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Old 07-10-2017, 12:43   #16
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

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Originally Posted by alansmith View Post
A lot of good advice already given. I have been working on my boat for the last 5 months. So, I want to add something a little different...





3. When you are tired. Stop work and call it a day. The shizzle happens when you push too hard. A couple of weeks ago I was grinding fiberglass off of the deck. I was so tired I could barely move. I am 66. I started to clean up the mess and had put many of the tools away and moved them to the side walk. My eye caught an area that I had thought I had finished. I debated for a few seconds whether I should do it the next day or now. Knowing myself and the swiss cheese for a brain I have....I said do it now...you ain't gonna remember shizzle by tomorrow. It was a small spot in a difficult area. I got the respirator back on, the grinder attached to the cord, but my leather gloves were on the sidewalk. Okay, it is small spot and only 20 seconds to do it. Not worth climbing down. 8 seconds latter I had grooved a notch into my left index finger. It still hurts when I bump it. Flap discs on a grinder .....how stupid can you be without a leather glove?

Best advice yet. Stop when you're tired. You'll make fewer mistakes, be safer, and won't need as much ibuprofen.
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:49   #17
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

I Totally agree that the greatest danger comes from becoming over tired.
when possible I always have my friend play the role of safety officer. to call for help IF anything happens, She calls a halt when she observes over-tiredness.

Since the greatest cause of exhaustion is too many trips up and down the Ladder we start off when possible by having one of us on the ground and the other on the deck and haul everything up or down on a rope. for heavy items I have built a gantry out of heavy timber with a chain block mounted on a rolling block.

I Learnt long ago to plan specific tasks to achieve, and stay with that program, That way as already mentioned, you can go through a scenario list in your mind and thus make sure you haul everything you need up before you start,

but most important of all remember that you can always go below, take the dirty outer clothes off and lay down in the bunk for half an hour or so, if the task has ergonomic challenges do this more often.

remember to save some energy for the clean up or have some help come by for that. because that is the point where accidents are most likely to happen.
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Old 07-10-2017, 13:03   #18
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Outstanding suggestions all. I've not only learned some new things but recognized some of my own unintended risk factors as well.

I'll let this thread collect more responses for a bit. I will eventually compile these suggestions into a "Checklist" which isn't a nanny state (you do what you feel is best) but rather an asset to look at beforehand for those who want to.
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Old 07-10-2017, 14:55   #19
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Build some good steps with a platform. One hand for yourself, one hand for the boat when moving. Move slowly.
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Old 07-10-2017, 15:06   #20
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

lots of good stuff here for the DIY crowd
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Old 07-10-2017, 15:12   #21
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Thanks for starting this discussion. Our boat is on the hard for the next month or two. You all has reminded me of things that I should ( and will) be doing to make it all a bit safer!

Regards,
Richard.
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Old 07-10-2017, 15:39   #22
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Since we are talking about safety during boat repairs I want to add a few other things that I have found to be true:

1. Gloves are designed with purposes in mind. Keep in mind that depending what type of job you are performing will determine what type of glove to use. For example, using a scraper doesn't require a heavy glove because there are no moving parts. Going without a glove is just stupid for me. I will find any splinter within a one meter radius of my scrapping area if I don't have a glove on. I will bash my fingers on bolt heads or jam my knuckles into any local piece of hardware or stanchion if I slip with the scrapper.

Did you know that an angle grinder with a flap disc of 80 grit will go through a standard cloth (mechanic or carpenter) type of glove faster than grass through a Canadian Goose. It literally will bite you before you even have time to react.
NEVER USE CLOTH GLOVES WITH HIGH SPEED WHEELS.

I am so stupid that it took me twice being bitten to swear them off. If you need to get things down to the skinny in a hurry...flap discs.

2. Orbital sanders....there are the cheap ones like Chicago Freight that can be had all day long for under 80 bucks. Then there are the ones that cost 300 plus like a good Festool or a good Makita. I have a plywood boat that I took all the beat up fiberglass and paint off. If you have ever been on a powerful sander more than a couple of hours you will understand what a "Balanced" versus cheaply balanced sander can do to your shoulders, arms, and hands. Either borrow or buy a good quality orbital. It is worth every penny. The cheap ones will wear you out. You will try to keep going and that can create problems with work quality and accidents.

BTW...if you have a decent size job buy your abrasives on line. The marinas will charge you your left testicle...or right depending which one you favor the most. Amazon, E bay, on line providers....can get holed discs for as little as 30 cents a pop. The marina might charge you 2 dollars for a disc....I am not joking. That can cause you to fall off the scaffolding when your bung hole puckers up. Your wife looks at the receipt and pushes you over the rail.

