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Old 05-12-2019, 17:18   #166
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Besides, it's nice to have a touch of precious metal on the boat (besides the Harken hardware).Jim
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Old 06-12-2019, 05:16   #167
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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I suspect your problem with the bronze flow is getting the pipe hot enough inside the nipple for the bronze to flow without overheating the nipple. Hard to achieve even heat when the pipe is much heavier wall than the nipple & shielded by it. Maybe you can try "tinning" the pipe first, then heating it & the nipple & sliding it on but I think you risk deforming them at bronze brazing temp. I wouldn't try it but I'd be happy with silver solder.
As you've observed the silver solder flows much more readily but maybe somebody with experience doing both methods will chime in.
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OK, a slip on type connection.

I suspect that the shear strength of the two options (copper and silver based filler rods) would not be far apart but that the better wetting action you have found with the silver solder would result in a far stronger joint overall. I'd favour the silver solder.
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Wottie, I agree with the above opinion. A good silver solder joint in such an application will be quite strong, not terribly prone to fatigue failures and in general be superior to a marginally stronger join with a greater probability of poor execution.

Besides, it's nice to have a touch of precious metal on the boat (besides the Harken hardware).

Jim
In the absence of contrary arguments, I will proceed with using the 15% silver loaded filler rod. I'll do a few more practice joints and then onto the real thing.

The points made above do sound logical to me and I know you all have way more expertise than me in this area. Thanks guys!
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Old 06-12-2019, 20:27   #168
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

You will need to scrupulously clean the inside of the pipe after you have finished the job - even a tiny bit of crap will damage the injector.


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Old 07-12-2019, 03:40   #169
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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You will need to scrupulously clean the inside of the pipe after you have finished the job - even a tiny bit of crap will damage the injector.


Regards,
Richard.
You make a good point and one I have been giving a lot of thought to over the past weeks or so.

Clearly I can clean each end say to 50mm but I have no idea how to clean the middle 950mm apart from pumping diesel though it for a couple of hours (or days).

Currently I am storing the pipe with the inside filled with oil and the ends plugged.

Any suggestions for cleaning the inside of the pipe will be gratefully received!
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Old 07-12-2019, 03:52   #170
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by Wotname View Post
You make a good point and one I have been giving a lot of thought to over the past weeks or so.

Clearly I can clean each end say to 50mm but I have no idea how to clean the middle 950mm apart from pumping diesel though it for a couple of hours (or days).

Currently I am storing the pipe with the inside filled with oil and the ends plugged.

Any suggestions for cleaning the inside of the pipe will be gratefully received!
Acid will do the most thorough job but it's nasty stuff to work with.
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Old 07-12-2019, 03:57   #171
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

Cleaning the pipe is a problem. If you keep the temp as low as practicable when doing the silver soldering you may avoid oxidation and scale formation inside the tube.
If you can get some thin stainless wire , fray the end slightly so the strands are sticking out, insert it into the pipe and then rotate it against the lay with an electric drill it will clean well.
Maybe the "pickle" paste used to de-oxidise stainless after welding may help - i don't know.
Regards,
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Old 07-12-2019, 18:43   #172
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

I'd be tempted to acid bath it & then water blaster thru the pipe then pump a bit of diesel thru it. You could put it on your YSE 8 injector pump, if it fits, for a few squirts. I'd do this after the bending in case anything cracks off inside.
Richards suggestion of the ss. wire on a drill before bending & flushing sounds like a good one. I'll use it myself if I make an injection line.
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Old 09-12-2019, 23:18   #173
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by RaymondR View Post
Acid will do the most thorough job but it's nasty stuff to work with.
Any particular acid you recommend???

I can run some caustic soda though the pipe to remove oils and carbon (I think).

I don't mind nasty stuff, just gotta be careful although I draw the line at fluoroantimonic acid - that's a bridge too far!
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Old 09-12-2019, 23:26   #174
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by boden36 View Post
Cleaning the pipe is a problem. If you keep the temp as low as practicable when doing the silver soldering you may avoid oxidation and scale formation inside the tube.
If you can get some thin stainless wire , fray the end slightly so the strands are sticking out, insert it into the pipe and then rotate it against the lay with an electric drill it will clean well.
Maybe the "pickle" paste used to de-oxidise stainless after welding may help - i don't know.
Regards,
Richard.
High pressure water should remove the silver solder flux residues near the ends (I will be using 602 flux). Along with a 2mm drill bit!

The SS wire cable sounds like a good idea, perhaps some sort fishing trace or whatnot. I'll look around for something with say a 1.5mm diameter (or slightly smaller). That should be able to be pushed all the way though 1 metre of 2mm ID pipe (I think). Then work it back and forth before finally fraying the end to use as a bottle brush.

Thanks for the idea Richard

Maybe chuck some sand blasting medium onto the wire surface first - OK just joking
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Old 10-12-2019, 17:20   #175
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by Wotname View Post
Any particular acid you recommend???

I can run some caustic soda though the pipe to remove oils and carbon (I think).

I don't mind nasty stuff, just gotta be careful although I draw the line at fluoroantimonic acid - that's a bridge too far!
HCl, Spirits of Salts, will do it and it's not particularly nasty if handled properly.

It's easy to find, you can get both the full strength and the 10% cleaning stuff at Bunnings or any other hardware store.

Drop an offcut of tube in it and pick it out with a pair of long nosed pliers to check for how long you need to leave the tubes in to get them clean.
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Old 10-12-2019, 18:38   #176
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by Wotname View Post
Any particular acid you recommend???



I can run some caustic soda though the pipe to remove oils and carbon (I think).



I don't mind nasty stuff, just gotta be careful although I draw the line at fluoroantimonic acid - that's a bridge too far!


I just learned something new and unexpected. Thanks! I used to work with Fluorine and Chlorine gas. And phosphine and arsine. And BF3. And Trimethylaluminum.
fluoroantimonic acid sounds like the same levels of fun in liquid form.
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Old 10-12-2019, 22:47   #177
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by dfelsent View Post
I just learned something new and unexpected. Thanks! I used to work with Fluorine and Chlorine gas. And phosphine and arsine. And BF3. And Trimethylaluminum.
fluoroantimonic acid sounds like the same levels of fun in liquid form.
Wottie, please forgive the drift...

That's a worrisome list of gasses! But I'm curious... the only use for BF3 that I'm aware of is in neutron detectors, and they ain't commonly used in conjunction with those other baddies... so what was the connection?

None of my biz, of course, but I'm incorrigibly curious!

Jim
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Old 11-12-2019, 02:11   #178
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Wottie, please forgive the drift...

That's a worrisome list of gasses! But I'm curious... the only use for BF3 that I'm aware of is in neutron detectors, and they ain't commonly used in conjunction with those other baddies... so what was the connection?

None of my biz, of course, but I'm incorrigibly curious!

Jim
It's a good drift - seez another who is just as curious

So now waiting impatiently for dfelsent to enlighten us - if he is willing...

Mind you, I suspect both of you are way in front of me in this subject!!!
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Old 12-12-2019, 04:55   #179
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Re: Injector HP Fuel Line - How to Make?

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Originally Posted by RaymondR View Post
HCl, Spirits of Salts, will do it and it's not particularly nasty if handled properly.

It's easy to find, you can get both the full strength and the 10% cleaning stuff at Bunnings or any other hardware store.

Drop an offcut of tube in it and pick it out with a pair of long nosed pliers to check for how long you need to leave the tubes in to get them clean.
Thanks RaymondR, I do have some HCl left over from another project so I shall try that first
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