Oil Filters - consumer vs pro

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by David B

By "major house brand" I take it these are cheap aftermarket filters rather than genuine filters. For me, it is not work the risk - for a filter change per year, I go with the genuine filters.

There is no such thing as a genuine filter.

Yanmar, Cummins, beta etc etc do not make filters.

[marshmat]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

Examples of that happening?

Personally I am yet to hear of an engine coming to grief using after market filters and oil as long as they meet spec and are changed as required.

And by off brand does that mean a brand "you" haven't heard of or is more a brand that looks identical but say a spelling mistake in name, like freetguard?

By "off brand" I mean that if you try to look up the manufacturer, all you find is Amazon and AliExpress listings, and can't trace it back to an actual, real company with a physical presence.



There are plenty of perfectly good aftermarket suppliers for all this stuff. Fram, Wix, Quaker State, etc. In many cases, the OEM's factory actually gets parts from the same supplier as the "aftermarket" brand, just with a special label and a bulk-buy discount.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by marshmat

By "off brand" I mean that if you try to look up the manufacturer, all you find is Amazon and AliExpress listings, and can't trace it back to an actual, real company with a physical presence.



There are plenty of perfectly good aftermarket suppliers for all this stuff. Fram, Wix, Quaker State, etc. In many cases, the OEM's factory actually gets parts from the same supplier as the "aftermarket" brand, just with a special label and a bulk-buy discount.

Thanks for the clarification

I to would not use a no name no info brand but at the moment are more than happy to use cross referenced Ford festiva filters for our Kubota genset from About Us | Micro Auto Filters - Oil & Air Filters
We dont get ashore much and these are easy and cheap on ebay

As yet I have not found a cheaper alternative for filters for our primary 855 Cummins, not one that makes enough difference anyways, so Fleet guard and Donaldson it is.
Buy a few years worth at a time at least saves us on freight.

[bcboomer]

The "house brand" I referred to are labelled "Motomaster".
If you cut one open they have crap for internals. The cheaper Fram filters are just as bad.
I have asked the reps for 2 different auto manufacturers why they allow them to be labelled as meeting OEM requirements and they both said that the corporate lawyers felt it wasn't worth the money to litigate. I suppose it comes down to who decides what the OEM requirement is.
The 2 engines I referred to were both still under warranty from different manufacturers. One covered the replacement and one did not. It came down to whether they were prepared to take the potential bad publicity. How many engines are just wearing faster than they should because they are not actually getting their oil filtered?

The oil I referred to was Castrol GTX. I don't know if it has changed but, back in the 1970's Castrol had no facilities in Canada. The name was licenced out and the product was whatever oil they could buy for the lowest price. They added Castrol's additive. I forget what it was called, but in the shop I worked, in they called it grey paint.

I bought a used E-Type there and was disturbed by the grey gunk on the cams. We were a "Castrol " dealership with their signs all over the place and a large tank of their oil. When I went to change oil the mechanics quickly stopped me from putting in the Castrol and sent me into the furnace room where we kept a few cases of Quaker State. It was saved for "good" customers.
I still had to tear down the engine to clean the sludge out as the oil rings were totally stuck. Apparently there were no detergents in their oil and even 2500 mile oil changes didn't help.
That shop rebuilt lots of low mileage engines, either because the rings were stuck from contamination or because the cylinder walls were washed down from over use of the choke.

Bottom line, I use Napa gold filters (Wix) all the time on any engine that I want to last and I stick with Rotella in my Westerbeke.

A note of caution on the filter listings. When I bought my boat 7 years ago the Baldwin listing for the Westerbeke W46 was wrong. They had the wrong thread. I see it has been corrected now but always check.

[Orion Jim]

Originally Posted by David B

By "major house brand" I take it these are cheap aftermarket filters rather than genuine filters. For me, it is not work the risk - for a filter change per year, I go with the genuine filters.

That’s my philosophy also. I use only OEM components for my engine in the boat and my sports car. Too much money invested in my toys to try to save a buck with aftermarket stuff.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Orion Jim

That’s my philosophy also. I use only OEM components for my engine in the boat and my sports car. Too much money invested in my toys to try to save a buck with aftermarket stuff.

Once again, there is no such thing as a "genuine" filter.

Cummins, Volvo, BMW, Yanmar do not have oil filter factories
They buy them from someone else, get their brand put on them and sell them to you for 2, 3, 4x the price.

"Genuine" Kubota filter to fit our 3 pot genset are $37

Originally Posted by marshmat

There are plenty of perfectly good aftermarket suppliers for all this stuff. Fram, Wix, Quaker State, etc. In many cases, the OEM's factory actually gets parts from the same supplier as the "aftermarket" brand, just with a special label and a bulk-buy discount.

Exactly

[Orion Jim]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

Once again, there is no such thing as a "genuine" filter.

Cummins, Volvo, BMW, Yanmar do not have oil filter factories
They buy them from someone else, get their brand put on them and sell them to you for 2, 3, 4x the price.

"Genuine" Kubota filter to fit our 3 pot genset are $37



Exactly

I feel more comfortable purchasing from the OEM as I have the satisfaction of knowing that the supplier is meeting or exceeding the manufacturers specifications which are routinely verified by the engine manufacturers or by a third party verification entity if the supplier wishes to maintain their status as an OEM part supplier.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Orion Jim

I feel more comfortable purchasing from the OEM as I have the satisfaction of knowing that the supplier is meeting or exceeding the manufacturers specifications which are routinely verified by the engine manufacturers or by a third party verification entity if the supplier wishes to maintain their status as an OEM part supplier.

And do you buy the Yanmar* branded oil as well ?

*insert whatever brand engine/vehicle here

[David B]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

There is no such thing as a genuine filter.

Yanmar, Cummins, beta etc etc do not make filters.

Yes, fully aware of that. They don't make the bolts that hold the engines together either, but they test and ensure that something is worth having before they put their name to it. They don't want any issues with someone coming back saying their brand filter ruined their engine. If it's an after-market filter, its your problem, not theirs.

[torrmundi]

I have autopsied 3 filters in the interests of science (and cruisers). All are, I am told, made by Wix: a ProTec, a Carquest, and a Wix.


The ProTec and the Carquest are remarkably similar, and the Wix is substantially similar. The former have 52 pleats, stamped springs, and simpler rubber valve diaphragms. The Wix had a more expensive coil spring, 44 pleats, gussets in the rubber diaphragm.



From appearances, I can't see justification for buying the more expensive options. Perhaps there are performance differences, but until that is shown publicly, I will make economic choices.

[Compass790]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

I have been using some no name eBay oil filters on my diesel Kia for at least 5 years with no problems yet. I change them every 12 weeks so I am not to worried about quality. Our yachts Yanmar diesel filter only gets changed every year or 100 hours so I use a quality filter for it.
Cheers

I'm a bit stunned about changing oil filters every 12 weeks.
Why do you do that?
I'm assuming here you dont do 10,000km in 12 wks, perhaps wrongly
Just curious.

[acem]

Cummins does make filters. Fleetguard is a division of cummins and is a major filter manufacturer. Thx-Ace