Well enough dribble for one post....sorry mates...I want you to feel my pain...he he he..
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Old 08-10-2017, 05:16   #23
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Good and bad. I borrowed these steps from a client. Good thing he doesn't need it as I have had it for a couple years. The second pic was a not so good way of doing it. In any case make sure any ladder is tied off. I have a titanium radius head from a fall of 2 ft and a big heavy wooden ladder sweeping my elbow.
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Old 08-10-2017, 05:59   #24
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Please disregard ALL of the information in this thread regarding harnesses and falls. The OSHA guy would faint and any experienced climber would assure you that you are MUCH better off landing on level ground from 10 feet than being caught by either a chest harness or non-stretch tether or halyard.

Using a chest harness for fall protection is extremely dangerous advice. This has been proven many times in industry. It is forbiden and they are no longer manufactured for either construction or climbing use (except in combination with a seat harness).

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but there is no room for ambiguity in this. I dare any of you to take even a 2-foot fall on a chest harness (actually, don't--I don't want you hurt). A 10-foot fall with little shock absorption would probably (based on industry experience) result in puncture lungs and spinal injuries. A fall to level ground would probably result in only sprains or a broken collar bone, and very likely nothing more than soreness. I have seen this done a number of times, and none were seriously injured.

Do be careful. Move as though you were sailing off-shore, and treat the rail as if it were a 1000-foot cliff. If you use a rope, it must keep you from reaching the edge. A halyard could work if it did not permit your chest to pass deck level, but since the distance from the masthead to deck varies, this is not practical most of the time.

I did try Exit Only's halyard idea once. The halyard whipped around and tangled in the spreaders, greatly increasing the risk of falls. I'm sure this depends on the rigging. A conventional jackline system, mounted well inboard and terminated well aft of the front crossbar, on cat, is far safer. Also consider what would happen on a monohull if you went over attached to a halyard. They would have to tack to get you back to the boat, and the process would be violent.

And never, never use a chest harness for fall protection. This is potentially fatal advice.
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Old 08-10-2017, 11:54   #25
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Very good comment on harness use. Not 'any' harness will do and not any method of clipping in.

Properly set up the harness does not let you go overboard though. At sea or in jackstands.

So much as it is 100% true what you say about dangers of a short freefall while clipped in, the point is to avoid any freefall in the first place.

I see all workers on scaffoldings in our town clipped in. Guess then they are using specially designed harnesses.

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Old 08-10-2017, 15:25   #26
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

I have a 14ft drop to the concrete & don't use a harness. I move very carefully. If I did use a harness I would use a jack line running from bow to the cockpit and attach the harness to that.
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Old 09-10-2017, 00:27   #27
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

I understand your comments About harnesses. One thing though... u are assuming that people fall flat to a flat surface. Guys are killed all the time falling from step ladders onto their head and getting killed. So, damed if you do and damned if u don't.
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Old 09-10-2017, 17:54   #28
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Over the years, we've seen a lot of injuries to others by falling in boat yards. Borrowed a car and took a guy to the ER, once.

What has been written so far, especially with regard to the self discipline to quit when you know you're getting too tired (like reefing, when you first notice!), and keeping mindfulness are really key. And biting the bullet and paying for the extra layday, and messing up the marina's haulout schedule, to boot. There are lots of possible excuses for not stopping, and in some ways, it's easier to push yourself. You may get away with it; or you could wind up broken on the hard.

When that happens, suddenly you start finding legislation that keeps us from working on our own boats. So, not only does quitting when tired benefit you, by extension, it benefits all the other DIY folks, too.

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Old 09-10-2017, 18:21   #29
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

So much of the advice so far is relative to falling off the boat. We've seen more injuries from folks walking into things than falling off things. A friend ripped her face terribly when s he walked into the corner of a scaffold plank. i myself have repeatedly run my head into our old boat's wind vane rudder... just at forehead level. (an aside: I used to position a empty drum under the rudder to keep me away, but "helpful" yard workers kept moving it, saying it was a hazard.) And moving about under the boat when painting, I'd run into parts of the car or the braces... and I'm not the only one!

Some of those incidents were aided by wearing a billed cap, where the bill obscures all vision above eye level. The good news is the cap lessens the severity of the blow when you encounter something!

Anyhow, everyone be careful and survive to sail again!

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Old 09-10-2017, 19:22   #30
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Re: Boat yard: SAFETY in jack stands

Jim just reminded me. Wear a hard hat!
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