Shimming Penta 2001 fuel pump

[Midday Gun]

Quick update. I shimmed the pump to the correct depth. Starting is now pretty much instant no longer a problem.

However I can now no longer attain 3,000 rpm, the maximum I can get is 2500, including out of gear. So evidently the numbers don't stack up as well as they should.
My new plan is to slowly shim down the pump until I can get full RPM without hopefully compromising starting too much.

[ulpilot45]

The pump shims dont control rpms thats by the govenor springs and weights the shim sets the beginning of injection

[Midday Gun]

Originally Posted by ulpilot45

The pump shims dont control rpms thats by the govenor springs and weights the shim sets the beginning of injection

Nonetheless, with the fuel pump shimmed at 0.8mm the engine is very hard to start, but when running achieves its rated rpm.

When the fuel pump is shimmed to the spec given on the pump and engine which is 1.9mm the starting is very easy, but it comes around 6-700 rpm short of rated rpm. Plus white smoke.

I assume I need try and find a happy middle

[DougR]

Definitely sounds like the timing is too retarded.....

Couple of comments......

- For some reason I'm suspicious of the readings on the injection pump. It just seems to be too large...is there any way you are misreading that or reading something incorrectly?

- Are you using the "cold start" mechanism when you start the engine? When you engage the cold start function the injection timing is retarded by 8 or 10 degrees to make it easier to start.

- You can use more than one soft shim against another, but you shouldn't use hard shims against one another or against the block or pump. Hard shims against each other or the block or pump body will result in an oil leak.

DougR

[Midday Gun]

Originally Posted by DougR

Definitely sounds like the timing is too retarded.....

Couple of comments......

- For some reason I'm suspicious of the readings on the injection pump. It just seems to be too large...is there any way you are misreading that or reading something incorrectly?

- Are you using the "cold start" mechanism when you start the engine? When you engage the cold start function the injection timing is retarded by 8 or 10 degrees to make it easier to start.

- You can use more than one soft shim against another, but you shouldn't use hard shims against one another or against the block or pump. Hard shims against each other or the block or pump body will result in an oil leak.

DougR

Hi Doug,

Regarding the hard shims, I was informed by Volspec in the UK that it was acceptable to use two hard shims against one another, but not against the pump or the engine block. Like you say I would have thought this would cause leakage, but so far its not been an issue.

Re the pump number, it was a large number 16 embossed onto the pump, and the one had a the 'tick' on the top like so '1' which means it definitely wasn't an 'I'. Other than the serial number on the plate, this is the only number on the pump.

To achieve the thickness I have now, I used 1 x 0.3mm hard shim (that was originally on the pump) and 2 x 0.6mm hard shims, getting me up to 1.5mm.
Finally a 0.15 and a 0.25 soft shim brought it up to 1.9mm.

I'm thinking of removing 1 x 6mm shim to see how that works, getting fed up of stripping the pipes off this engine!

[DougR]

Think back to removing the pump the first time.....if there was 1.9 mm of shims and only the one .3 hard shim there must have been a lot of soft shims....

Could that have been? And was the engine starting and running OK at that time?

If it started and ran well it couldn't have been shimmed to 1.9.......

[Midday Gun]

Originally Posted by DougR

Think back to removing the pump the first time.....if there was 1.9 mm of shims and only the one .3 hard shim there must have been a lot of soft shims....

Could that have been? And was the engine starting and running OK at that time?

If it started and ran well it couldn't have been shimmed to 1.9.......

There was the 0.3mm shim, but the soft shims bore no resemblence to the ones I bought from Volvo, if anything it looked more like some kind of sealant had been used, it was black (the official shims are beige) and of a rubbery consistency, like sikaflex after its cured.

The engine started fine before removal, in summer starting instantly with the cold start, and in winter requiring maybe 10s of cranking.
However it never achieved its rated RPM, it used to max out at around 2500 both in and out of gear, the manual states 3200 as the rated max rpm.

