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Old 26-02-2024, 18:27   #1
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fastener "lubricant"

We all know the old standby's for putting stainless fasteners in aluminum. Lanocote and Tef Gel are expensive (especially Tef Gel), but the holy grail. Lock-Tite is a strong contender as well (the "glue" serves as an insulating layer to keep the AL and SS apart).



I just stumbled on this:
https://www.amazon.com/MARINE-44018-.../dp/B00JRTAS9I


It reads like it is non-metallic (so unlike traditional Never-Seize, it doesn't have copper to irritate the aluminum). It claims it adds an insulating layer to prevent galvanic corrosion. And at $30/lb, it's massively cheaper than the big boys (well, no... it's comparable to Lanocote, but massively cheaper than Tef Gel)


I've never heard of it. Anyone used it? The brand is old and dependable, but the product is new (at least to me).


Harry
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Old 26-02-2024, 18:36   #2
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

I have never heard of that brand and never seen it used or reviewed.

But this product is the only one outperforming TefGel and it’s actually available again (it was sold out for a long time after those test results came out)

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B74AB5C
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Old 26-02-2024, 18:50   #3
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Permatex makes three different types of anti-seize with different compositions. They have an aluminum-based, nickel-based, and copper-based anti-seize. The aluminum has the lowest temperature rating. The nickel has the highest temperature rating. the copper is "sensor safe" for things like O2 sensors in car exhausts. My "go-to" in automotive applications is the nickel anti-seize. If you don't care about the temperature rating and are putting a SS fastener into aluminum, then I'd go with the aluminum-based anti-seize.
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Old 27-02-2024, 05:23   #4
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPK View Post
Permatex makes three different types of anti-seize with different compositions. They have an aluminum-based, nickel-based, and copper-based anti-seize. The aluminum has the lowest temperature rating. The nickel has the highest temperature rating. the copper is "sensor safe" for things like O2 sensors in car exhausts. My "go-to" in automotive applications is the nickel anti-seize. If you don't care about the temperature rating and are putting a SS fastener into aluminum, then I'd go with the aluminum-based anti-seize.
But this is not for cars but boats. I assume you would use marine grade non-metal anti-seize on boats like we all do?
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Old 27-02-2024, 06:07   #5
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

I tested a bunch, side by side, as part of a long term test (SS bolts in a mast section, and steel bolts in steel, hung under a dock in the intertidal zone). Lanicote and Tefgel were included.

The Tefgel and Locktite LB 8023, a marine grade non-metalic antiseize, were tied. A Bostic Marine antiseize didn't do as well, and neither did Lanicote or the best marine greases. So the Amazon product could be good. But I go with Tefgel or LB 8023.


Yes, the metals in many products can promote galvanic corrosion. I tested that on coupons as part of the same program.


Engines are a different subject.
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Old 27-02-2024, 07:24   #6
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

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I tested a bunch, side by side, as part of a long term test (SS bolts in a mast section, and steel bolts in steel, hung under a dock in the intertidal zone). Lanicote and Tefgel were included.

The Tefgel and Locktite LB 8023, a marine grade non-metalic antiseize, were tied. A Bostic Marine antiseize didn't do as well, and neither did Lanicote or the best marine greases. So the Amazon product could be good. But I go with Tefgel or LB 8023.

Yes, the metals in many products can promote galvanic corrosion. I tested that on coupons as part of the same program.

Engines are a different subject.
Exactly
The Locktite LB 8023 is the product I linked to and now fully available again. I’m not very knowledgeable on pricing but think it’s more affordable than TefGel. I couldn’t find the 8023 yesterday while re-assembling a winch and used Tefgel again… it’s pretty much the same with a different color as far as I can tell.
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Old 27-02-2024, 07:36   #7
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Thank you both. My understanding on the rationale for using non-metallic anti-seize in a marine environment is to not introduce another metal that may increase the potential for galvanic corrosion. In the case of a SS fastener into aluminum, an aluminum-based anti-seize isn't introducing a third metal so should be OK, no? Or am I missing something?
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Old 27-02-2024, 07:38   #8
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

