Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-02-2020, 15:25   #136
Registered User
 
Cadence's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 8,675
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Just to chime in on Hans2 and Lepke's posts about he longevity pf and old 671. The deep pan version contained 26 qts of oil.
__________________

Cadence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-02-2020, 17:31   #137
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 96
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence View Post
Just to chime in on Hans2 and Lepke's posts about he longevity pf and old 671. The deep pan version contained 26 qts of oil.
Thaks for that. I never even knew there was a "deep pan".
__________________

GoneDiving is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-02-2020, 17:43   #138
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 96
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizzazz View Post
You have your opinion (“I bet”) and I don’t expect us to be on this forum 30 years from now to see who is right or wrong. All I am saying is that most people believe in a product lifecycle and that is what moves the economy and the world forward. The reason why these old engines (or planes, etc.) are lying around is that they are uneconomical to put back in service.
I think you are right about product cycles. However, how the various companies (and I suppose time periods) deal with this is also part of the discussion. Again, there is a full range from essentially no repairable parts being available making the unit essentially disposable to only full assemblies being available.but no individual parts to any OEM/reman parts being available for decades.

There certainly is a point when units become uneconomic to repair due to level of wear and tear or cost/unavailability of the required parts. Of course there are also times where we may want to take that illogical monetary hit just to complete a wider goal/journey. But to do that the parts need to be available in the first instance.

Thanks.
GoneDiving is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-02-2020, 17:45   #139
Registered User
 
Simi 60's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Australia
Boat: Milkraft 60 ex trawler
Posts: 2,663
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence View Post
Just to chime in on Hans2 and Lepke's posts about he longevity pf and old 671. The deep pan version contained 26 qts of oil.
26 qts = 24.5 L
Our 855 deep pan holds 36 L [9.5 gal]
Gearbox holds a similar ungodly amount.
Simi 60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-02-2020, 18:24   #140
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 31
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Wow this is certainly stirring up some emotion.
Currently full time live aboard floating around Phuket Thailand.
Depreciation is not a factor for me and my boat. Engine and boat 50 years old.
So that premise is irrelevant. The boat is worth what I paid to me only.
My engine is completely rebuildable in my boat which is very important how many new boats can you do that with. Parts readily available or can be easily manufactured. Just dropping a new engine in is not so easy.
Nostalgia is a wonderful thing in the human being but is being driven out by the Capitalist consumerism model which is just putting more money into the coffers of the few very wealthy. Buy buy buy !
My boat and engine came before that when it was built to last a lifetime. Driven by quality not economics. Yep the world has changed so I am a fringe dweller and happy.
I may not be quite as fuel efficient considering the running hours I actually do every year it is an irrelevant number.
I am as mentioned by a previous, I am as bullet proof as you can get I could even hand crank a start if necessary.
1100 rpm 7 knots just ticking over just beautiful cruising that is what it is all about for me.
Iains boatyard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-02-2020, 19:53   #141
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 2
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

I have an old 671 2stroke detroit Keel cooled, it's a tuff long life engine , and took me to the dry tortugas and back and acted like it wanted to just keep on cruising . but when I change engines im going to a cummins, parts are plentiful , and don't leak oil the old Detroit oil leakers may face EPA regs one day.
My friend who is a 30 yr offshore commercial fishermen who has had many defferent engines went to the cummins.
Also a good friend who has had a fleet of shrimpboats for years says that the john deer is by far the best all AROUND engine he has had . good luck hope I have helped
Rocko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-02-2020, 20:57   #142
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 96
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko View Post
I have an old 671 2stroke detroit Keel cooled, it's a tuff long life engine , and took me to the dry tortugas and back and acted like it wanted to just keep on cruising . but when I change engines im going to a cummins, parts are plentiful , and don't leak oil the old Detroit oil leakers may face EPA regs one day.
My friend who is a 30 yr offshore commercial fishermen who has had many defferent engines went to the cummins.
Also a good friend who has had a fleet of shrimpboats for years says that the john deer is by far the best all AROUND engine he has had . good luck hope I have helped
Thanks Rocko. All good information.

As a wild guesstimate how much more fuel do you think you use(d) compared to a similar 4 stroke or newer engine?

My only real word reference point is my old 115hp 2 stroke outboard in a 17footer uses the same fuel as a friend's 300hp 4 stroke in a 23 footer.

