanks (1000l, over 220 imperial gallons or around 250 US ones) and having absolutely nothing to make a cup of tea .
So you asked for it: I will call you 'Backward!
Seriously, placing weight so high is not a good idea. And you have to rise somehow from the main tanks to your day tank... So no gain...
On my boat, I also have a 5x200 litres tanks, but my boat is also equiped with a bypass foot pump(whale). It is used as a backup but mainly to avoid the noise of the pump at night while at anchor. Easy to plumb a a good(modern?) solution
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Old 19-02-2017, 13:14   #41
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

Why would anyone go to the trouble of building and installing a gravity tank when simple reliable foot pumps like this one are available inexpensively.
Whale Marine - Products

There is virtually nothing that can go wrong with this pump. Low flow so helps being frugal with water. A gravity tank will have to have its valve opened and closed, leading to more water usage than this simple foot pump. Inexpensive enough to take a spare.
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Old 19-02-2017, 13:26   #42
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

Dear Elie, I appreciate the interest but I would also appreciate reading posts before answering. All points of your answer were already covered few times in this thread.

And I just ask you one simple question: how 25kg placed below the deck midship (so around 3ft above waterline max, but probably closer to 2ft - I have pretty low freeboard) will affect 13 ton (metric) boat?

To make it easier - it is 0.19% or 0.002 of my boat's displacement. To make it easier to compare - my own weight is almost three times that and I move ABOVE the deck, sometimes even on the mast.

And yes, I know it is not "modern". But there is a reason why I'm using a sailboat... and there are similar reasons why I'm using KISS principle. ANY plumbing, pumps, especially electrical ones ARE NOT SIMPLE.

But, maybe someone from modernity evangelists will tell me, what exactly should I do with electrically powered pump which quits south of Cape of Good Hope? Having another 20 thousand miles to go? Provided it won't end up in loosing 1/4th of water stores?

I'm backward, I admitted that and I see no shame in that. I do see a problem when people do not appreciate that more complex system means higher probability of failure. I sail long enough to know two things:
1- there are no infallible systems of any complexity.
2- being prepared means also preparation for things which are improbable, because in longer cruise they may happen. "At sea what impossible is only one of the possible outcomes".

Paraphrasing known saying - "pessimist moans about breakdowns, optimist expect it won't break; realist makes it easy to fix..."
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Old 19-02-2017, 13:31   #43
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

Interesting discussion. I do like the simple approach, but it's really a matter of choosing what you want and how to do it, then live with it.

Everything about boating is some sort of compromise. I remember seeing either a movie or slideshow of the Pardey's boat with a gravity daytank for water. Their major point was that it allowed them to monitor their water usage closely. I'd say you can also do that by inspection ports.

From our boat we have taken out the municipal water input, pressure water pump, pressure tank, water heater and plumbing to the engine that was on our boat when we bought her. Gained a whole locker in prime location after that! (Not to mention an A.C. breaker became spare.)

We had to install a new water tank anyway (the DPO* had previously had a holding tank failure and had set up the only water tank as his new holding tank ...eww!)

We put in a composting toilet, foot pumps in head and galley and replaced the water tank with a new one with a large inspection port. We also carry extra water in 5 litre jugs. We use far, far less water than when we lived aboard with pressure water. We can heat water on the stove if needed. We probably don't smell as nice as some of you, but we can wash in the river here (St. Lawrence - 1000 Islands)!

Incidental tip: If you're taking out two old holding tanks, move to a place where it freezes...it makes the process far less unpleasant!
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Old 19-02-2017, 13:35   #44
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Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Originally Posted by mitiempo View Post
Why would anyone go to the trouble of building and installing a gravity tank when simple reliable foot pumps like this one are available inexpensively.

Whale Marine - Products



There is virtually nothing that can go wrong with this pump. Low flow so helps being frugal with water. A gravity tank will have to have its valve opened and closed, leading to more water usage than this simple foot pump. Inexpensive enough to take a spare.


Because one had a "pleasure" of fixing one of those "simple, reliable foot pumps" TWICE in a space of three weeks on the same boat? (Granted: not Whale - but that's the reason for disliking them...).
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Old 19-02-2017, 14:05   #45
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Re: Gravity tank for fresh water - any experience?

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Dear Elie, I appreciate the interest but I would also appreciate reading posts before answering. All points of your answer were already covered few times in this thread."
I suspect all the people who read your posts chose not to answer.
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