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Thank you both. My understanding on the rationale for using non-metallic anti-seize in a marine environment is to not introduce another metal that may increase the potential for galvanic corrosion. In the case of a SS fastener into aluminum, an aluminum-based anti-seize isn't introducing a third metal so should be OK, no? Or am I missing something?
There are many types of aluminum and many more metals aboard. You can have one product that is proven to work very good for everything or you can being a collection of ones with metal fillers and hope it will be okay because you are the experiment… easy choice for me.
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Old 27-02-2024, 12:03   #9
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Interesting. We've used the Permatex aluminum anti-seize for s/s screws for years, till we ran out of it (and it's not available here, conveniently). Since then, we've used Duralac, which is okay, but for years, we used the other, and those screws were always removable, and w/o corrosion on them.
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Old 27-02-2024, 12:23   #10
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

^^^^^
We also use anhydrous lanolin, especially for s/s screws into Al. Has worked for many years... and the original one pound jar that I bought for < one dollar (back in the early 70s) is still about 1/3 full! Check with a decent pharmacy for current price, and don't tell them that you use it on a yacht!

I note that the link that Jedi supplied for the Loctite stuff had no price shown. Can anyone supply that? TefGel is good stuff but its steep price tends to make me use too little of it. Price may not matter to some, but it does to me, a card carrying cheapskate.

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Old 27-02-2024, 16:23   #11
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Many years ago a mechanic buddy gifted me a 1lb. tub of Tef-Gel.
There will be enough left to leave to my kids.
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Old 27-02-2024, 16:52   #12
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
I note that the link that Jedi supplied for the Loctite stuff had no price shown. Can anyone supply that? TefGel is good stuff but its steep price tends to make me use too little of it. Price may not matter to some, but it does to me, a card carrying cheapskate.

Jim
Jim,


I'm sure I'm as cheap as you are! It's why I started this thread....


Here in 'merica, the link that Jedi provided shows a price of $21.69 for an 8 oz bottle. It may be geo-restriced (marketing, I'm sure -- it's probably not a regulatory issue). I think I'm going to splurge and buy one.
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Old 27-02-2024, 17:42   #13
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

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Originally Posted by sailingharry View Post
Jim,


I'm sure I'm as cheap as you are! It's why I started this thread....


Here in 'merica, the link that Jedi provided shows a price of $21.69 for an 8 oz bottle. It may be geo-restriced (marketing, I'm sure -- it's probably not a regulatory issue). I think I'm going to splurge and buy one.
Well, that sounds a lot better than Tefgel, at least here in Oz, where a 10 GRAM tube lists for 15 AUD.

I would consider the Loctite stuff if available here.

Jim
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Old 27-02-2024, 17:49   #14
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
^^^^^
We also use anhydrous lanolin, especially for s/s screws into Al. Has worked for many years... and the original one pound jar that I bought for < one dollar (back in the early 70s) is still about 1/3 full! Check with a decent pharmacy for current price, and don't tell them that you use it on a yacht!

I note that the link that Jedi supplied for the Loctite stuff had no price shown. Can anyone supply that? TefGel is good stuff but its steep price tends to make me use too little of it. Price may not matter to some, but it does to me, a card carrying cheapskate.

Jim
Nasty little buggers… surely they want to charge you more!

Here’s what I see when clicking the link… apparently I got mine three years ago
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Old 28-02-2024, 05:05   #15
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Re: fastener "lubricant"

So this leads to a follow on question.


Fresh out of college, I bought an 8 oz tub of Anti-Seize. The classic gray copper based stuff. 40 years later, it's about 1/2 full.


Then I inherited the 8 oz tub my father bought when I was in high school (we did a complete rebuild on his daily driver, a 1923 Model A -- the lessons I learned in that winter project were huge). It's also about 1/2 full.


Clearly, an 8 oz tub is something your kids inherit -- but my kids didn't get the DIY gene.


If I buy an 8 oz tub of the marine grade, metal free, super duper stuff -- is there any reason I shouldn't get rid of the gray copper based stuff? Is there some application where the marine stuff isn't the right stuff? Exhaust manifold studs come to mind. How about spark plugs or injectors?
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