Need A Diesel Mechanic !!

[roverhi]

There are no glow plugs on a Yanmar 3 GM or any of the other engines in the GM series. There are compression releases. Engage the compression releases and rotate the engine through several ignition cycles. It's a 4 stroke so may take three complete revolutions of the engine to go through a compression/igniton cycle for each cylinder. That will evacuate much of the water filling any cylinder if there is any. Close the compression releases and follow GRIT's directions.

Turn the engine with a breaker bar and socket on the Crank pulley not with the starter till you are sure that there is no danger of water lock in any of the cylinders. If one cylinder is much harder to crank through the compression cycle, it either still has water in the cylinder or the other cylinders aren't compressing because the valves are stuck open or something is preventing sealing the cylinder. Squirting WD40 in the intake while turning the engine by hand will displace water in engine and may free up any rust locked parts like valves, etc.























FYI there are no glow plugs on the Yanmar GM series engines. There are compression releases that should be engaged to turn the initial for several ignition cycle revolutions of the engine. That will evacuate much of the water from a flooded cylinder if there are any. Once the engine is turning relatively easily with the compression releases engaged do the steps

[GRIT]

Ps. I should have said for you to empty the oil pan, and add oil now. It would be best not to actuate the starter until you have oil in the pan.

When I said to turn the engine over with the starter while the decomp levers were actuated to release any leftover fluids; I meant that they should be in the position that allows you to easily turn the engine over, meaning that the compression is being released.

Cheers.
Paul.

[Tortuga331]

Originally Posted by GRIT

I am a diesel mechanic, and not just a backyard guy.

You will not harm the engine by turning it slowly by hand. If you can turn it several rotations by hand, you're likely fine as far as fluid in the cylinders.

Do not try to start it with wd40 or any other aid until you've managed to give it at least four full turns. Each turn should feel the same, and there shouldn't be one spot substantially harder than the rest. Each turn will have two spot that will be harder to turn as you're on the compression stroke, but it will feel as a gradual build of pressure, not as if you've hit a wall. If it feels you've hit a wall, then you've likely got liquid in the cylinder. We'll get to that later, if you find you've hit a wall.

I believe you have a compression release on the 3gm30, flip all three levers, and turn it over with the starter (assuming you didn't hit a wall when turning it by hand) for 30 seconds.

If you did hit a wall while turning it over by hand, flip the compression releases, and turn it over by hand for a full eight revolutions, to help expell the fluids. Then turn it over with the starter, while the compression releases are actuated, hopefully expelling the remainder of the fluids.

Assuming you've made 4 full turns (360 degrees times four, not four goes at the bar). Then add oil, and try to start it up. Don't worry about coolant yet, just add oil to the proper level.

If it won't start after 10 seconds of turning it over, you may then try to give it a whiff of wd40. Don't spray it heavily into the intake, you want the mist to go in, not the fluid.

If it starts, let it run for a full minute at idle, and shut it down. Empty the oil, and replace with new (filter too).

Now fill the coolant too, and check closely for leaks, and check the oil for coolant leaks too. If after an hour, there are no leaks, run the engine again for a minute. Shut it down and check the oil for coolant.

If it's ok, then run it until it gets to operating temperature, then shut it down and check the oil again.

Let us know how it went.

It's difficult to explain this to someone who doesn't know, as I may assume you know some things that I think are naturally known by all, but are not. So take your time, and don't rush. Be sure you don't have fluid in the cylinders, that's your main concern. Everything else is gravy.

Cheers.
Paul.

So , I can try to start it for 30 seconds without putting oil in as long as fluids are out of cylinders?
Before I try to fire it up I have to make sure I understand.
Thanks,
Bill

[Tortuga331]

Ok,
Got it, I will refill then try to start it.

[Boatyarddog]

Originally Posted by NYSail

Drain and pickle….. some use mmo (marvel mystery oil) and let sit while you figure things out.

