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Old 21-07-2017, 14:21   #1
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Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Hi all,

Just bought a 1975 Fuji cutter 35, and she is our first boat (yay!). Unfortunately, she has a wet rudder and leaking gudgeon. The wet rudder we think/hope/pray we can deal with but how to start repairing the gudgeon?

I'm new to everything, raring to start but know there's lots to do. Thanks in advance for any helpful advice.
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Old 21-07-2017, 15:37   #2
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Are you using the right term for your problem? Seems like stuffing box might be.
I remember from having an MG, gudgeon is english for wrist pin.
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Old 21-07-2017, 15:51   #3
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Hi Guy,

Thanks, yes I believe so as this is what the surveyor pointed out and those were his terms used. I attached a photo as well to my original post. We have a full keel rudder, and the leak looks to be most serious in the portion where the aft lowest point of keel is bolted to the rudder.
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Old 21-07-2017, 16:18   #4
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Ah, gudgeon "pin" at the bottom of the rudder. Is this leak into the boat or into the rudder?
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Old 21-07-2017, 16:40   #5
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

The rudder is wet, so into the rudder for sure. She was briefly put in water to test sail and check engine, but she is now back on the hard. I've been looking more into it, and I think it's called the rudder shoe. That part is moist with rust colored water. I'm sorry, does that help?
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Old 21-07-2017, 17:14   #6
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

I thought the rudder shoe was on the hull and the rudder shaft was the pin. It's common for the leak to be around the shaft. If the rudder is hollow, cut a hole in the side and pour in some epoxy.
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Old 21-07-2017, 18:17   #7
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Can't see the picture you said you posted. Could you re-post? If we can see it, it won't matter what you call it.
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Old 21-07-2017, 18:33   #8
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Thanks Benz, didn't realize it wasn't showing (may not have done it right). Re-attaching again.
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Old 21-07-2017, 18:37   #9
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

It sounds like what youíre saying is that thereís water both in the core of the rudder, as well as in the keel, non? So the main priority is determining how much water is in things. Meaning how far itís spread out (wicked) within the internals of the rudder & keel. As well as figuring out what the two structures are made of, & how.

In addition to this youíll want to find out how the heel shoe/rudder connection is attached. And odds are youíll want to remove it to check it for damage, & wear. Especially given that youíre seeing a lot of rusty water near it, which means corroded fittings, & or fasteners.

Then, once the degree of damage is ascertained, along with how things are built, & out of what, can some options for fixes be suggested. And not to dishearten you, but for a while, the further you dig into things, literally & figuratively, the more issues/damage youíre going to find. As once salt water finds a way in, it spreads, & is always eating away at things. Almost regardless of the material.

Also, you'll be wanting to inspect the pintles & gudgeons, along with their fasteners, & the holes that they seat into. The latter to ensure that there's not water leaking into any structures around where they're mounted.
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Old 21-07-2017, 18:49   #10
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisscan View Post
Hi all,

Just bought a 1975 Fuji cutter 35, and she is our first boat (yay!). Unfortunately, she has a wet rudder and leaking gudgeon. The wet rudder we think/hope/pray we can deal with but how to start repairing the gudgeon?

I'm new to everything, raring to start but know there's lots to do. Thanks in advance for any helpful advice.
In the photo the rudder is marked "wet" aft of the pin. No one who has not measured the moisture and sounded the rudder can tell you how serious an issue it is without examining it themselves. Why not ask your surveyor ?

The area marked "wet" also has an embedded metal plate that may cause false high moisture readings. Suggest you read Moisture Meter Mythology

PS. That propeller is a mess and you have some serious corrosion there.
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Old 21-07-2017, 20:46   #11
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

I would be following the previous advice from uncivilized there's quite a lot going on there with emphasis on the lower keel rudder shoe/pintel,

I would be removing all the fittings at this stage (especially on the keel side) but rudder as well.

Im surprised your surveyor didn't recommend the removal and inspection and more than likely replacement of all pintels

Cheers Steve (IIMS surveyor)
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Old 22-07-2017, 10:08   #12
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

I'm not familiar with your model boat, but apart from the advice already given about checking out the pins and fittings, this trick may help you with the rudder.
Many years ago I had cold moulded 1/2 toner with a laminated wooden rudder. It was obvious that the wooden "shell" was loose on the shaft and plates. I bought a new grease gun, a cheap one not a Wanner, so it had never seen grease. I drilled into the rudder in several places, screwed in a standard industrial/automotive grease nipple and then pumped in epoxy with the grease gun.
It worked on that boat, and maybe a trick that could help you.
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Old 22-07-2017, 10:21   #13
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

Bluebeard, Pumping with grease gun can be just the ticket. Back in the day we used beef tallow(unsalted fat) in wooden structures. ,keels etc. But that doesn't tell you about damage already done to internal bits of metal or saturated cores which can be nasty if left undetected
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Old 22-07-2017, 11:53   #14
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

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Bluebeard, Pumping with grease gun can be just the ticket. Back in the day we used beef tallow(unsalted fat) in wooden structures. ,keels etc. But that doesn't tell you about damage already done to internal bits of metal or saturated cores which can be nasty if left undetected
Of course, but faced with the problem, the only way of finding out how bad the internals are is to pull the rudder apart. On a forty year old boat? I would have to be convinced that it was about to fail on me before I did that.
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Old 22-07-2017, 15:56   #15
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Re: Advice on repairing leaking gudgeon

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I would be following the previous advice from uncivilized there's quite a lot going on there with emphasis on the lower keel rudder shoe/pintel,

I would be removing all the fittings at this stage (especially on the keel side) but rudder as well.

Im surprised your surveyor didn't recommend the removal and inspection and more than likely replacement of all pintels

Cheers Steve (IIMS surveyor)
Thanks Steve, our surveyor did say she would need further rudder inspection and repair (which we will definitely be doing) but that she is good for coastal cruising. The boat is currently in WA, and we would like to get her down to CA before sail window closes by first week of September then haul her out again to do all the rudder work. Do you think she'll be ok to do so? I understand it'll be difficult since you have no other information on her, but your general opinion is still one coming from an expert.
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