Anyone used "non stick" bottom paint.

[Dave_S]

Id like to hear from anyone who has tried it, good or bad, how hard was it to remove if you didn't like it, do you think my plan below would work?

I'm keen to try this, I realise it doesn't have any antifoul properties but I think if it is as slippery as they say, it might work for me.

They claim that growth can't get a fix and comes off easily so my cunning plan.

My catamaran has lift up dagger boards, outboards and rudders, so it has a nice semicircular shape with everything up. I imagine making a floating carpet/mat with plenty of bouyancy from closed cell foam on the back and of scrubbing brushes and soft scrappers attached or embedded facing up (not really scrubbing brushes but it gives you a visual of what I have in mind). And I either drag the mat by hand from bow to stern or feed it while I sail over it and it scrubs the bottom.

[fstbttms]

Typical foul release coatings require very gentle handling when being cleaned. You don’t say what product you plan to use but I foresee trouble brought on by your cleaning method.

[GordMay]

Are you thinking of “non-stick” coatings, such used on cookware?
"TEFLON"® is a registered trade mark of DuPont, for its line of fluorocarbon coatings. These coatings have excellent corrosion protection, non-stick, heat resistance, and low friction characters.
There are three main classifications of types of fluorocarbon coatings: PTFE, FEP, and PFA, with a fourth, that is one of or combination of the three, mixed with various resins. to increase its hardness and wear capabilities.
All “Teflon” coatings must have a bake to sinter or melt flow the coating. The curing, depending on the Teflon®, is usually 350°F to 800°F.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by fstbttms

Typical foul release coatings require very gentle handling when being cleaned. You don’t say what product you plan to use but I foresee trouble brought on by your cleaning method.

I left the brand name open, hopefully to hear from a wider group of people. I like the SeaSpeed VX10 type because it is robust and will withstand scrubbing and will hold up if I dry it out occasionally, I also like that it is more efficient with less drag and a bonus is that it is better for the environment. I was hoping there might be a similar hard product on the market now. The price variation of VX10 when purchased in the US compared to the price in Australia is over 300% with very little support so I have been put off by the cost but would like to try it.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Are you thinking of “non-stick” coatings, such used on cookware?
"TEFLON"® is a registered trade mark of DuPont, for its line of fluorocarbon coatings. These coatings have excellent corrosion protection, non-stick, heat resistance, and low friction characters.
There are three main classifications of types of fluorocarbon coatings: PTFE, FEP, and PFA, with a fourth, that is one of or combination of the three, mixed with various resins. to increase its hardness and wear capabilities.
All “Teflon” coatings must have a bake to sinter or melt flow the coating. The curing, depending on the Teflon®, is usually 350°F to 800°F.

That's the idea, but I hadn't considered Teflon. The SeaSpeed VX10 claim <8 microns finish when applied correctly so similar in that respect. The VX10 feels like glass to the touch (second hand information, I've never seen it in person). In the description of the product they use proprietary names that hint at silicon but silicon is not hard so I'm not sure how it is made up, the name could be a diversion.

Do Teflon claim it for use as a non-stick bottom coat ?

P.S. it is a spray on finish, airless spray gun.

[mjgill1]

I have heard and seen good reports about Magic Antifoul. They are here in the United States. Last I checked, they were exporting only due to our EPA. Apparently they are in the process of getting permission to sell here at home. https://www.magicantifoul.com

[joelhemington]

Originally Posted by Dave_S

That's the idea, but I hadn't considered Teflon. The SeaSpeed VX10 claim <8 microns finish when applied correctly so similar in that respect. The VX10 feels like glass to the touch (second hand information, I've never seen it in person). In the description of the product they use proprietary names that hint at silicon but silicon is not hard so I'm not sure how it is made up, the name could be a diversion.

Do Teflon claim it for use as a non-stick bottom coat ?

P.S. it is a spray on finish, airless spray gun.

This product would seem to be a no brainer for a catamaran as you'll get enough speed going to make it work (as long as you're not sitting on the hook) Delos experimented with a product like this. It was supposed to be good for eight years (which would make it worth the extra cost in my book) Unfortunately Brian shifted to another product after only two years so whether it worked or not, we don't know. Delos is a monohull and won't see the speeds required to really make this kind of product work but I suspect his shifting to something else might of had more to do with a sponsorship deal rather than the old paint not working.

[Cpt Mark]

Originally Posted by joelhemington

This product would seem to be a no brainer for a catamaran as you'll get enough speed going to make it work (as long as you're not sitting on the hook) Delos experimented with a product like this. It was supposed to be good for eight years (which would make it worth the extra cost in my book) Unfortunately Brian shifted to another product after only two years so whether it worked or not, we don't know. Delos is a monohull and won't see the speeds required to really make this kind of product work but I suspect his shifting to something else might of had more to do with a sponsorship deal rather than the old paint not working.