2nd this post, use diesel it's much cheaper.
This is what we did when salvaging a sinking boat.

Drain, all fluids, remove injectors, you must do this to insure all cylinders fill with diesel.
Use the oil fill hole, pour slowly, as sometimes emulsified oil tends to block oil drain holes in the head, give it some time to get to the oil pan, just keep filling till full.

Then just fill it till it shows in the top of the valve cover.
Use your breaker to roll it over slowly, be sure the diesel has filled every cylinder to the top.
Diesel will come out of the injector holes, so please be very careful.
It's can be a bit messy but shouldn't leak out to much.
Put some towels under the engine to catch diesel.

This was the insurance companies requirement for a potential claim.

Sorry for your troubles.
Was it very cold in your area this winter, any obvious signs as to what's happened.
If not, it's going to need a tear down at least to the head gasket level.
Maybe someone else has better idea here.
Boatyarddog

[jmschmidt]

Your crank case was obviously under pressure and full of water, oil, antifreeze and possibly some diesel fuel.

The Yanmar engines I'm familiar do not have glow plugs.

[GRIT]

Fill oil first before trying g to start. It would be best to fill the oilbefore anything else. Empty the old stuff, fill with new, put a new oil filter, and start the process.

Cheers.
Paul.

[waterman46]

I noticed at least two posts recommended pressure testing the heat exchanger, but the very expert advice given by Paul did not. That makes sense to me.
The direct and first effect of a leak in the seawater/freshwater exchanger will be to reduce the coolant quantity as it will gradually be pumped into the exhaust elbow. This will cause engine overheating eventually, even a cracked block if ignored, but OP did not mention any problem with overheating last time engine was run.
Now if you had an engine oil cooler on that Yanmar, a crack there could result in just what the OP saw on the dipstick.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

With water, AF, and oil coming out of your dipstick tube, the problem could be frozen and split internal tubes in the heat exchanger or it could be much more serious like a cracked block.

More concerning is the water and AF in the oil. The oil and cooling passages should be isolated from each other. When they are mixing it is serious. Could be a cracked block or could be a failed head gasket. A bad head gasket is not fatal, if you have a cracked block, then it is time to start looking for a Beta dealer for the repower.

Start by removing the heat exchanger, it is a simple DIY process. Take it to a radiator shop and have it cleaned and tested.

PM me if you would like a copy of the shop manual for your engine.

This is a VERY generous offer. Take him up on it. Shop manuals are wonderful! exploded drawings of everything you need to understand how they go together. A real life saver when you're far from mechanics.

Ann

[TrentePieds]

Torguga331 said: "Any idea of cost of a new Yanmar? I don't know where I go from here."

I wouldn't go Yanmar if you need a new machine. You displace 5 tons so a 20HP machine will be just fine. I would choose a BETA beause it's an industrial Kubota and parts are cheap and ubiquitous. Every tractor mechanic know how to fix a Kubota. Those things have become the "gold standard" these days :-)

A brand new 20HP installed would be about Can$15K which is about US$11.5K. BETA supplies adaptor mounts so the new BETA will be a drop-in job onto your Yanmar mounts. Prop should be about a 16" x 14" RH.

TrentePieds

[GRIT]

Originally Posted by waterman46

I noticed at least two posts recommended pressure testing the heat exchanger, but the very expert advice given by Paul did not. That makes sense to me.
The direct and first effect of a leak in the seawater/freshwater exchanger will be to reduce the coolant quantity as it will gradually be pumped into the exhaust elbow. This will cause engine overheating eventually, even a cracked block if ignored, but OP did not mention any problem with overheating last time engine was run.
Now if you had an engine oil cooler on that Yanmar, a crack there could result in just what the OP saw on the dipstick.

Thanks for the compliment.

You're right; the heat exchanger does not lead to the oilpan. But the oilcooler certainly does.

