Beneteau rebuild turning into a nightmare

[Alistair242]

They have a lot of work to do and she will be a nice boat when they are done. Most likely there was some delamination or damage from the grounding around the keel bolts. Back in the 80s I worked for Beneteau and we only sealed the keel join with 5200. I recall that we did have to strengthen that area prior to securing the keel on boats to pass survey for charter in Australia. The European and US boats did not need this done. At that time the only factory was in France.
She looks like a nice boat! Best of luck to them.

[coopec43]

I haven't watched the video as I'm working like a one armed wall-paper hanger at this stage trying to do as much as I can before I have to transport the yacht to the yard. Right mow I'm laying lead ballast into the hull. I thought it would be relatively straight forward but I've been on it two weeks now.

I'm pleased with the way I've packed the "ingots" so far. I've poured resin around the ballast and it will be covered with X5 layers of CSM.

I wouldn't knock anyone who is "having a go" because right from the start that is what I've had to put up with. It is mainly the no-hopers who are most vocal.

As the yacht is nearing completion they don't knock me anymore Apologies if I have shown you a photo of my yacht already.

[Joli]

With the hull damage from removal of the keel the repair just became much more difficult. They may have to remove a large portion of the grid to make effective hull repairs. I don't envy them the project they now have.

As an aside, does Beneteau key the keel with a small sump? Is that what was torn out?

[DeValency]

Originally Posted by Alistair242

They have a lot of work to do and she will be a nice boat when they are done. Most likely there was some delamination or damage from the grounding around the keel bolts. Back in the 80s I worked for Beneteau and we only sealed the keel join with 5200. I recall that we did have to strengthen that area prior to securing the keel on boats to pass survey for charter in Australia. The European and US boats did not need this done. At that time the only factory was in France.
She looks like a nice boat! Best of luck to them.

The Australian approach should rule here and probably with many non damaged boats with a too thin bottom. The Evans should have enough space to enforce the damaged area and beyond the disconnection from the frame, with new structural bonding and additional layers of well compressed (with the frame) fiberglass/Aramid. It has been done before on many boats.

It is a significant tough job but definitely doable by the enthusiastic smart couple.

[sandy stone]

Originally Posted by CarlF

Chaos One was trying to remember the case of the Cheeki Rafiki. A Beni First 40.7 that was lost with all hands (a four man professional crew) in 2014 when the keel fell off.

The official British MAIB accident report should not be read just before going to bed.

https://assets.publishing.service.go...ort_8_2015.pdf

For those too busy to read the entire report, let me just say the conclusion was that the accident was caused by inadequate inspection and repairs to the keel support structure, following possibly more than one hard grounding. This on an extensively chartered race boat intentionally designed near to the limit of existing technology.

[nortonscove]

Originally Posted by grantmc

Assuming that you are correct, and they have little knowledge, then their own repairs to the structural damages will likely have a poor outcome.



What a surprise. In my view, cheap/quick repairs aren't uncommon. Especially so following a bad accident, where the easy option is to cover the damage with some epoxy and paint, with the intent to then sell the boat. That's why prospective buyers should get a survey.

But seriously why even buy a badly damaged boat when,
a/ you've no boat building knowledge, and
b/ you know the boat has serious damage?
I just don't understand the mentality. There are so many perfectly good boats available.
(Unless of course you're expecting to make a fortune from Youtube/Patreon revenue.)

Adventure and pain are simply the same definition by different people.

[TeddyDiver]

Well, now they are working with it might as well make a long keeled out of it Would solve the groundin, grid and bolt problems forever, and room for tankage and stuff..

[LittleWing77]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

I thought this might be a unique modification to permit maneuvers in shallow water like on a scooter or skate board.

Good one, Nick!

[Rob_P]

I've watched since the beginning and some of the comments here (and on their channel) are just badmouthing for the sake of badmouthing.

The pair bought the boat from a salvage auction. They knew it was damaged and would need the grid repaired/rebonded. The damage was more extensive than they were told and they've been chasing the full extent of it so they can fix it. Most salvage places will not allow anyone to bid if they have not personally inspected the boat so I suspect that the pair did that and brought along someone to advise them on what's what during the inspection.

The keel drop was because the hull was being distorted by the weight and the grid wasn't sitting flush against the inside of the hull. I suspect, without actually knowing if it's true, that anytime a keel is dropped, damage is going to be part of the equation. If it were me, I'd expect it t happen because NOTHING ever goes according to plan.

They apparently have a marine architect working or consulting with them for the project.

They have experience in rebuilding a bus into a motorhome so they're not total newbs. This is a bigger project but it's the same skill set.

How they're funding this is irrelevant to the project. Complaining about how they're being handed scads of cash from strangers is BS and probably more than a little bit of jealousy/envy that they can and that whoever is bitching can't figure out to do the same thing. Probably because of personality, few investment capitalists will give money to the grinch.



I hope they succeed. It shows that they can do what they set out to do with documentation to support their claims. More people should make more effort to put something like that on a resume and see where it gets them in life.

[Utahsailor]

We have a second Beneteau 49. The first, a 2007, was destroyed by a delivery captain on the way from Cape Cod to Rhode Island. Luckily for us, it was still the dealer’s. It was towed into the delivery marina and the captain left in a rush (with cases of beer) without saying a word. The next morning the dealers mechanic called me below and showed the cracked grid and a 3 foot diameter delaminated section at the aft end of the keel. When the keel is driven aft and up hard enough to break the grid, there has to be delamination of the hull Fiberglas.

