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Old 18-05-2021, 18:36   #1
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Water in hurth gearbox

The transmission spent some time submerged in fresh water on the hard. I pumped out the the milky grey atf/water combo. I topped up with atf. I would like to get the rest of the water out so should I run it for a bit and pump out or just pump it out?

I've placed some paper underneath to see if it is leaking
In my mind if water can get in Atf can get out but maybe that's not how it works.

Thanks
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Old 18-05-2021, 19:50   #2
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Which Hurth? Did you pump out or drained?
I would not even attemp to pump out, let it all out thru the drain, but keep in mind you would need a new crush washer to place the plug back in.
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Old 19-05-2021, 05:18   #3
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

It is the either the hbw 5 or 10 on a universal 5424. I sucked out the oil. Where does one obtain a crush washer?
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Old 19-05-2021, 06:27   #4
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Copper washer . Look in any auto parts store .Metric ones usually foreign cars.
Nice to have new but old copper washers can be flat filed. It’s a soft metal and I’ve reused them...check for the smallest leak with a bit of paper left beneath for a day. ATF is thin.
I’ve never done a flush, run reflush but maybe?
Good luck.
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Old 19-05-2021, 08:07   #5
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

I would rinse it out with diesel.
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Old 19-05-2021, 10:35   #6
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Rinse with WD40 (water displacement 40) or something with an affinity for water like alcohol. Drain and blow out with compresed air if possible. Use a new copper clad sealing washer (FLAP store ) Then light rinse with cheap oil, then final fill with good stuff. Diesel is not miscible with water.
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Old 19-05-2021, 16:19   #7
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

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Originally Posted by Josephcrawl View Post
The transmission spent some time submerged in fresh water on the hard. I pumped out the the milky grey atf/water combo. I topped up with atf. I would like to get the rest of the water out so should I run it for a bit and pump out or just pump it out?

I've placed some paper underneath to see if it is leaking
In my mind if water can get in Atf can get out but maybe that's not how it works.

Thanks
When my oil cooler developed a leak, the transmission filled with seawater but continued to perform flawlessly, much to my surprise when I eventually noticed water pumping out through the dipstick tube. I drained the tranny, bypassed the oil cooler and flushed the system with diesel (cheap) then filled with ATF ran the engine in gear for a half hour, drained it again and refilled it. All good after that.
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Old 19-05-2021, 20:30   #8
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

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Originally Posted by Josephcrawl View Post
It is the either the hbw 5 or 10 on a universal 5424. I sucked out the oil. Where does one obtain a crush washer?
I have a Hurth HBW50, it has a drain plug with a crush washer. Those are only to be used once, and I'll guarantee they will leak if reused, which could cost you mucho dollars.
Not sure what is the the diameter of yours, so when you remove the plug take the washer and plug to a Honda or Toyota parts depot and ask for a replacement. I got mine from Honda, it looks like aluminum, and they cost very little, so get a few for when you do your transmission oil changes.
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Old 19-05-2021, 22:03   #9
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Quote:
Those are only to be used once, and I'll guarantee they will leak if reused, which could cost you mucho dollars.
I do hope that is a double my money back guarantee! Being a non-believer, ya see, I've reused the washer on my HBW100 nearly 30 times now, over a period of 17 years, and it is not leaking so far. Best practice? Likely not. Seems to work just fine? You bet!

Point is, don't be too paranoid if you need to reuse one. Be sure to clean grit off washer, plug and mating surface and torque it adequately... and check for leaks now and then.

If paranoia rules, you can anneal the washer back to original softness by coating it with carbon (from a candle flame or an acetylene torch) and then heating it just till the carbon disappears and then either quenching or letting air cool slowly. Copper is unusual in that both cooling methods accomplish annealing... weird!

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Old 20-05-2021, 09:09   #10
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Maybe eight ways for water to get in?
• shift lever shaft / plate
• fill cap vent
• output shaft seal
• output shaft blind end bearing cap
• input shaft seal
• input shaft blind end bearing cap
• case split margin
• drain plug at bottom.

The output shaft seal is the normal wear-and-tear point.
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Old 20-05-2021, 20:25   #11
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
I do hope that is a double my money back guarantee! Being a non-believer, ya see, I've reused the washer on my HBW100 nearly 30 times now, over a period of 17 years, and it is not leaking so far. Best practice? Likely not. Seems to work just fine? You bet!

Point is, don't be too paranoid if you need to reuse one. Be sure to clean grit off washer, plug and mating surface and torque it adequately... and check for leaks now and then.

If paranoia rules, you can anneal the washer back to original softness by coating it with carbon (from a candle flame or an acetylene torch) and then heating it just till the carbon disappears and then either quenching or letting air cool slowly. Copper is unusual in that both cooling methods accomplish annealing... weird!

Jim
Of course it is double you money guarantee Jim, but guess what, it has just expired!

As with everythig else on our boats, there are things that you shouldn't but you could, you know the trick.
It happened to me twice on two different boats under different circunstances, no paranoia here, so I learned the lesson.
I am glad you have been much luckier, but the important thing is that the best practice is known, and the warning is given.
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Old 20-05-2021, 21:48   #12
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

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Of course it is double you money guarantee Jim, but guess what, it has just expired!

As with everythig else on our boats, there are things that you shouldn't but you could, you know the trick.
It happened to me twice on two different boats under different circunstances, no paranoia here, so I learned the lesson.
I am glad you have been much luckier, but the important thing is that the best practice is known, and the warning is given.

And don't overtorque. The tranny case is aluminum and the plug on my HBW10 only has about three threads on it. Overtightening to stop a slow leak (probably caused by my failure to replace the copper washer ) resulted in the threads stripping and a permanent leak. I ended up having to epoxy the plug back in permanently and now have to pump the ATF instead of draining it. FWiW, I talked to a marine diesel mechanic about it and he said they always pump the oil out rather than drain it just so they dont have to deal with the leaking plug issue.
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Old 21-05-2021, 04:57   #13
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Now if I could just get that damn drain plug out. It is a real tight fit under there and the plug was tightened by a gorilla.

I sucked it out again and added another .55 liters of ATF. Another question can I leave the hurth in neutral under sail or is it one to be left in gear?
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Old 21-05-2021, 05:03   #14
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

Just to dampen down the fear of crush washers, I have 1500 hours on my Hurth box, I change the oil every 100 hrs when I change my engine oil. I am still using the original drain plug washer! No leaks.
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Old 23-05-2021, 10:27   #15
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Re: Water in hurth gearbox

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Another question can I leave the hurth in neutral under sail or is it one to be left in gear?
I referred to universal m30 manual and they say neutral and sailing is fine
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