When I initially shimmed it at 0.9mm it was very difficult to start, 2 minutes of using the cold start. Cranking. Using it again. But once warm, starting instantly. It also ran flat out under load at 3100 rpm which seemed correct.

Now its shimmed to 1.9mm the engine is again maxing out at 2500 ish rpm.

[Midday Gun]

Today I removed one of the 0.6mm hard shims.

So in theory my timing would now be a little advanced compared to the correct specification.

The result:
Started instantly using the cold start, so no problems there. In neutral the engine revved to 3200 rpm which is correct. In gear I could only achieve 2500rpm.
However this was on the berth and its possible that at at sea with water moving past the Hull I can achieve full rpm. So I think its inconclusive until I can take the boat out.

[purvisgs]

This problem is a common one. Someone tried to install injector pump/s on Volvo Penta 2001/2002/2003 , 2000 series diesel without lining up the pin on the pump with the slot in the "control rod" (part #42) which results in bending the "link rod" (part #41). The control rod if bent is easily removed and flattened but the link rod is very difficult to figure out, and a replacement is $200/backordered/may not be available, from Volvo.

The diagram of the regulation system "governor" ...I am using can be found here: https://www.marinepartseurope.com/en...-23-11653.aspx
(All of the 2001/2002/2003 models should be very similar).



Hours or days spent disassembling & testing, now finally control rod moves fairly smoothly, but still not running right. My case is one where a previous mechanic gave up on it, so I do not really know if the pumps are shimmed correctly, or how it was initially shimmed.

****The symptoms are the engine starts but after 5-10 seconds revs to 2000rpms and will go higher but not lower. The throttle lever doesn't reduce rpms, even though if the 30mm brass plug in the block is pulled, the throttle lever moving back towards idle does move the control rod back to the correct location. The fuel cutoff lever works to shut down engine but can't be used to reduce rpms.

Also the injector pump shims (used to set the timing) are possibly off, (or unknown) the block is I believe marked 10. One pump possibly 11, another possibly marked 12. also on the pumps I see 451 marked on one & possibly 4 on another. Photos attached below, look at full size and zoom in on last image to see the "451" marking.

Anyone have experience with where on the pumps these markings should be?

New shims are ordered & here in a few days.

So should I be shimming to around 2.1-2.2mm ?? That seems high based on examples in the book... Or maybe 1.4mm ? I currently have 1 old hard shim aprox .9-.9mm (measured) and 2-3 (have tried lots of combinations) soft shims of .2 &.3mm on each pump....



Could my pump timing be way off? The engine runs normally without smoke or bad noises just won't go below 2000rpms, except for just before it is killed with the fuel cutoff lever. Shim/timing issue...or is this more likely a governor/regulator/etc issue?






The repair manual can be downloaded online... and has a brief section on injection pump shims/setting timing but nothing really on the whole governor/regulation system.

This post and also the following one were helpful in understanding the system
penta-2003-cold-start-fuel-enrichment


It would be great if there were a simple modification to get rid of this whole system and use cables, (forget about the cold start advance/procedure)...but I can't see any way to do that either!


Block marking:


Injection pump info plate... at the bottom both pumps marked "UT=58.3 + 0,8" ....if that means anything. both pumps are identical with the same part #



"12" marking on pump:


"11" marking on pump:


small "451" marking on pump..other pump has a very faint 4 in a similar spot:



Anyone care to take a guess as to how these should be shimmed? Any advice & thoughts, or help greatly appreciated!

[purvisgs]

Shimmed it to 21 / 22mm and it smoked white but no longer idle issues. didn't quite feel right and a lot of white smoke especially at higher rpm's.



Shimmed it to 15 / 16mm and it ran much better but still white smoke (less than above) through the rpm range, even when warmed up.



Going to try to burn up the rest of the old diesel & run a can of "liqui moly diesel purge" through it before I try to adjust shims any more or look into the injectors themselves.



Any thoughts still appreciated

[anibalmatera]

Hi. Can you help me with the measurement of this piece? It has been modified and I am unable to run the engine correctly. Thank you. Regards!