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Old 23-01-2019, 04:20   #46
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tibor- Puma 38 View Post
by Genset, i mean a small diesel+an alternator which provides high DC voltagecurrent to the battery. As the diesel motor+alternator will be mechanically independent from the traction motor and the propshaft, It counts as a paralell hybrid, i think.
It sounds like a 'Series' hybrid setup to me.
'Parallel' hybrid, as in the title of this thread, is connected mechanically to the prop shaft.
As the definition of parallel electrical, batteries, elec/ mechanical hybrid, or any other parallel arrangements- if one parallel input fails there is still an output. In this case if either one of the elec or diesel motor fails the other can still drive the propshaft and boat.
Series- if either the diesel, gen or elec motor fails you are stopped. Ie if any component in the drive train Series stops the boat stops.
So I may have misunderstood your system but it sound to me like the later?
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Old 23-01-2019, 05:59   #47
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

Yes, You are right and I am wrong in my explanation. It is a paralell hybrid as the electric drive and the genset are not only independent from each other but can also drive the propshaft independently - although i plan to use the diesel direct drive only in emergency.
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Old 23-01-2019, 06:31   #48
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

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Originally Posted by Sailmonkey View Post
You need to tread carefully tensioning a belt against the shaft.

The shaft is supported on one end by the transmission, the other by the cutlass. Adding belt tension can/will adversely effect alignment.

But, if you put a custom built shaft spacer that just so happens to be drive sprocket between the shaft and the gear you’ll eliminate most of the tension worries. Not all, but most.

Some Engineering Advice: (for the parallel system)



(1) The above is partially true. But you also need to add the drive torque tension on the belt under load which adds to the side loading of the shaft. The gear tooth pressure angle also contributes to the side loading (Toothed belt or gears, same effect)


2) Be carfeul using aluminum shafts.Since the stiffness (modulas) is 60% that of Steel (SS or CS) the elastic stability will be affected. Thus rotational stability needs to be checked.


3) Be careful using Aluminum. Aluminum does not have an Endurance Limit like Steels. Given enough stress cycles..........it will crack under low stresses. It will have an estimated design life. Side loading of an aluminm shaft under rotation is the Rotating Bend Specimine Test used to determine fatigue life of materials.
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Old 23-01-2019, 10:09   #49
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tibor- Puma 38 View Post
Yes, You are right and I am wrong in my explanation. It is a paralell hybrid as the electric drive and the genset are not only independent from each other but can also drive the propshaft independently - although i plan to use the diesel direct drive only in emergency.
Honestly, Im still not clear on what youre describing.

My understanding of a Parallel hybrid is they dont usually have a Genset. It would traditionally have a diesel eng connected to the propshaft. It also has an electric motor also connected to the propshaft.

The elec motor is normally powered by a battery bank.

The battery bank is usually charged by the main diesel motor by using the the elec motor as a generator. And/ or a shore charger.

I guess you could use a Genset but that is putting an extra diesel into an already expensive and complicated setup.

A Series Hybrid would have an electric motor connected to the propshaft only. It would also have a huge battery bank and/ or Genset to power the electric motor. Genset is usual as batts dont push a boat far.

But as long as you know what you have is the main thing.
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Old 04-02-2019, 15:35   #50
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

I have a 8mtr catalac and have fitted electric drives, one is a hybrid, using a toothed belt with with the drive cog mounted on the gearbox output shaft.
the system has about 250hrs electric run time atm with no major problems.
The motor acts as a generator when the diesel is running.
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Old 04-02-2019, 16:34   #51
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

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Originally Posted by ajmarshall1001 View Post
I have a 8mtr catalac and have fitted electric drives, one is a hybrid, using a toothed belt with with the drive cog mounted on the gearbox output shaft.
the system has about 250hrs electric run time atm with no major problems.
The motor acts as a generator when the diesel is running.
Sounds really interesting - can you tell us more: what size electric and diesel motor, battery bank, speed you get, etc.?

Did you go with DIY or a manufacturers? I'm not aware of any manufacturers though working on smaller sizes that the Catalac would use I imagine!
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Old 04-02-2019, 16:48   #52
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

details please
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Old 05-02-2019, 14:31   #53
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

I am slowly finding my way around please be patient.
I will put up pictures when I have worked it out.

2 x 5kw Marlin 48v motors from lynch marine based in the uk
12hp kubota self marinized with Beta parts.
12v 175ah alternator fitted to the engine
7.5kwhr bank for the drive
4kwhr house bank
400w solar fitted ATM

Power from the house can be drawn and fed to the drive system using a 2.4kw inverter and 48v power supplies.

speed
3.5kts using 55amps
diesel only 5kts / 6.5k with clean props and hulls
I have used diesel / electric to push against 4.5kts of tide and 30kts of wind to get into sheltered water when myself and crew both seasick, I don't normally use more than 30% of the drive bank (so as not to kill the batteries) and keep the power for if needed, with diesel running motor can be used as a generator to recharge batteries and supply 2nd electric drive.
under sail with motors at idle with a 3.5amp draw this will drop to about 1amp when sail speed reaches 5-6kts. Unfortunately I can't swing props large enough for the motors to regen under sail.

I am hoping to fit enough solar to maintain 1.5 - 2kts on solar only sunny days of course.
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Old 07-01-2021, 13:15   #54
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

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Originally Posted by gmakhs View Post
It wouldn't be easier and simplier if you just add 1 or 2 electric outboards to do the job ???
I am pretty sure you can locate them either on the back of the hulls or the inner side of them or in the middle of the boat .
You can even add only a waterproof electric motor under the hull like the bigger ships have .simpler than messing with belts and pullays


For recreational boats the under hull electric pods have a limited life expectancy when continuously immersed. The seals aren’t prefect and the motor eventually shorts on seepage water.

The azipods on ships have bilge pumps extracting seepage up the pivot stem into the then overboard.

I’ve been discussing this a bit with SeanD who took a boat RTW. He used several trolling motors and my understanding is they all died from water intrusion.
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Old 07-01-2021, 13:30   #55
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

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Originally Posted by gmakhs View Post
I am sorry , Probably I got it wrong

I don't see any point to use both at the same time .


It all depends on what you want to do.

A series hybrid is mechanically much simpler and probably cheaper but at a 15-25% efficiency cost.

With a parallel hybrid both the ICE and electric motor are mechanically links to a prop.

If you want maximum efficiency then you size the ICE to just barely reach hull speed in flat calm conditions. When you throttle back to cruising speed the engine should be near its peak efficiency.

If you need more power than the ICE can deliver because ow adverse wind or seastate you can use the ICE and electric motor at the same time to get that power.

Since the prop is sized for the combined power it is probably oversized for just the ICE and will be more efficient at cruising speed maybe. I’m going to think about that for a bit.

The most efficient system would actually be a parallel hybrid with a controllable pitch prop. Albin Vegas originally came with these.
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Old 07-01-2021, 13:36   #56
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Re: DIY parallel hybrid - anyone done it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tibor- Puma 38 View Post
by Genset, i mean a small diesel+an alternator which provides high DC voltagecurrent to the battery. As the diesel motor+alternator will be mechanically independent from the traction motor and the propshaft, It counts as a paralell hybrid, i think.


If the ICE motor does not connect mechanically to the prop then it is a series hybrid.
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