Second Filter starves my engine

[Allure2sail]

Hi:
I have the exact same racor but I put a vacuum gage on the outlet side of the filter/water separator. This will tell you if the lift pump is working to hard to pull the fuel through it and send it on it's way. My lift pump is a newer FACET and with a new 10 micron filter it needs 1 inch of vacuum to pull the fuel through the racor. I've read anything over 5" on the gauge means the filter needs changing and the pump is working to hard. Hope this sheds some light on your problem.
Bruce
S/V Allure

[uncle stinkybob]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

As an aircraft mechanic I cut open aircraft oil filters to inspect them, so I have an oil filter cutter. I have cut open Fram automotive and other oil filters, and from the cheap rubber flap oil drain back valve to the glued on cardboard end cap to the many fewer pleats resulting in much less filter media, I now won't put one on a lawnmower.
Napa Gold,Mobil 1, K&N, Fleetguard, Wix etc are very good filters, but Fram is honestly made from very poor quality components

Agreed !00%. Fram has a long rep for failure at the flap and less filtration surface than any other filter. JUNK!

[Allure2sail]

Hi:
Are we talking Fram fuel or oil filters? Have always used Fram oil filters but now you all have raised a flag of concern for me. Is there a better constructed oil filter to use on my diesel. On the diesel fuel filter system I only use the Racor Brand. Curious now about a better oil filter choice.
Bruce
S/V Allure

[a64pilot]

I hate to so do your own due diligence, but in particular the Fram oil filters are of the lowest quality. But search yourself, don't take my word.
There are however very good high quality filters out there, and OEM ones will often vary by manufacturer and are usually not a good buy.
Bobistheoilguy.com used to be a very good source for most things oil related, I assume still is.
But among the best are Mobil 1 and K&N, which I believe are actually the same manufacturer just one has the 1" nut on the bottom for safety wiring like an aircraft filter if you desire.
Napa Gold is excellent as is Fleet guard, Wix and I'm sure others.
It's based on a good sealing oil drainback valve, thick cans, good quality O rings and high quality filter media and lots of it, and good construction.
Especially a Diesel it's more important, as Diesels have a lot of soot in their oil and often run high oil pressures when cold.
Does this equate to longer engine life? Who knows, maybe, but I'm not cheaping out on oil and filters for a tiny little engine that costs as much as an entire automobile to replace, change the oil often is my motto, and use good oil and filters. Every 100 hours for me and if I'm going to spend a long time motoring and may go over the 100, I change early.

[a64pilot]

Here is one, now this guy apparently does not like Fram but it's comical
https://youtu.be/XRRgw4B7R-I

[hpeer]

Well, good news is I don't have but targets for a bit!

[Squanderbucks]

Just going to a larger micron rating make make it seems like things are working but there is no reason to put a larger micron rated filter after in line after the first. If being run in series the second should should be smaller micron diameter IMO. If it doesn't get fuel at all RPM's even when not brand new then a larger lift pump is needed as others have said. But when you have put a weak link in the chain no matter what you do the situation will be compromised and a work around just to accommodate the initial mistake.

Loose the FRAM and start with a better filter. Best to have two that are the same such as two Racor or other quality marine. If need be and for reduced expense when changing out elements use NAPA or WIX or similar cartridges. Then inventory can be easier as well. Then only decision is to whether to run same or different micron filters in-line. If engines have their own 2 micron filters on them the inline ones could be a 30 micron first then a ten or two tens in a row.

I have my genset plumbed to run either in series off my Racor FM1000 that serves the starboard engine or it's own smaller Racor with it's own fuel pick-up pipe. I did have to replace the lift pump on the genset to a larger one because at cruise the OEM one would not compete with the engine when running off the same filter that served the engine.

The Racor is 10 microns and the engine has a canister spin-on at 2 microns.
The Genset has a 2 micron spin-on mounted on it and uses either the shared Racor FM1000 or it's own 10 micron unit.

[Squanderbucks]

Just going to a larger micron rating make make it seems like things are working but there is no reason to put a larger micron rated filter after in line after the first. If being run in series the second should should be smaller micron diameter IMO. If it doesn't get fuel at all RPM's even when not brand new then a larger lift pump is needed as others have said. But when you have put a weak link in the chain no matter what you do the situation will be compromised and a work around just to accommodate the initial mistake.