As I remember, Delos shifted because it wasn't working as well as they'd thought. He also stated that after putting it on, they let the boat sit at anchor for 2 or 3 months without ever touching the hull. This was thought to be the cause of the product failure.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by mjgill1

I have heard and seen good reports about Magic Antifoul. They are here in the United States. Last I checked, they were exporting only due to our EPA. Apparently they are in the process of getting permission to sell here at home. https://www.magicantifoul.com

Thanks, I have sent them a message. I'm a bit worried I might not get an answer, they seem to have ignored previous messages from other people for a while.

[johnn33]

Fluoropolymers I think; for 20 plus years past it has been used on merchant ships and warships

Hempel have https://www.hempel.com/en-us/api/Hem...ad/87500/en-GB (was Silic One I believe in UK)

International have https://www.international-marine.com...ersleek-1100sr (Intersleek)

3 years ago here https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...el-198875.html
Like all paints it is continuously improved, although it took some years to produce an effective product for slower yachts with infrequent use. It does need meticulous application. It is not affected by slings in Travelifts.
John

[BlueH2Obound]

Originally Posted by Dave_S

Thanks, I have sent them a message. I'm a bit worried I might not get an answer, they seem to have ignored previous messages from other people for a while.

I've e-mailed Magic Anti-foul twice and called three times over the last 6 months . . . never got to speak to anyone, or got a call back. Not sure they're in business any longer as they don't seem to want to speak with potential customers. Too bad, After Keith's experience on Sailing Zatara, we were interested in trying it. We purchased a boat in Washington State, and were looking at having the bottom done in either Vancouver, BC, or the Sea of Cortez. I wanted to know they'd ship to either one of those locations, or to the US with the understanding it would be applied outside of the US (I was prepared to give yard info, etc), but I never got any responses . . .

[mjgill1]

Originally Posted by Dave_S

Thanks, I have sent them a message. I'm a bit worried I might not get an answer, they seem to have ignored previous messages from other people for a while.

We just finished a bottom job on our boat. We used Petit Vivid which is a hybrid between ablative and hard. More like a hard ablative. It can tolerate being trailered and does not loose its anti fouling ability when on the hard for more than 3 weeks. It's perfect for us since we trailer our 32RK between FL and IA, or wherever else we might decide to go.

[BlueH2Obound]

Many years ago, while in High School, shall we say, "some people I was acquainted with", being delinquents that they were, painted a message on a water tower near our school. The county folks painted over it after a few weeks. Those same acquaintances then, a year after we graduated, painted the water tower again with a logo, border was 36' long and 12' high! Then "they" applied a teflon based "Anti Graffiti" paint to the finished artwork. It was applied using a standard air spray gun, using Scuba tanks to provide the air pressure. The county once again painted over the artwork . . . but every time it rained heavy, the paint would fall off in sheets! This went on for about a year, with the county trying different paints and surface prep to no avail. They're new paint just washed off! Until they finally went up, sand blasted everything down to metal, and started over . . . Sadly, I don't remember the brand or product name. The manufacturer had sent in a 5 gallon sample to a testing lab that we, I mean those acquaintances of mine acquired it from. The lab never tested it, but personally, I think that something like this might work . . . Of course, I'm sure that someone, SOMEWHERE has tried it, and since it's not commercially marketed as bottom paint, it probably didn't work . . . but maybe . . .

Then again maybe it DID work, but competitors quashed it, much like it's rumored a company possibly starting with the letter "T" appears to have done with Magic Antifoul since it would cut into their market share . . .

[Katana1]

Originally Posted by Dave_S

Thanks, I have sent them a message. I'm a bit worried I might not get an answer, they seem to have ignored previous messages from other people for a while.

Hi Dave, Did you get a response from Matt and the team at Magic Antifouling?

We're working with them to grow the Asia Pacific market, so can likely help out getting you and anyone else who's interested, access to the products, just shout out.

SteveR
Katana Marine.

[BlueH2Obound]

Originally Posted by Katana_Marine

Hi Dave, Did you get a response from Matt and the team at Magic Antifouling?

We're working with them to grow the Asia Pacific market, so can likely help out getting you and anyone else who's interested, access to the products, just shout out.

SteveR
Katana Marine.

Steve, it's nice that Magic Antifoul is talking to SOMEONE! From the 5 e-mails, and 6 phone calls (since I started counting, see previous posts from months ago) I have received exactly 0, As in ZERO return phone calls, or e-mails.

Glad to know that Matt and team are speaking to you, but from their complete lack of response to my phone calls, or e-mails, you couldn't prove it by me that they are still even in business, or at least at all interested in ANY type of possible customer service, but what am I, except a potential paying customer!