Beneteau rebuild turning into a nightmare

[lateral]

Originally Posted by jfyiii

I’m a 65 year old boatless (except for a 14’ catboat) sailor who bought& repaired a custom Bruce Roberts 38’ gaff cutter Spray 30 years ago. Sailed her for 19 years.

I really wish I had tackled something like this in my 20’s. I would have had a set of usable skills early and a boat that would have changed my life.

They may have made mistakes. They are young, that’s how young people learn. I suggest that anyone with skills they could use, not just opinions, reach out and advise them. That is also how young people learn.

Shame on the curmudgeons. You were young and inexperienced once too.

Cheers
John y.

Ditto, and I did it at 53.
If these people are foolish, I am certifiable.

What I considered radical at 25 is oh so mundane now.
The universe doesn't give a toss as to either perspective.
Share the love.

[Talk Story]

I found myself yelling at the TV with the Uma folks .... he appeared to have a high level of skill - or they never showed them figuring out problems and editing like the have mad skills. They were always like, oh, and after consilting several companies, "we decided to rebuild the flux capacitor ourselves ..."only after buying a boat where the keel was falling out.

I guess I would have been fine with it if one of them had grown up in a boatyard or on boats or something other than the average bloke off the street who is now rebuilding stringers.

[coopec43]

Originally Posted by ausnp84

So far in your 23 posts, you’ve blasted a lot of knowledgable, long-term CF members as either being teenagers or grumpy old men. Seems to me you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder, and anyone who doesn’t agree with your glowing reviews of this YT channel, or the whole concept of YT and Patreon, instantly becomes a target for your incessant rants.

Sadly that sort of insane, one-sided badgering and arguing has come to be socially accepted since a certain someone came to power, but actually it really shows you (and him) as being someone to ignore as constructive conversation would be fruitless anyway.

N

+1 (Well said)

[Rob_P]

Originally Posted by jimbunyard

Well, for what it's worth I hope they 'succeed' as well, and hope they repair the boat well enough (better than new) that they don't either produce an-accident-waiting-to-happen or a surprise for someone else down the road, or an unneccessary search and rescue mission...

They don't seem the type to knowingly defraud someone (and caveat emptor besides), but, again, the limited 'construction' sectors of their show have so far not demonstrated that they know what they're doing or that they have an experienced hand guiding them.

Regarding 'funding', the problem isn't just asking for (and being given) 'free' money, but the entire advertising mechanism behind all this (a)social media revenue. Disregarding the documented sociological pathologies being introduced into society (some of which are evident in the subjects' 'content'), the conspicuous consumption these (and the entire advertising ecosystem) advocate for, and indeed, are dependent on, cannot continue. The earth is a finite place.

That you think that "rebuilding a bus into a motorhome" requires "the same skill set" as required for doing the repair (actually should be redesign and repair) illustrates almost as well what you don't seem to realize you don't know as well as saying "The keel drop was because the hull was being distorted by the weight and the grid wasn't sitting flush against the inside of the hull. I suspect, without actually knowing if it's true, that anytime a keel is dropped, damage is going to be part of the equation. If it were me, I'd expect it t happen because NOTHING ever goes according to plan".

The new damage occurred because of the lack of a plan.

Don't know if you include me in this 'badmouthing" clan, but if you do I suggest you define your terms, because accurate, validated, documented criticisms don't fall under that rubric, at least in my book.

[/COLOR]

Great! The next time you show up for Thanksgiving at my house (because you obviously know me as well as my other family members in order to think you're justified in saying any of this) I'll spot you an extra helping of stuffing.

On the other hand, if you're NOT one of those whom I share holiday family meals with, then I suggest you reconsider your ability to accurately divine my skills and abilities (as well as the 2 Evans') which appear to be based solely on minute internet observations on your part rather than real world interactions.

Thanks, just got power back after 'lightning hurricane' Zeta (1 hour 60 - 90 knots easterly, 45 minutes calm, 45 minutes 50-80 knots southwesterly, basically calm 2 hours later)...

Good news.

[RaymondR]

I'd be concerned that the bolts holding the keel on are supported by the same material which tore out to leave that big a hole.

[barnakiel]

Yes. So many ways to skin a cat.


If this business model works for them, if they like creating Youtube content, why not.


I think they were in two minds choosing the demo boat. A Lagoon would have gotten them more clicks and likes - but possibly getting a write off Lagoon in their location was not possible. And creating the content say in BVI would have been just too difficult (epoxy, Internet, heat&humidity in hurricane season, etc.)


I can only wish I had their video making skills. It seems to come so natural to young people. Is one of them a professional media producer perhaps?


barnakiel

[zstine]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

I'd be concerned that the bolts holding the keel on are supported by the same material which tore out to leave that big a hole.

I believe all the keel bolts pass through the tabbing flange on the grid. The torn out hole was the 'skin' of the boat. That said, Beneteau has not been immune from keels falling off.

