Compost toilets

[SV__Grace]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

1) Is it illegal for me to pee over the transom? AFAICT its not illegal at least in most places. The laws seem to refer to MSDs and emptying tanks but don't directly talk about peeing over the transom. So, if I can pee over the transom, can I empty the urine container overboard similarly?

***There is a big difference between peeing over the transom and dumping a bucket of urine. The former is illegal only as public nudity/indecent exposure, and the latter violates environmental laws unless you're offshore.

2) What about dumping the solid waste? If I'm still tied to a pump out station/marina but now with a much smaller holding tank that might be a bucket or a plastic bag in a lazerette, with much more intimate handling of the waste and much higher likelihood of spillage into my locker, that seems a significant disadvantage.

***You keep your garbage on board until disposing ashore, same with the contents of your composting toilet. We don't have a problem with storage or spillage.

3) HOW do I dump it? Again, if not overboard then I'm still tied to a marina of some sort. Obviously I can't stick a pump out vacuum nozzle into a plastic bag. Stick it in the doggie waste bin? Marina toilet? Regular garbage can? How exactly do you get rid of the stuff?


***Done correctly, solid waste from a composting toilet is more like compost than poop (the older stuff, anyway). While it is OK to bag and dispose as garbage, some marinas prefer to treat it like Porta Potties (common on smaller boats) and have a designated dump spot. The urine bucket gets dumped into the nearest toilet unless the marina directs you to the porta potty area.

Composting toilets have many fans and many detractors. If you prefer pumping out and find it cleaner and more convenient, then more power to you.

We love the freedom from pumping out and the simplicity of the composting toilet (no smelly hoses, reliable, no regular maintenace/repair) and disposing of the solid waste (compost, mostly) and urine is the price of that freedom and convenience. Nothing on a boat is free and easy, just trade offs.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

I'm tying to understand the legalities wrt to composting toilet for US coastal cruising primarily.

Legally speaking, the composting heads we're discussing are considered Type III MSD.

Originally Posted by flightlead404

1) Is it illegal for me to pee over the transom? AFAICT its not illegal at least in most places. The laws seem to refer to MSDs and emptying tanks but don't directly talk about peeing over the transom. So, if I can pee over the transom, can I empty the urine container overboard similarly?

Yes, you can pee over the side (although you may be in violation of indecency laws if you do it around others). No, you can't legally dump urine over the side from any container. This makes as much sense as it sounds.

Originally Posted by flightlead404

2) What about dumping the solid waste? If I'm still tied to a pump out station/marina but now with a much smaller holding tank that might be a bucket or a plastic bag in a lazerette, with much more intimate handling of the waste and much higher likelihood of spillage into my locker, that seems a significant disadvantage.

Yes, you still have to dump the solids. The difference with composters is that the cycles tend to be a lot longer. Few traditional holding tank heads can last anywhere near as long as composters: Four to six weeks for two adults using Air/Nature's head, or two to three for C-head. So while the tank is a lot smaller, the time between dumps is also a lot longer.

Now, as to where and how you end up storing the material if you can't get to a dump location is up to you. If you store it precariously it may spill. If you store it properly, it won't spill. That's up to you.

The other thing to realize with these heads is that there isn't a hard stop to when they are full, or when they need dumping. It's a range that can be measured in weeks if need be. So with a modicum of planning, most people don't seem to have any problem getting rid of the material.

Originally Posted by flightlead404

3) HOW do I dump it? Again, if not overboard then I'm still tied to a marina of some sort. Obviously I can't stick a pump out vacuum nozzle into a plastic bag. Stick it in the doggie waste bin? Marina toilet? Regular garbage can? How exactly do you get rid of the stuff?

Most of the time I dump mine in wilderness areas on shore. Or I dump over the side when I'm well offshore (three mile limit applies). If neither options are available I dump in the marina garbage bin.

[flightlead404]

Thanks for the input, that's a bit clearer now.

The boat it looks like I'll own in about 3 weeks has an integral holding tank in the aft edge of the keel (Morgan 384). To my knowledge this is essentially a glassed in void in the keel, not actual tank to be removed per se.

If I were to move to a CH, how should I deal with this tank? Just clean it and glass over the top? Some sort of cap? Fill it with something?

Anything I could re-use this space for?

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

Thanks for the input, that's a bit clearer now.

The boat it looks like I'll own in about 3 weeks has an integral holding tank in the aft edge of the keel (Morgan 384). To my knowledge this is essentially a glassed in void in the keel, not actual tank to be removed per se.

If I were to move to a CH, how should I deal with this tank? Just clean it and glass over the top? Some sort of cap? Fill it with something?

Anything I could re-use this space for?

You might want to start a new thread for this question FL. It really doesn't have much to do with composting heads, so you might get better responses if you start fresh with the question.

I've not heard of a holding tank built right into a boat before. Is this standard, or was this a previous owner's smart idea? Or perhaps it was originally a water or diesel tank?

At first blush I'd consider cleaning it up and converting it to storage space, but it really depends on what the tank is like. As I say, you'll probably get more answers from a new thread.