It's usually much easier to diagnose a leak when the engine is running. My first step, in a case such as this, would be to visually inspect the block and headgasket area. But unless something jumps out at me, I'd see if the engine will run, using the procedure listed above. There are some nuances that aren't listed, but that procedure will be a very good start.

Once the engine is running, or if you try to start it and it's blowing compression out the side of the head, you're on your way to solving the mystery. A headgasket won't usually go due to a freeze cycle, normally it'll be the block, or the head itself. Either way, you'll get coolant in the oil. If you're lucky, it's the head, and a thousand dollars or so, in parts, will get you going again. Much better than removing an entire engine.

Diesel engines last nearly forever, and can be rebuilt to "like new" condition several times. A well taken care of engine should surpass 10,000 hours of operation. A properly rebuilt engine will last the same length of time as a new one.

If the block is not cracked, and the head is cracked, assuming the engine was in good condition to begin with, I'd just replace the head. The bottom end will not have been damaged by the coolant, and you'll likely not have any rust to deal with. The coolant prevents rust, and the oil prevents rust. If you have salt water in there, then yes, check it well with a borescope down the oil scavage ports, or disassemble it and rebuild. If it was fresh water, and it only sat for the winter, I'd bet good money you won't have enough rust to worry about. After all, ice doesn't cause rust, water does.

If you liked the engine to begin with, it probably ran well, and didn't leave smoke behind the boat. If that's so, it's certainly worth working on.

Cheers.
Paul.

[Tortuga331]

Paul,
Thanks for your time to help me get on the right path with this problem.


Now for the UPDATE:
I just got home from working on the boat. I thank all for your kind and helpful posts. I was able to rotate the engine 4 revolutions, it turned easily (with a breaker bar). I actuated the decompression levers. The engine started but ran real rough so I turned it off after 1 minute. The engine was shaking like crazy. I then re-filled it with oil and a new filter. I started the engine again and this time it sounded normal. No violent shaking. After 1 minute I turned off the engine to check for any oil leaks or coolant. All is dry (So far). So I had to leave it and will return tomorrow and really test it and run until it gets hot and see what happens. I don't know if a head gasket is blown or any other damage has occurred . If it starts tomorrow and it runs for 1/2 hour without blowing up, I'm thinking of trying to get it into my slip whis is 200 yds away(right now I am where the crane put me in from last week).
Thank you all once again, you are the best!
Bill
Tortuga lives ( I Think)

[GRIT]

That's great news. I'm very glad to hear you managed to do it on your own, without hiring a mechanic.

You're very welcome to any ad ice I can give.
Please let us know what happens when you get her up to operating temperature. If you can vack into the dock, and tie off both aterns, running the engine in forward is a great way to bring up the temperature. If after half an hour, you still can't find a leak, you may want to run it for longer.

That fluid arrived from somewhere, but if you can run it up to temp for an hour or so, and still find no evidence, then just use it as it is. That leak will show up eventually, or not. In the meanti.e, enjoy your summer.

Please let us know how it turns out

Cheers.
Paul.

[GRIT]

At a guess. When you started the engine, were all three decompression levers disengaged? If one was still up, then you'd have been running on two cylinders. They'll usually disengage on their own, when the engine reaches 700 or 800 RPM, but one may have stuck, which would account for the very rough running.

Let us know how you get on.

Cheers, and congrats on your success in getting it running.

Paul.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

...PM me if you would like a copy of the shop manual for your engine.

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

This is a VERY generous offer. Take him up on it. Shop manuals are wonderful! exploded drawings of everything you need to understand how they go together. A real life saver when you're far from mechanics.
Ann

Indeed, Dave made a very kind offer.

Or you could just goto ➥ https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3618547
Where (3) hot links are given, to free online versions.

Including CF's own Manual Download section:
YANMAR Service Manual: 1GM10(C), 2GM20(F)(C), 3GM30(F)(C), 3HM35(F)(C)
➥ https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...?do=file&id=45