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Old 29-11-2024, 09:14   #16
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

Your Universal 5411 should already have a water pump, which will be your coolant circulation pump, and a thermostat housing. Is this not correct?

Your Universal 5411 should also have a rubber impeller seawater pump, a variable speed pump which varies with the motor speed. Is this not correct?

At this point, it's just changing/splicing/re-routing hoses and plumbing; no new pump is required, especially not a constant velocity electric pump.

I had a (new-to-me) customer 15 years or so ago that bought a "new to the them" sailboat equipped with a Johnson Saildrive. Unique, and a head of it's time; it was a Johnson 25 power head mated to a collar in the hull and a saildrive foot outside. Downside of the design was corrosion on the foot AND the engineering genius that placed the flexible impeller under the powerhead above the collar (not on the foot as a traditional outboard). This necessitated lifting the powerhead annually or somewhat often to replace the impeller.

The prior owner, or the shipyard before us, or both, either tired of this or conspired to defeat the design. They abandoned the impeller in place, fixed a livewell pump (fixed rate) to a thru-hull, and plumbed that to the engine. Worked fine for them for an unknown length of time under their operating parameters (probably quick out of the harbor to sailing, then quick into the harbor to berthing).

Enter new owner(s)/partners who did not even know how to sail! So their first trip became motoring, slowly, along the shoreline drinking wine with their wives, as they got used to the new boat. A few hours of this (diminished exhaust and constant rate water) in due time backed up the wet lift muffler enough (and there had to be a change of engine speed somewhere) to where they backed up the water into the engine and hydrolocked it with seawater.

(SIDE NOTE: the foot had suffered such corrosion under prior administration and maintenance parameters that it was basically built out of bondo, would not hold oil, and so the shipyard filled it with grease. It was enough of an intriguing anomoly that I actually kept it around about 11 years before throwing it away; but I still have the powerhead)

Removing the spark plugs and spitting the water out, it then again ran fine. Ultimately the new owner partnership had us remove this frankenstein contraption (powerhead parts were still abundant; but the lower unit/foot and the collar through the hull were unserviceable and had a large rubber bellows that was deteriorating and irreplaceable (within their budget); glass over the hole in the hull, and mount an outboard on the stern.

Moral of the story: volume of seawater is related to volume of exhaust. Volume of exhaust is proportional to engine speed. Thus, volume of seawater must be proportional to engine speed. Sure you can engineer lots of ways around it, but why? You're only making it harder and more complex. Keep your seawater pump, keep the circulation pump, and put a heat exchanger somewhere in between.
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Old 29-11-2024, 09:50   #17
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

As other have said raw water pump directly after strainer. Have done this a few times on MD2 Volvos. Make sure your Heat Exchanger is big enough. Sendure makes good units. Use a remote mount heat exchanger. A 12 V constant speed circulator like from a Benz, Audi etc will work fine. Drill a 1/8" hole in the thermostat plate so you don't get air bubbles in the fresh water side. You really don't need a variable speed for the fresh side but can if you wish. 2T-15-2P would be my choice for the heat exchanger. Mount it just above the highest point of the engine. You could also put a bleeder or pipe plug on the thermostat housing cover to aid in air bubble removal. Or vacuum fill the system.

If you have a water heater make sure you understand how the cooling system flows and you may have to put a restrictor in line on one of the water heater exchanger lines.
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Old 29-11-2024, 10:42   #18
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BayouSailing View Post
Your Universal 5411 should already have a water pump, which will be your coolant circulation pump, and a thermostat housing. Is this not correct?

Your Universal 5411 should also have a rubber impeller seawater pump, a variable speed pump which varies with the motor speed. Is this not correct?

At this point, it's just changing/splicing/re-routing hoses and plumbing; no new pump is required, especially not a constant velocity electric pump.

I had a (new-to-me) customer 15 years or so ago that bought a "new to the them" sailboat equipped with a Johnson Saildrive. Unique, and a head of it's time; it was a Johnson 25 power head mated to a collar in the hull and a saildrive foot outside. Downside of the design was corrosion on the foot AND the engineering genius that placed the flexible impeller under the powerhead above the collar (not on the foot as a traditional outboard). This necessitated lifting the powerhead annually or somewhat often to replace the impeller.

The prior owner, or the shipyard before us, or both, either tired of this or conspired to defeat the design. They abandoned the impeller in place, fixed a livewell pump (fixed rate) to a thru-hull, and plumbed that to the engine. Worked fine for them for an unknown length of time under their operating parameters (probably quick out of the harbor to sailing, then quick into the harbor to berthing).

Enter new owner(s)/partners who did not even know how to sail! So their first trip became motoring, slowly, along the shoreline drinking wine with their wives, as they got used to the new boat. A few hours of this (diminished exhaust and constant rate water) in due time backed up the wet lift muffler enough (and there had to be a change of engine speed somewhere) to where they backed up the water into the engine and hydrolocked it with seawater.

(SIDE NOTE: the foot had suffered such corrosion under prior administration and maintenance parameters that it was basically built out of bondo, would not hold oil, and so the shipyard filled it with grease. It was enough of an intriguing anomoly that I actually kept it around about 11 years before throwing it away; but I still have the powerhead)

Removing the spark plugs and spitting the water out, it then again ran fine. Ultimately the new owner partnership had us remove this frankenstein contraption (powerhead parts were still abundant; but the lower unit/foot and the collar through the hull were unserviceable and had a large rubber bellows that was deteriorating and irreplaceable (within their budget); glass over the hole in the hull, and mount an outboard on the stern.

Moral of the story: volume of seawater is related to volume of exhaust. Volume of exhaust is proportional to engine speed. Thus, volume of seawater must be proportional to engine speed. Sure you can engineer lots of ways around it, but why? You're only making it harder and more complex. Keep your seawater pump, keep the circulation pump, and put a heat exchanger somewhere in between.
To bad your 1500 miles from me I have a couple friends here in Seattle area with good legs and bad powerheads..
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Old 29-11-2024, 11:13   #19
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

pwm rgulation is not required, simply use a pump with the flow to match the job


we have aftermarket external cooler on MD7, 20 years in service, not a single issue, same Bosch small pump since ever (Bosch coolant pump - magnetic drive)


no problem at all


the engine will not explode, the system will work as well as any


true an engine driven pump would be nice, but on many engines there is no two pump option takeoff


b.
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Old 29-11-2024, 13:18   #20
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

If the engine was previously raw water cooled it's best to take the engine out, pop the freeze plugs and clean the sediment out of the cooling passages.
I've converted a couple boats over the years from raw to closed circuit cooling, the engines on those boat had sediment half way up the cooling passages around the cylinders, so cylinder cooling was quite uneven.
Most of that sediment will not come out any other way.
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Old 29-11-2024, 14:09   #21
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

Quote:
Originally Posted by newhaul View Post
To bad your 1500 miles from me I have a couple friends here in Seattle area with good legs and bad powerheads..
I'll ship this powerhead anywhere it needs to go.

When younger, I thought of running a museum. Museums don't pay private school and college tuitions though; so everything is FOR SAIL (Sale).
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Old 29-11-2024, 14:21   #22
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Re: Tell me why my engine will explode (aftermarket freshwater cooling)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BayouSailing View Post
I'll ship this powerhead anywhere it needs to go.

When younger, I thought of running a museum. Museums don't pay private school and college tuitions though; so everything is FOR SAIL (Sale).
I have one for you I have a 1963 wankel ski drive replacement engine brand new .
https://classic-motorcycles.com/our-...rotary-engine/
Not mine I just have one of the engines
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