Apples and Oranges I know so what fuel penalty do you think you are incurring for the simplicity?
GoneDiving is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-02-2020, 09:45   #143
Junior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 12
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

The owners of Domino rave about their twin John Deere engines, and they have been cruising for about 10 years, in really out-of-the-way places... you may want to add those engines to your list.
DOMINO 20: DOMINO... Powercat with muscle
southatlantic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-03-2020, 07:19   #144
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Gabriola Is. BC
Boat: Marcon Sabre 27'
Posts: 75
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Two stroke diesels (671) burn more fuel than 4 stroke (Cummins, Lehman, Kubota). An old style 4 stroke will be nearly or as fuel efficient as a newer style engine.


Newer, lighter engines that get more power by higher RPM are more likely to have problems, and the noise is higher frequency, for me, harder to live with
gulfislandfred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-03-2020, 08:06   #145
Registered User
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 22,480
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulfislandfred View Post
Two stroke diesels (671) burn more fuel than 4 stroke (Cummins, Lehman, Kubota). An old style 4 stroke will be nearly or as fuel efficient as a newer style engine.


Newer, lighter engines that get more power by higher RPM are more likely to have problems, and the noise is higher frequency, for me, harder to live with
couldn't agree more...
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 29-03-2020, 15:40   #146
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: UK
Boat: Summer Twins 25
Posts: 162
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

I once commissioned a Lister Petter on a Job not a boat but it was at sea, we left that running without a service for an entire year!
That’s over 8000 hours started it up left it doing it’s job, returned a year later still running without issues.
Gave the Engine away and fitted another.
It was offshore Siberia so about as harsh an environment as it’s possible to be in. Servicing was just not feasible, quite frankly at times of the year would be like an artic expedition. The only check in it had was once a month someone would look over the camera via Satellite.
Obviously this was planned but when your talking reliability Lister Petter were the Dogs bullocks.
I think when you talk engines you have to discuss in size ranges.
Like Caterpillar would be the best, in the range they sell but John Deere would make smaller Engines and a Cat would be too big for most boats, like they say “ it’s either a Cat �� or it’s a �� “
I always when I here someone looking for a Crankshaft - always assume it’s a Cummins, but in certain Engine sizes they also probably have an Engine everyone swears by.
Shaneesprit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-03-2020, 01:57   #147
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Dover, Tasmania
Boat: Pugh windstar 54 Van De Stadt 57 aluminiun ketch
Posts: 30
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wotname View Post
IMO...

Show stoppers are

1. Common Rail
2. Turbo
3. Very high hours (unless of course, it's Gardner 6LW / LX)

Although I have owned a few Yanmars, they have all been small i.e. <20hp. I would be hesitant about any medium / big Yanmars (say >60hp) unless low hours (say <2,000) due to high priced spares. Same for Volvo...

Having a Gardner 6LW / LX would forgive a lot of sins anywhere else in the boat. In fact a Gardner 6LW / LX should demand a premium dollar wise and one I would be happy to pay - if only to listen to it purring over
Ive got 2 6lws as well as a 8L3b. I occasionaly start the 8l3b just to listen to her purr over, if ever coming down this way give me a yell and I'll start her up.
south4320 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-03-2020, 02:00   #148
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Dover, Tasmania
Boat: Pugh windstar 54 Van De Stadt 57 aluminiun ketch
Posts: 30
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

Subject to social distancing rules of course
south4320 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-03-2020, 14:33   #149
Certifiable Refitter/Senior Wannbe
 
Wotname's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: C.L.O.D.
Posts: 11,020
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

If/when we both survive the current virus crisis, I'll be down there in a flash

I'm only south4317
__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
Wotname is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-03-2020, 20:02   #150
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Gabriola Is. BC
Boat: Marcon Sabre 27'
Posts: 75
Re: Engines: Old and easy to repair vs New and reliable.

That Petter is a pretty fuel efficient engine, too.
__________________

gulfislandfred is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
engine

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
6 never used 34years old performance sails,are they useable/reliable and how to check CaptainRivet Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 5 14-10-2019 12:19
SSB radio, what are the best ‘cheap’ and easy to install solutions? Any reliable hand Mysticaldive Americas 36 15-10-2018 14:09
Cummins QSM11 engines. Anyone have them? How easy to reach/change the impellers? MV Wanderlust Powered Boats 13 25-08-2017 08:08
Buy a "new" old boat or an "old" old boat?? jimp1234 General Sailing Forum 29 08-01-2016 02:12
Easy access to engines under the beds Jax Multihull Sailboats 10 12-11-2007 20:58

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:46.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.