[coopec43]

This link may have been posted before but anyhow I'll post it again.
Why do keel failures happen and what can we do to prevent it?


https://www.yachtingworld.com/news/k...ng-facts-60006

[DeValency]

Originally Posted by coopec43

This link may have been posted before but anyhow I'll post it again.
Why do keel failures happen and what can we do to prevent it?


https://www.yachtingworld.com/news/k...ng-facts-60006

Still an interesting article. It isn’t, though, that relevant to this case, although the two boats are incidentally Beneteau - the most common modern times sailboat, so like with any product dominating the market by numbers, you can always find more issues to read about - by absolute number, not per 100 produced.

In this case, actually there was no keel failure, not even a boat failure but a past owner (or whoever skippered) failure. First by a severe grounding, second by flimsy repairs that actually covered the visual damage and for the following six years, the owner continued sailing the boat.

I’ve already wrote earlier that the fact the frame could be separated from the hull following the severe grounding, in such a ‘clean’ way is a huge red flag for the building practice here - actually, surprising.

And that’s why, a repair that by all means, is far from being justified financially by regular measures, will create a hull to be by far better and stronger than any identical boat.

[coopec43]

I shouldn't have made my earlier comment on this thread because I came n on page 8 of the thread and hadn't been following their story. I thought they were asking for financial help to fix their their damaged yacht.

People like Dashew, Hiscocks, Beiser, Adlard-Coles and Knox Johnston funded their activities by writing books, finding a publisher who sold the books for them.

These people are producing videos of their efforts, publishing them on YouTube and if people want to pay them for their efforts they can.

If they offer me a sail on their yacht once it is finished I think I'll politely decline!

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by coopec43

I shouldn't have made my earlier comment on this thread because I came n on page 8 of the thread and hadn't been following their story. I thought they were asking for financial help to fix their their damaged yacht.

People like Dashew, Hiscocks, Beiser, Adlard-Coles and Knox Johnston funded their activities by writing books, finding a publisher who sold the books for them.

These people are producing videos of their efforts, publishing them on YouTube and if people want to pay them for their efforts they can.

If they offer me a sail on their yacht once it is finished I think I'll politely decline!

Exactly, and very good of you to set it straight! I’m just following their videos out of minor interest. I haven’t seen them really ask for anything other than clicks and subscriptions which is standard. Anyone can watch for free.

I’d disagree with your last comment. I think instead you should decline a ride on any other beneteau 49, especially with uncertain grounding history, BESIDES this boat.
The Evans are on track to properly glass/tab in the grid which is how these boats would ideally be built if not to a price point

[Blakhomer]

Originally Posted by coopec43

If they offer me a sail on their yacht once it is finished I think I'll politely decline!

Fair to say that won't ever happen.

[coopec43]

[QUOTE =Originally Posted by coopec43 If they offer me a sail on their yacht once it is finished I think I'll politely decline![/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Blakhomer

Fair to say that won't ever happen.

What I meant was that I would never sail on a yacht that was repaired in that fashion. (Sorry for the confusion)

[Supercat568]

Originally Posted by coopec43

[QUOTE =Originally Posted by coopec43 If they offer me a sail on their yacht once it is finished I think I'll politely decline!

What I meant was that I would never sail on a yacht that was repaired in that fashion. (Sorry for the confusion)[/QUOTE]

They're not even close to being finished yet. I doubt they even have a solid plan yet because they're still trying to find the extents of the damage. And, like someone else already said, they're working with Beneteau AND everyone on the internet, so they'll be getting 250k opinions and pieces of advice. Are major grid and keel repairs like this typically unsafe long term? Is that why you commented that you'd decline..because of safety?
There's another sailing couple that are much much better. Sailing Uma. The guy Dan..he does incredible work. He installed an Oceanvolt electric aux power system..it's similar to a cruise ship in that it's a drive mechanism sticking below the boat that can turn 360° (I think?). It looks really nice, he does absolutely professional work, top notch, doesn't get any better. He did however remove parts of the bulkheads, which I don't think was good.
Does anyone know if the bulkheads prevent twist in the hull? I remember when he was removing one of them and he said "it's not like they're structural members" but again...I'm no expert, I don't know.
The last video, the boat was on land and there noticed cracks in front of and behind the keel. He said he hadn't noticed them before. I'm wondering if they were new, caused by the removal of the bulkheads.
The great part of these two is that they actually sail their boat, they rack up the miles!
If you check it out and don't like it don't yell at me!
Does anyone know of other good sailing related content online?
Thank you

[coopec43]

Supercat568

No I wouldn't sail on it because production boats have enough problems keeping their fin keels on anyway without having structural damage.

As far as I am concerned deep draft fin keels are poorly designed. I'm putting the ballast in my yacht right now and I am very pleased I have a long keel yacht.

The facts: surely everybody remembers the keel that some years ago fell off a Bavaria Match 42 and recently all know that an almost new 90ft Oyster lost the keel. Some know about two First 40.7 but less know about a Bavaria 390, a Jeanneau 37, a Vand den Stadt 45, a Sweden yacht 42, a Fast 42 a Maxi 110, a Max Fun 35 or more recently a Comet 45 and some days ago a Davidson 50.
Nor many know that since the mid 80’s more than 75 boats have lost the keel with the loss of 28 lives.

Keels Falling Offby Geoff Van Gorkom Van Gorkom Yacht Desig
https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/w...Off-9-5-13.pdf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmRIrh2hK5U&gl=GB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sU1qTwkDSjo