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Ken Fry · 13-06-2020, 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by StoneCrab

It is expensive, but is it worth it?

No, it's not worth it, any more than a bolt from Evinrude is worth 5 times as much as the same bolt from a good hardware supplier. Having bought epoxy from well-known aviation and marine suppliers over the years, for the last couple decades I have used only Raka products. High quality, consistent, and unusually good customer service.

Raka, Mas, West, System Three, Total... Etc all buy from the big chemical companies and repackage into smaller quantities.

Nicholson58 · 13-06-2020, 11:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by StoneCrab

I'd like to hear from others about their experiences with different brands of epoxy. It seems that West Systems is the default for marine builds and repairs. It is expensive, but is it worth it?

There are many companies out there that just repackage epoxy from the big three. So who has the best epoxy at the lowest price?

Have you ever bought an off brand and wish you hadn't?

For everything I use US Compsites 635 THIN resin.

Epoxy :Â*Epoxy Resins and Hardeners

Excellent wet out, great strength, no blush so no cleaning and sanding between layers. They also have excellent fillers and reinforcements. Lower costs than most.

bottomscraper · 13-06-2020, 14:17

I'm not a big epoxy user and I am surely not a professional. I prefer the easy mix ratios like 1:1 or 2:1. I have not been impressed with the West System pumps. They may be fine for larger quantities but for small amounts (like 1 pump each) I don't think they are very accurate and they leak and make a big mess. So I have been happy using System 3 for the past few years.

Thumbs Up · 13-06-2020, 15:22

I like West systems pumps. I check the accuracy from time to time and are always spot on. If there is an air pocket you have to do micro strokes until the liquid starts to flow.

Chotu · 13-06-2020, 15:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Fry

No, it's not worth it, any more than a bolt from Evinrude is worth 5 times as much as the same bolt from a good hardware supplier. Having bought epoxy from well-known aviation and marine suppliers over the years, for the last couple decades I have used only Raka products. High quality, consistent, and unusually good customer service.

Raka, Mas, West, System Three, Total... Etc all buy from the big chemical companies and repackage into smaller quantities.

This guy knows what he’s talking about. This is exactly how it works.

Thumbs Up · 13-06-2020, 16:01

I thought that Raka, Mas, West, System Three, and Totalboat were the expensive ones. I guess that if you build airplanes that there are brands that cost much more. E-bond is about $40. a gallon from Merritsupply. That is what I used. I did notice some color difference in batches of hardener, I called the manufacturer, they said that it was normal (there was a greenish tinge)

NormanMartin · 16-06-2020, 14:13

We got MAS with our CLC kit and love it. Alcohol clean up is cheap and easy. We use it on our "big" boat for repairs, too.

I can't say the epoxy is good/better/lousy, whatever but I do say the clean up is super convenient!

Reefmagnet · 16-06-2020, 16:05

Cleanup with West Systems can be done, for a greater part, with vinegar. You don't get much cheaper than that!

mgriff2 · 26-02-2021, 10:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by skenn_ie

I was told by a dealer, Gudgeon Bros (West System) are the main researchers with epoxies. Most others are licensed compositions from them.

That's ridiculous. Gudgeon Brothers buys their epoxy from Dow. The majority of research on epoxy and epoxy coatings are done in the Universities. West System epoxy is old school Diglycidyl Ether Bis A resin and TETA/Polyethylenepolyamine based curative. This tech has been around for decades.

Boatguy30 · 26-02-2021, 11:26

WEST certainly has done a lot of marine specific research and experimentation. Certainly more and to a higher standard than other marine epoxy companies. You can use their resin with just about any other companies hardener I have found.

And I would say vinegar sorta cleans up epoxy. You can keep your brushes in it, but need to clean the brush in alcohol or mineral spirits before using again. It’s pretty much impossible to clean a brush fully for reuse with just vinegar. I built my 34’ Cat using probably a 1/2 dozen brushes.

Ramona · 26-02-2021, 12:22

I'm laminating a deck at the moment with a locally made epoxy bought off eBay. For clean up I use methylated spirits. Cleans the brushes well and I soak them between use. The secret is to drill a hole in the handle and support the brush so the bristles are well clear of the bottom and change the metho after about 5 or 6 sessions.
I had a friend drop by yesterday while I was working. He built a catamaran with West systems epoxy and reckons he would never go near it again. Bloom drove him crazy.

The deck is on a plywood flush decked SS34.

**skipmac** · 26-02-2021, 12:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgriff2

That's ridiculous. Gudgeon Brothers buys their epoxy from Dow. The majority of research on epoxy and epoxy coatings are done in the Universities. West System epoxy is old school Diglycidyl Ether Bis A resin and TETA/Polyethylenepolyamine based curative. This tech has been around for decades.

First, Dow epoxies were merged into the Olin Chemicals business in 2015 so no longer Dow.

Also, Olin as well as Hexion (who bought the old Shell Epon line) and others make a very wide range of epoxies. The bog standard, unadorned basic eposy is the DER 331 or Epon 828. The research and value added by the epoxy companies like West, Maas, etc is in the formulation, the additives and modifications they make to the basic epoxy.

Can't say how much research the Gougeon brothers have done specifically compared to anyone else but I do know they have been working on technology and techniques for many years.

skenn_ie · 26-02-2021, 12:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgriff2

That's ridiculous. Gudgeon Brothers buys their epoxy from Dow. The majority of research on epoxy and epoxy coatings are done in the Universities. West System epoxy is old school Diglycidyl Ether Bis A resin and TETA/Polyethylenepolyamine based curative. This tech has been around for decades.

The information that I have is that Gudgeon Bros are mostly an R&D company. Almost all others are manufacturers of their products.

**skipmac** · 26-02-2021, 12:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by skenn_ie

The information that I have is that Gudgeon Bros are mostly an R&D company. Almost all others are manufacturers of their products.

All of these companies could be more correctly called formulators since, to the best of my knowledge, the basic epoxy is actually produced by the big guys like Olin (formerly Dow), Hexion (formerly Shell), Nanya division of Formosa plastics, etc. then West, etc buy the basic stuff and either package as is or mix it with various additives.