Beneteau was able to insert a new order and we took delivery of our present 49 (a 2008) in September. I am writing this onboard that boat today in Narragansett Bay (hauling next week). It has been an excellent boat for us- coastal cruising from Nova Scotia to the Bahamas while living aboard up to 9 months a year.

I admire the young couple who saved the bulk of their incomes to purchase the boat. They are hard workers who seem to me (an engineer) to be knowledgeable and learn as they go. Some of the comments are so petty- they are people of their generation and behave differently than sad, aging boomers. Who cares if he wears a man-bun. I remember the grief I got for a beard so long ago.

I wish I could have contacted them about my experience with the first boat. The separation of the hull when the keel was dropped was most likely from the damage related delamination and will have to be repaired for a complete fix.

[DeValency]

Originally Posted by Utahsailor

We have a second Beneteau 49.

I admire the young couple who saved the bulk of their incomes to purchase the boat. They are hard workers who seem to me (an engineer) to be knowledgeable and learn as they go. Some of the comments are so petty- they are people of their generation and behave differently than sad, aging boomers. Who cares if he wears a man-bun. I remember the grief I got for a beard so long ago.

I wish I could have contacted them about my experience with the first boat. The separation of the hull when the keel was dropped was most likely from the damage related delamination and will have to be repaired for a complete fix.

Well said! and you can contact them through their Patreon very modest donations page. We should support young enthusiastic and serious (to be) sailors and cruisers - otherwise we may stay with only grumpy boomers around us...

And, I really don’t want to start a whole discussion about “production” boats vs. “hand made” etc. ALL boats are production - the number produced can add a lot in building experience and superior techniques - such as infused pressurised hull and deck molding. And indeed, Beneteau and Jeanneau are very innovative here and the final product is superior to many small scale production at a more affordable price.

Having said that, and while not 100% knowing the exact impact on the project boat here, I would still expect no separation of the frame-hull under any circumstances, as the production technique should end up with a single part of hull/frame in the mold. Marine architects and sailors may argue that the separation adds to the seaworthy of the hull post hard grounding adding flexibility... Not sure Lloyd’s of London boat building specs and guidelines would agree with that.

Back to the Evans case; they now have the unique opportunity to bond the frame to the hull as a single extremely rigid piece and create a stiffer boat - way better than any identical boat in the original condition. Could theoretically get a Lloyd’s certification at the end

[mcon12000]

I'm enjoying their videos. It appears to me that they were aware or if you want to call it enthusiasm + just enough knowledge when they dove into this. Plus you can't assign a value to anything until you understand whats involved. For example I'm far less likely to commit myself to a full rebuild now than I would be at their experience level. Not because I regret the massive amounts of time and energy but more along the lines of I've done this already and my current situation has my enthusiasm focused elsewhere. I've been sidelined just like them from my career due to this thing called covid and the positives are having time with my son. So don't forget that the scale of their project is less daunting when the clock isn't ticking as loud as normal and they're providing all the labor. I work in entertainment and like them it's over till fall of 2021. So my point is anyone with the time and a positive attitude can learn a craft.

Also I've noticed a lot of people complaining about YouTube creators lately. You don't have to watch their channel and some of my favorites are the ones making huge mistakes (not these guys) because it makes me feel better about my moments..lol

[noworkee]

I have enjoyed their videos as well. Seems authentic (sleeping mattresses in the back of the van) so I wish the all the luck. Good for them taking risks if they get that boat back up to snuff.

As it seems like boat prices have gone up recently I still think worst case scenario they can recoup their losses.

[scfoster]

Interesting comments. In case anyone is wondering, they're in New Bedford Massachusetts.
They do have a marine engineer engaged. That being said, not sure I agree with the approach, but I'm not physically there to assess.
The yard crew was not cooperative with the keel drop. They repeatedly asked to have more of the sealant sawed out. We got to see the result.
Have a background with composites, having built the largest all composite helicopter at Boeing.

This is all fixable and kudos to them for sticking with it.

Coincidentally, I purchased a 2001 Beneteau 361 this summer from the exact same salesman through the auction site. Luckily, I was able to find the boat and take a look at it beforehand. Also spoke with the yard supervisor, who had maintained it since the single owner had purchased it. That said, still not for the faint of heart. There is a LOT of risk and the price should reflect it.

I wish them well. Any young blood we can bring into the sailing community is a good thing.

[tsenator]

Originally Posted by grantmc

But seriously why even buy a badly damaged boat when,
a/ you've no boat building knowledge, and
b/ you know the boat has serious damage?
I just don't understand the mentality. There are so many perfectly good boats available.
(Unless of course you're expecting to make a fortune from Youtube/Patreon revenue.)

I think the answer is "They got the boat really cheap" . Don't know ~exactly~ how cheap, but I have the impression that they got the boat for pennies on the dollar.


So I guess the logic goes that if you purchase a boat thats worth $200k in good shape for $30k and invest $70k to "make it right" then you come out way ahead . Though the big issue is it worth the time and aggravation and hard work ? I don't know ? I think the mental stress over months and months trying to fix something this big would be mentally and emotionally exhausting .


But hey, they are young . It will be a hell of an accomplishment if/when they get it done right and they get it back in the water and sailing around the world .



Just MHO .