A cure for deck moisture?

[Peregrine1983]

This is brilliant. Well worth the full read. Anyone here tried something like this?

TL;DR - An engineer removed the moisture from his Catalina's deck using a cheapo vacuum pump, butyl, and 3/16" fish tank tubing.

He decreased the pressure in the deck sandwich until the boiling point of the trapped water dropped below ambient temperature and it came out as vapor.

After the moisture was pulled out, he worked his way around the boat pulling the deck to a full vacuum again in sections and injecting epoxy nearby so the sections of core that were wet/rotting drew in the epoxy which then solidified into a lattice of epoxy.

Says it's still solid after 2 years.

This dude needs a Nobel prize.

[Bill O]

Well it's actually 5 yrs later now since they wrote that article. Wonder how it's holding up?

Also in the article, the person used 1/4" hose and aquarium fittings (valves), not 3/16" aquarium hose. Details, details.

If the deck was leaking that much, would like to see someone get the vacuum low enough to pull off a decent amount of water. The soft plastic hoses may also collapse w/that much vacuum.

Also you probably want a trap of some sort to not mess up the vac. pump (which I didn't see in the pic of the pump w/hoses).

If it would really work, I would think many others would have successfully repeated it. Haven't heard of any doing it that technique besides just simply drilling holes and filling w/epoxy or foam.

IMO the urethane foam that reacts w/water has a better chance of working than a hydrophobic epoxy

[Peregrine1983]

Originally Posted by Bill O

the person used 1/4" hose and aquarium fittings (valves), not 3/16" aquarium hose. Details, details.

Nope. If you read the full post, as I suggested, he says, "The secret is small diameter. The standard aquarium tubing is 3/16"ø (not 1/4"ø previously sited) and the wall thickness / diameter ratio is high enough that the wall will provide compression hooping force sufficient to prevent collapse."

[Bill O]

Give it a try and report back your results.

[Cheechako]

He mentions the "plywood core".... Catalina doesn't use Balsa core?
I've done manufacturing work with vacuum pumps and systems. With that tubing, you are not going to pull a real heavy vacuum even if it is small diameter, but maybe with enough time and lower vacuum it still draws pretty well.
What the heck, better than doing nothing I suppose.

I seriously doubt the moisture is gone. It likely helped and pulled quite a bit out and the epoxy injection firmed up voids, but I bet if you cut it apart it's a mess in there.
I certainly could be wrong but likely the remaining core is rotten.

[Peregrine1983]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I seriously doubt the moisture is gone. It likely helped and the injection firmed up voids, but I bet if you cut it apart it's a mess in there.

I'm sure you're right. The moisture is almost definitely not zero - especially after a few years.

However, this still seems a far better option than doing nothing and leaving the moisture in there or tearing up the deck.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

He mentions the "plywood core".... Catalina doesn't use Balsa core?

It might be a mix. My boat has mostly balsa cored decks, but the area closest to the gunwales where the stanchions and cleats mount is plywood.

[Manateeman]

Please research Vacuum infusion. A vacuum pump, lots of tubing, a release film, lots of valves, clear plastic, nice new core material, an apprenticeship under someone who knows... it’s high tech modern boatbuilding.
Try to jury rig it ? Wet core? You think it might work ? Seriously ? Please read the thread about deck delamination sinking a boat.
This is all just so ...amusing? Why not cover the decks with hydraulic cement.
At least it will be anti skid.
Mark and his hysterical manatees

[sailingchiro]

Parts of my deck were wet and soft. I drilled 3/16" holes in the wet/soft spots every 3" on the inside ceiling after pulling off the vinyl. I then ran a dehumidifier constant for several months during non use. You can also shove some cotton rope into the holes to wick the water out. I then used some thinned penetrating epoxy in syringes to "inject" into the holes to harden the deck. The syringes stuck into the holes and held firm while injecting causing "pressurized the holes". Each hole took several syringes full of epoxy. Once a hole was full and pressurized, I put duct tape over it and screwed a wood screw into the hole to seal it. Worked extremely well. Deck is very firm now. Cost was minimal and didn't have to cut out top of deck.