Loose the FRAM and start with a better filter. Best to have two that are the same such as two Racor or other quality marine. If need be and for reduced expense when changing out elements use NAPA or WIX or similar cartridges. Then inventory can be easier as well. Then only decision is to whether to run same or different micron filters in-line. If engines have their own 2 micron filters on them the inline ones could be a 30 micron first then a ten or two tens in a row.

I have my genset plumbed to run either in series off my Racor FM1000 that serves the starboard engine or it's own smaller Racor with it's own fuel pick-up pipe. I did have to replace the lift pump on the genset to a larger one because at cruise the OEM one would not compete with the engine when running off the same filter that served the engine.

The Racor is 10 microns and the engine has a canister spin-on at 2 microns.
The Genset has a 2 micron spin-on mounted on it and uses either the shared Racor FM1000 or it's own 10 micron unit.

[Squanderbucks]

Just going to a larger micron rating make make it seems like things are working but there is no reason to put a larger micron rated filter after in line after the first. If being run in series the second should should be smaller micron diameter IMO. If it doesn't get fuel at all RPM's even when not brand new then a larger lift pump is needed as others have said. But when you have put a weak link in the chain no matter what you do the situation will be compromised and a work around just to accommodate the initial mistake.

Loose the FRAM and start with a better filter. Best to have two that are the same such as two Racor or other quality marine. If need be and for reduced expense when changing out elements use NAPA or WIX or similar cartridges. Then inventory can be easier as well. Then only decision is to whether to run same or different micron filters in-line. If engines have their own 2 micron filters on them the inline ones could be a 30 micron first then a ten or two tens in a row.

I have my genset plumbed to run either in series off my Racor FM1000 that serves the starboard engine or it's own smaller Racor with it's own fuel pick-up pipe. I did have to replace the lift pump on the genset to a larger one because at cruise the OEM one would not compete with the engine when running off the same filter that served the engine.

The Racor is 10 microns and the engine has a canister spin-on at 2 microns.
The Genset has a 2 micron spin-on mounted on it and uses either the shared Racor FM1000 or it's own 10 micron unit.

[admiralslater]

I use a racor combo separator and fuel filter on my 3gms before the inline . it is five microns . no issue for me but the fuel tanks are gravity feed . I am going to double check the oil filter though ..

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by YPSILANTI

Greetings,
My CAT has two Volvo D2 55HP sail drive 130 motors.

We have an existing filter and water trap in our fuel line close to the engine. We decided to install a second Fram filter and water trap, as an extra precaution. However, the engine dies from fuel starvation with the extra filter fitted. We increased the sizes of the fuel lines without success. When we remove the actual orange filter, and left the filter housing in place. Then it works fine.

Do these engines not have a spin-on secondary fuel filter already installed?

If so, does that mean you now have two fuel/water separators in line (Racor? or whatever, + Fram) plus the spin on?

What filter density does Volvo recommend for their secondary, if there is one?

-Chris

[Cabo Jim]

I had a few 10 micron Raycor filters from the previous owner. I thought I might use them on my Yanmar 4JH4E diesel fuel system, so I asked the Yanmar service rep if it was OK and he said no. The fuel system is designed for 30 micron filters. The reason being that some of the diesel acts to cool the injectors and is then bypassed back to the tank. You might want to check with your Volvo service rep. to be sure.

[a64pilot]

You can use 10 micron filters as your first filter, but they may clog a little sooner.
Reason is ALL of the fuel is filtered to 2 micron, if your final filter is a 2 micron that is, before it gets to the injection pump. There is a little pressure and therefore flow loss each time fuel passes through a filter, if it's a clean filter it's not much, but it does exist.
If you were marginal to begin with, possible adding a filter now takes you out of spec, more likely though it is a filter with a low flow rating.
The Racor 500 specs I think are a .3 PSI drop at 60 gallons per hour flow rate. Now remember due to return fuel, the filter may have much more fuel flowing through it than the engine burns.

[a64pilot]

It's vacuum that you want to watch out for, vacuum is what will damage your lift pump and reduce fuel flow. Not a bad idea to have a vacuum gauge and change filters at or above 7 in of vacuum

[Suijin]

That Racor is not in your engine room (or one of them) is it? Racor filters with red labels (as opposed to blue) do not meet ABYC requirements for flame resistance and should not be installed in engine rooms. Some insurance companies can be pretty picky about that stuff, although ABYC standards may not apply in your neck of the woods.

Regardless, good advice. Pull it out and toss it and install another Racor with a valve that allows you to run or the other.