[flightlead404]

Wilco thanks Mike.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

That is, if I still can't dump the waste, I still have a storage requirement.

1) Is it illegal for me to pee over the transom? AFAICT its not illegal at least in most places. The laws seem to refer to MSDs and emptying tanks but don't directly talk about peeing over the transom. So, if I can pee over the transom, can I empty the urine container overboard similarly?

2) What about dumping the solid waste? If I'm still tied to a pump out station/marina but now with a much smaller holding tank that might be a bucket or a plastic bag in a lazerette, with much more intimate handling of the waste and much higher likelihood of spillage into my locker, that seems a significant disadvantage.

3) HOW do I dump it? Again, if not overboard then I'm still tied to a marina of some sort. Obviously I can't stick a pump out vacuum nozzle into a plastic bag. Stick it in the doggie waste bin? Marina toilet? Regular garbage can? How exactly do you get rid of the stuff?

Surely it can't be illegal to pee into the ocean? (Urine is sterile so there is no problem there)

As far as the poo is concerned what do Mums do with their baby's disposable diaper?

"Mar 15, 2020 — How To Dispose Of Diapers Properly? Dump Diaper Contents Into Toilet. Though nearly every mom skips this step, fecal matter is not supposed to end up in landfills for the reasons outlined above. Wrap Up The Diaper. Place the Diaper in a Sealed Container. Dispose of Your Diaper (If Appropriate) Wash Your Hands.

BUT THEN

increasing popularity of composting toilets, we are hoping to pilot a facility for solid waste from composting loos as part of the London Mooring Strategy but in the meantime liquids go into the Elsan unit and solids should be bagged in a nappy bag and placed in the domestic waste bins.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy...waste-disposal

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by coopec43

increasing popularity of composting toilets, we are hoping to pilot a facility for solid waste from composting loos as part of the London Mooring Strategy but in the meantime liquids go into the Elsan unit and solids should be bagged in a nappy bag and placed in the domestic waste bins.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy...waste-disposal

That's great to hear. I've been waiting for the market to respond to the growing use of these heads. There's really no reason why a designated collection system can't be set up, especially at busy marinas.

This is done for standard marine heads, using pump out facilities. So why not set up a collection station for the dessicated, partially composted material that comes from our heads. It would be a lot easier than the collection system need to accommodate standard marine heads.

[SV Simple Life]

I’m tempted to make my own; looks like it can be done for $120 or so.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by SV Simple Life

I’m tempted to make my own; looks like it can be done for $120 or so.

I will be making my own. I will have a "churner" and drain the urine over the side. Mine will be made of fiberglass with a SS container for the "compost". The seat and lid will be standard(?)

[Mike OReilly]

A few folks here have made their own, at price tags far below the cost of the commercial units. If my boat's head didn't easily fit a standard unit I would definitely build my own.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by SV Simple Life

I’m tempted to make my own; looks like it can be done for $120 or so.

Mine is up to about 15 bucks now but no pictures of new surround yet
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ad-172196.html

[Phantom Jim]

As a caution, draining the urine overboard may not be legal where you are boating. Some provision for urine storage may be necessary.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by Phantom Jim

As a caution, draining the urine overboard may not be legal where you are boating. Some provision for urine storage may be necessary.

I care about the environment as much as anyone else but I don't think discharging urine is any problem at all.

The primary environmental concern with your sewage is not the urine (which is basically sterile) , but the feces.

https://www.boatus.org/study-guide/environment/waste/

But if there were restrictions it would not be hard to divert the urine into a holding container.

In Australia you are allowed to discharge:

Effluent does not produce visible floating solids () nor cause discolouration of the surrounding water. Note: local laws may...

https://www.amsa.gov.au/marine-envir...arge-standards

[chriskilmer]

OMG, not fun doing but one of most satisfying jobs for me ever. Removing waste tubing, macerator, holding tank, head. Extra space!!!! And not sharing head duties with watermaker area. The seasoned sailor came aboard and said my boat smelled noticeably better.

Airhead on backorder. The WC is boat sized (small). However, might have just enough room for a strategically placed standing urinal, diverting into two narrow one gal plastic jugs. Might even be able to make urinal with adjustable “wand” (not sure where this is going), and urinal part behind a sliding door of sorts, so isn't in your business while doing...your business.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by chriskilmer

OMG, not fun doing but one of most satisfying jobs for me ever. Removing waste tubing, macerator, holding tank, head. Extra space!!!! And not sharing head duties with watermaker area. The seasoned sailor came aboard and said my boat smelled noticeably better.

Airhead on backorder. The WC is boat sized (small). However, might have just enough room for a strategically placed standing urinal, diverting into two narrow one gal plastic jugs. Might even be able to make urinal with adjustable “wand” (not sure where this is going), and urinal part behind a sliding door of sorts, so isn't in your business while doing...your business.

Use a 1 gallon milk jug just like the C head for urine and a transmission funnel . You will also want a ping pong ball from the dollar store. Works great sorry no pictures of mine.