[Manateeman]

Hi I worked for TPI.
No way...no way period...would they ever do anything like this.
Never.
They sent their top repair person to Hawaii to fix a boat by removing all the bad core and re glassing.
If you want to shortcut your own boat, fine but if somewhere down the line...if...something bad happens, just think, you have just published what you have done to this vessel and believe me, a maritime attorney will dig up every fact about you and your boat then they will hire an expert to get on the stand an give his opinion about your repair. That’s a big if. It gets bigger if you ever sell the boat. Surveyors and insurance companies are not all stupid.
Good luck and happy trails to you.
Captain Mark and his boatbuilding manatees

[sailingchiro]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

Hi I worked for TPI.
No way...no way period...would they ever do anything like this.
Never.
They sent their top repair person to Hawaii to fix a boat by removing all the bad core and re glassing.
If you want to shortcut your own boat, fine but if somewhere down the line...if...something bad happens, just think, you have just published what you have done to this vessel and believe me, a maritime attorney will dig up every fact about you and your boat then they will hire an expert to get on the stand an give his opinion about your repair. That’s a big if. It gets bigger if you ever sell the boat. Surveyors and insurance companies are not all stupid.
Good luck and happy trails to you.
Captain Mark and his boatbuilding manatees

Ouch!!!!!, You obviously have some issues. You don't know me and I don't know you. You don't know the situation. The area was soft about a one foot square at the bottom of a hatch on the forward deck. I don't know why you are so upset over a fix that actually worked. The boat was recently painted and the crazing was all repaired, the painter missed this area. So be it, I hope your day turns around. God bless you!

[Manateeman]

Let’s begin with post #1. Peregrine directs us to another forum where a boat owner with wet deck core decides he can save money by inventing a new method to cure wet core and Peregrine describes it as brilliant.
I know of no boatbuilders who would repair wet core in this manner and I’m confident most surveyors and insurance companies would reject it as well.
It mis...uses three items found in infusion boatbuilding...a process found in high tech boats built by very skilled people. In infusion, the core materials are bone dry and every step is engineered and done under controlled conditions.
You added a post with your cure to wet core. I did not call you silly names, nor insult your intelligence. I simply stated the fact that I had worked for TPI, had never seen anything like this used and I detailed the legal downside.
The advice on the forum is read by a large group of boat owners. Note I did not reply with how professional boatbuilders would deal with bad deck core.
You began your post with “areas” not singular...really doesn’t matter. A bad repair is a bad repair and unprofessional work needs to be disclosed upon the sale of the vessel and in some cases, to the insurance company.
You state I’ve got issues. This is an ad hominem attack and against the forum rules...personally I could care less about your opinion of me. I post to provide the perspective of a marine professional and let the readers decide what to do.
My credentials are posted. Unlike Ken, Barbie, and their cat, I don’t have a blog.
Lastly, I’m a so happy god tells you who to bless.
Happy trails to you kimosabi.
Captain Mark and his bristled faced kissable manatee friends

[sailingchiro]

The product used was Git Rot and sold by many different marine suppliers for infusing rotting core such as transoms and keels. I used it in the deck and has made the area of concern solid as a rock. I believe the product saved me alot of time as well as not tearing up my deck in the process. I will definitely do this again if needed. Fortunately my core was completely dry at the time of infusion. I will let the forum decide which way they want to fix their soft balsa core. Tear up or infusion. Your anger is unfounded. People read these forums and respond to these forums for an increase in learning curve. Not to berate others thoughts. It is very offensive and doesn't serve any purpose.

[Manateeman]

You are the only one attacking people. You just didn’t like what I had to say .
You made it personal and continue to do so. Please just stop.
You own a TPI produced boat and all I said was TPI never did any repair like this ever and I don’t think I’ve ever seen it done in any professional shop.
The learning curve you suggest might end up really costly for readers. Let’s say a stancheon fails, someone is hurt or killed. It ends up in litigation. In the discovery phase, any and all repairs will be examined and used for or against the litigants by experts. I have credentials and that is what you need to qualify as a expert witness. And there will be a lot of other experts who will give the same opinion as mine. I’m not angry, I’m trying to get to the facts. The difference between anecdotal advice and professional opinion. I stated exactly that..your boat, fix it with duck tape. I could care less, but a bad repair might cost you a lot more down the line. What I feel is sadness when I see Blogs by Ken, Barbie and the cat or “advice” on how to repair a boat by an amateur using a method not seen in professional boatbuilding. I suggest you search Professional Boatbuilder.
Stick to subjects you have experience in and stop snipping at people who disagree with you. Sincerely. Happy trails to you.
Captain Mark and his Federally Inspected and SOLAS compliant manatees (offgassing permits applied for)

[Nicholson58]

I’m a PE. I thing it’s brilliant application of simple physics. The warmer it is, the less vacuum and the better it works. If you measure humidity in the discharge of the pump you will know when no more is coming out. High wet out epoxy such as US Composite 635 THIN epoxy is economical, low viscosity and very slow cure so plenty of infusion time and great soak out. This will even restore the deck to core bond. You might need to spend some time finding and filling leaks that would prevent pulling sufficient vacuum.